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Be that as it may, these things are won by whoever crosses the finish line first and China appears to be ahead of the west at this point and especially if curre

Be that as it may, these things are won by whoever crosses the finish line first and China appears to be ahead of the west at this point and especially if current trends continue. Also worth noting that American space exploration achievements were also kickstarted by importing the talent from post-WW2 Germany.

6d6b73 2y ago
"the talent from post-WW2 Germany" is that a new way of saying "Nazi war criminals" like von Braun?
- Dalewyn 2y ago
  There aren't significant differences between a V-2, AIM-120 AMRAAM, Minuteman, Patriot, Tomahawk, Saturn V, Delta IV, Falcon 9, et al.. They are all metal pipes filled with boom powder that can be used to throw things up.
  - 6d6b73 2y ago
    And a microchip is just a bunch of copper wires with sand around them
  - dekhn 2y ago
    One of the differences is that the V-2 was built via slave labor in a massive cave where people were literally worked to death.
  - w0z_ 2y ago
    "There aren't significant differences between a V-2, AIM-120 AMRAAM, Minuteman, Patriot, Tomahawk, Saturn V, Delta IV, Falcon 9, et al.." I didn't think news.ycombinator.com catered to misinformation. I'm guessing your PhD is in Aerospace Engineering?
    - Dalewyn 2y ago
      They are all pointy metal tubes with wings and (an) engine(s), filled with fuel that go boom to make them fly, carrying some sort of payload. Their only difference is to what purpose they are used. Some are used to destroy, some are used to kill, some are used to defend, some are used to throw stuff into space. But they are all pointy metal tubes filled with boom powder.
      - w0z_ 2y ago
        Absolutely insane comment and can't believe this is allowed here.
        Dalewyn 2y ago
        Nearly all modern forms of rocketry trace their roots to German technologies like the V-2, and rockets used for space exploration in particular are direct or spiritual descendents of intercontinental ballistic missiles repurposed for civilian use. There really is no difference to the rockets themselves, they are all varying forms of pointy metal pipes filled with boom powder. The only difference is the payload they carry; whether they are humans or spaceborne vessels like satellites, or explosives of various descriptions with which to destroy and kill. If you disagree, and you've certainly made it clear you do, you can put forth counterarguments instead of claiming quackery.
        defrost 2y ago
        Well, you've almost convinced me. One quick question though, what was the "powder" used on, say, the Apollo missions? I've always heard the Saturn V launch had a J-2 liquid propellant rocket engine that used used liquid oxygen and liquid hydrogen.
        Dalewyn 2y ago
        Obviously I'm saying "boom powder" as a generic and funny term for the various fuels used in rocketry. They can be liquids (RP-1, liquid hydrogen, liquid methane, various hypergolics like UDMH, etc.) or solids (eg: solid rocket boosters, most military missiles and rockets). The Saturn V used RP-1 and liquid oxygen for the first stage, and liquid hydrogen and liquid oxygen for the second and third stages. The Apollo CSM used dinitrogen tetroxide and "Aerozine 50", a 50:50 mix of hydrazine and UDMH hypergolic fuels that was originally used for the Titan II ICBM. Further reading: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturn_V https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturn_V https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_command_and_service_module https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_command_and_service_mod...
JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> worth noting that American space exploration achievements were also kickstarted by importing the talent from post-WW2 Germany China can’t really play this card given what it’s currently doing in Xinjiang/East Turkestan [1]. (And while America was capturing the likes of von Braun and chemical bombing Vietnam, Mao was conducting his own crimes against humanity [2].) The proximate history of every country’s aerospace programme is unfortunately troubled. What matters is what can be done today and by whom. In that, China and America are worthy adversaries. Let’s hope the competition can be kept civil versus militarised. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Uyghurs_in_China https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Uyghurs_in_Ch... [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Leap_Forward https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Leap_Forward

6d6b73 2y ago

"the talent from post-WW2 Germany" is that a new way of saying "Nazi war criminals" like von Braun?

Dalewyn 2y ago
There aren't significant differences between a V-2, AIM-120 AMRAAM, Minuteman, Patriot, Tomahawk, Saturn V, Delta IV, Falcon 9, et al.. They are all metal pipes filled with boom powder that can be used to throw things up.
- 6d6b73 2y ago
  And a microchip is just a bunch of copper wires with sand around them
- dekhn 2y ago
  One of the differences is that the V-2 was built via slave labor in a massive cave where people were literally worked to death.
- w0z_ 2y ago
  "There aren't significant differences between a V-2, AIM-120 AMRAAM, Minuteman, Patriot, Tomahawk, Saturn V, Delta IV, Falcon 9, et al.." I didn't think news.ycombinator.com catered to misinformation. I'm guessing your PhD is in Aerospace Engineering?
  - Dalewyn 2y ago
    They are all pointy metal tubes with wings and (an) engine(s), filled with fuel that go boom to make them fly, carrying some sort of payload. Their only difference is to what purpose they are used. Some are used to destroy, some are used to kill, some are used to defend, some are used to throw stuff into space. But they are all pointy metal tubes filled with boom powder.
    - w0z_ 2y ago
      Absolutely insane comment and can't believe this is allowed here.
      - Dalewyn 2y ago
        Nearly all modern forms of rocketry trace their roots to German technologies like the V-2, and rockets used for space exploration in particular are direct or spiritual descendents of intercontinental ballistic missiles repurposed for civilian use. There really is no difference to the rockets themselves, they are all varying forms of pointy metal pipes filled with boom powder. The only difference is the payload they carry; whether they are humans or spaceborne vessels like satellites, or explosives of various descriptions with which to destroy and kill. If you disagree, and you've certainly made it clear you do, you can put forth counterarguments instead of claiming quackery.
        defrost 2y ago
        Well, you've almost convinced me. One quick question though, what was the "powder" used on, say, the Apollo missions? I've always heard the Saturn V launch had a J-2 liquid propellant rocket engine that used used liquid oxygen and liquid hydrogen.
        Dalewyn 2y ago
        Obviously I'm saying "boom powder" as a generic and funny term for the various fuels used in rocketry. They can be liquids (RP-1, liquid hydrogen, liquid methane, various hypergolics like UDMH, etc.) or solids (eg: solid rocket boosters, most military missiles and rockets). The Saturn V used RP-1 and liquid oxygen for the first stage, and liquid hydrogen and liquid oxygen for the second and third stages. The Apollo CSM used dinitrogen tetroxide and "Aerozine 50", a 50:50 mix of hydrazine and UDMH hypergolic fuels that was originally used for the Titan II ICBM. Further reading: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturn_V https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturn_V https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_command_and_service_module https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_command_and_service_mod...

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

> worth noting that American space exploration achievements were also kickstarted by importing the talent from post-WW2 Germany China can’t really play this card given what it’s currently doing in Xinjiang/East Turkestan [1]. (And while America was capturing the likes of von Braun and chemical bombing Vietnam, Mao was conducting his own crimes against humanity [2].) The proximate history of every country’s aerospace programme is unfortunately troubled. What matters is what can be done today and by whom. In that, China and America are worthy adversaries. Let’s hope the competition can be kept civil versus militarised. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Uyghurs_in_China https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Uyghurs_in_Ch... [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Leap_Forward https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Leap_Forward