4 ms·

YouTube videos are skipping to the end for users with adblockers

31 points by josephcsible 2y ago

grobbyy 2y ago
Google has entered into a phase where short term profits outweigh long term growth. If you're a startup, don't do this. Maximizing the growth exponent does a lot more than tweaks on per-user revenue. Intentionally annoying users is bad business. When companies do this, it's also good to look at PE ratios, since it suggests they don't anticipate growth.
- lkdfjlkdfjlg 2y ago
  > Google has entered into a phase where short term profits outweigh long term growth. I has entered this phase at least 10 years ago.
- pompino 2y ago
  It might well be good for business, but I'm cheering that the slow erosion of trust with Google continues and leads to their demise in a decade or so. The cherry on the cake would be if we can get lawmakers with a backbone to put such companies in check.
- zeruch 2y ago
  "Google has entered into a phase where short term profits outweigh long term growth." Indeed. The question I have is does that mean it goes eventually the way of Microsoft/IBM, or the way of SGI/Computer Associates?
  - grobbyy 2y ago
    I think Yahoo or HP would be the most likely candidates. HP is at about a fifth of it's peak market cap, largely as a result of a similar play. I'd short Google, but there's an old saying that markets can be irrational far longer than an individual wallet can sustain a short....
- banish-m4 2y ago
  They're so generous for creating business opportunities for others.
- ilrwbwrkhv 2y ago
  The classic this is what happens when you put a business school grad in charge of a tech business.
- lern_too_spel 2y ago
  How does encouraging ad blocker usage lead to long term growth?
  - column 2y ago
    bait and switch, you let the users get used to the service without ads and find value then slam the ban hammer to make the whales switch to premium
    - lern_too_spel 2y ago
      How is that bait and switch not in Google's long term best interests?
  - grobbyy 2y ago
    This is a strawman. No one is suggesting Google should encourage anything. Openly user-hostile actions devalue brand and trust. That's doubly-true for power users who are thought leaders. If Walmart has store security shoot suspected shoplifters and unionizers with a 9mm, discontinuing that policy would not be encouraging unions or shoplifting.
    - lern_too_spel 2y ago
      > No one is suggesting Google should encourage anything. This is a straw man. I obviously didn't mean that I thought you suggested that Google should explicitly tell people to use ad-blockers. Now tell me how not doing anything to discourage people from blocking YouTube ads supports Google's long term interests. Or tell me how they could discourage people from blocking their ads without "[devaluing] brand and trust."
      - grobbyy 2y ago
        > Now tell me how not doing anything to discourage people from blocking YouTube ads supports Google's long term interests Google maintains a monopoly and their brand. Profits are entire the of percent lower by the few power users who use all blockers. Big-O profits remain similar. That contrasts with real competition, brand loss, or monopoly loss. That can lead to astronomically lower profits.
khrbrt 2y ago
Thank God, now I can finally kick my YouTube addiction.
- frogulis 2y ago
  For me it was telling youtube to not remember my watch history. No watch history -> no homepage suggestions -> much less compulsion. And subscriptions still work well enough to be usable. Turns out, not knowing whether I've watched a given video isn't a problem.
downrightmike 2y ago
Don't use Adblock, use ublock origin, that Dev actually gives a shit and isn't taking ad money on the backend.
- dzhiurgis 2y ago
  Just go straight to FreeTube (and enable SponsorBlock). You do loose 4K, but don't need a Google account.
  - alan-hn 2y ago
    There's also piped.video
  - riku_iki 2y ago
    they will eventually will block that client too if it become too popular.
  - efilife 2y ago
    https://youryoure.com/?lose https://youryoure.com/?lose
- Teever 2y ago
  What's wrong with taking money in the background? That's less money that advertisers like Google have to be shitty. "To steal from a brother or sister is evil. To not steal from the institutions that are the pillars of the Pig Empire is equally immoral." -- Abbie Hoffman Does anyone else remember installing a bunch of copies of that Win98 era software that would put ads on you desktop and cut you a cheque every month?
camel-cdr 2y ago
Hypothetically, what could they do against a potential script that pre-downloads all new videos from my subscriptions (RSS, but could also pull channels once a day), and detect and remove the ads? Or an extension/program that lets me pre download the first few minutes of a video, so I can start watching it after 2–3 minutes and won't get annoyed by ad that plays within the buffered amount of time. Or an extension/program that silences, blacks out ads, and notifies me when the ad is over.
- tedunangst 2y ago
  I imagine there's loads more to do on the JavaScript player that selects which video segments to download and play. They feed you a crap list of segments, then have the JavaScript skip past if it decides you're watching like they want.
  - echoangle 2y ago
    You don’t have to do that yourself though, yt-dlp already handles everything
- pompino 2y ago
  It would be logical for them to fight tooth and nail on this as it puts their business model at risk. Personally, as much as I dislike Google, I'd rather everyone get off their youtube addiction, rather than use adblockers (or other similar circumvention methods. Their popularity (IMO) sends a strong signal to the platform owner that people value their content so they should keep fighting against such tools. The pressure Google puts on content creators forces them to skew greatly towards quantity not quality, and other terrible metrics like "engagement". Adblockers put further pressure on them to go out and personally find sponsors. IMO this makes the situation worse as they're focusing on not pissing off advertisers, and stay away from being opinionated, etc. All this probably won't affect established creators, but pushes everyone else to be vanilla.
  - lxgr 2y ago
    Are you saying that there is… a systematic lack of edgy/niche opinions/content on Youtube? We must be on different sites!
blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
People can build AIs that play the videos, extract the content, and replay it later.
- Alifatisk 2y ago
  Doesn’t sound like an ai is necessary in that case
charlie0 2y ago
Ytdl ftw.
key_peace_pulse 2y ago
I've been using a Chrome extension called Clear Skies for the past few months. It skips ads on youtube. https://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/clear-skies/jkiagenaojjkaabmmapjoeolppddefgp?hl=en https://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/clear-skies/jkiagen... Doesn't seem to be affected by the issue reported here.
resuresu 2y ago
[dead]
brokenmachine 2y ago
Every time there's a story like this, those fantastic nerds have fixed it before I've even noticed. Like lovely little leprechauns making the world a better place while I sleep.

31 points by josephcsible 2y ago

Google has entered into a phase where short term profits outweigh long term growth. If you're a startup, don't do this. Maximizing the growth exponent does a lot more than tweaks on per-user revenue. Intentionally annoying users is bad business. When companies do this, it's also good to look at PE ratios, since it suggests they don't anticipate growth.

lkdfjlkdfjlg 2y ago
> Google has entered into a phase where short term profits outweigh long term growth. I has entered this phase at least 10 years ago.
pompino 2y ago
It might well be good for business, but I'm cheering that the slow erosion of trust with Google continues and leads to their demise in a decade or so. The cherry on the cake would be if we can get lawmakers with a backbone to put such companies in check.
zeruch 2y ago
"Google has entered into a phase where short term profits outweigh long term growth." Indeed. The question I have is does that mean it goes eventually the way of Microsoft/IBM, or the way of SGI/Computer Associates?
- grobbyy 2y ago
  I think Yahoo or HP would be the most likely candidates. HP is at about a fifth of it's peak market cap, largely as a result of a similar play. I'd short Google, but there's an old saying that markets can be irrational far longer than an individual wallet can sustain a short....
banish-m4 2y ago
They're so generous for creating business opportunities for others.
ilrwbwrkhv 2y ago
The classic this is what happens when you put a business school grad in charge of a tech business.
lern_too_spel 2y ago
How does encouraging ad blocker usage lead to long term growth?
- column 2y ago
  bait and switch, you let the users get used to the service without ads and find value then slam the ban hammer to make the whales switch to premium
  - lern_too_spel 2y ago
    How is that bait and switch not in Google's long term best interests?
- grobbyy 2y ago
  This is a strawman. No one is suggesting Google should encourage anything. Openly user-hostile actions devalue brand and trust. That's doubly-true for power users who are thought leaders. If Walmart has store security shoot suspected shoplifters and unionizers with a 9mm, discontinuing that policy would not be encouraging unions or shoplifting.
  - lern_too_spel 2y ago
    > No one is suggesting Google should encourage anything. This is a straw man. I obviously didn't mean that I thought you suggested that Google should explicitly tell people to use ad-blockers. Now tell me how not doing anything to discourage people from blocking YouTube ads supports Google's long term interests. Or tell me how they could discourage people from blocking their ads without "[devaluing] brand and trust."
    - grobbyy 2y ago
      > Now tell me how not doing anything to discourage people from blocking YouTube ads supports Google's long term interests Google maintains a monopoly and their brand. Profits are entire the of percent lower by the few power users who use all blockers. Big-O profits remain similar. That contrasts with real competition, brand loss, or monopoly loss. That can lead to astronomically lower profits.

khrbrt 2y ago

Thank God, now I can finally kick my YouTube addiction.

frogulis 2y ago
For me it was telling youtube to not remember my watch history. No watch history -> no homepage suggestions -> much less compulsion. And subscriptions still work well enough to be usable. Turns out, not knowing whether I've watched a given video isn't a problem.

downrightmike 2y ago

Don't use Adblock, use ublock origin, that Dev actually gives a shit and isn't taking ad money on the backend.

dzhiurgis 2y ago
Just go straight to FreeTube (and enable SponsorBlock). You do loose 4K, but don't need a Google account.
- alan-hn 2y ago
  There's also piped.video
- riku_iki 2y ago
  they will eventually will block that client too if it become too popular.
- efilife 2y ago
  https://youryoure.com/?lose https://youryoure.com/?lose
Teever 2y ago
What's wrong with taking money in the background? That's less money that advertisers like Google have to be shitty. "To steal from a brother or sister is evil. To not steal from the institutions that are the pillars of the Pig Empire is equally immoral." -- Abbie Hoffman Does anyone else remember installing a bunch of copies of that Win98 era software that would put ads on you desktop and cut you a cheque every month?

camel-cdr 2y ago

Hypothetically, what could they do against a potential script that pre-downloads all new videos from my subscriptions (RSS, but could also pull channels once a day), and detect and remove the ads? Or an extension/program that lets me pre download the first few minutes of a video, so I can start watching it after 2–3 minutes and won't get annoyed by ad that plays within the buffered amount of time. Or an extension/program that silences, blacks out ads, and notifies me when the ad is over.

tedunangst 2y ago
I imagine there's loads more to do on the JavaScript player that selects which video segments to download and play. They feed you a crap list of segments, then have the JavaScript skip past if it decides you're watching like they want.
- echoangle 2y ago
  You don’t have to do that yourself though, yt-dlp already handles everything
pompino 2y ago
It would be logical for them to fight tooth and nail on this as it puts their business model at risk. Personally, as much as I dislike Google, I'd rather everyone get off their youtube addiction, rather than use adblockers (or other similar circumvention methods. Their popularity (IMO) sends a strong signal to the platform owner that people value their content so they should keep fighting against such tools. The pressure Google puts on content creators forces them to skew greatly towards quantity not quality, and other terrible metrics like "engagement". Adblockers put further pressure on them to go out and personally find sponsors. IMO this makes the situation worse as they're focusing on not pissing off advertisers, and stay away from being opinionated, etc. All this probably won't affect established creators, but pushes everyone else to be vanilla.
- lxgr 2y ago
  Are you saying that there is… a systematic lack of edgy/niche opinions/content on Youtube? We must be on different sites!

blackeyeblitzar 2y ago

People can build AIs that play the videos, extract the content, and replay it later.

Alifatisk 2y ago
Doesn’t sound like an ai is necessary in that case

charlie0 2y ago

Ytdl ftw.

key_peace_pulse 2y ago

I've been using a Chrome extension called Clear Skies for the past few months. It skips ads on youtube. https://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/clear-skies/jkiagenaojjkaabmmapjoeolppddefgp?hl=en https://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/clear-skies/jkiagen... Doesn't seem to be affected by the issue reported here.

resuresu 2y ago

[dead]

brokenmachine 2y ago

Every time there's a story like this, those fantastic nerds have fixed it before I've even noticed. Like lovely little leprechauns making the world a better place while I sleep.