14 ms·

How To Do A Startup On The Side And Not Lose Your Family

217 points by speric 14y ago

SABmore 14y ago
Eric: Thanks for sharing, and great tips. As someone who is in the same boat, I'm always curious as to how others handle the situation. I'm assuming your goal is to leverage the success of your startup so that you can leave your day job? If so, how do you keep focused on your day job, when the excitement of your startup keeps pulling more at you, especially if you are as you start to see success? I'm in a day job that I hate (its soul crushing), but that gives me the flexibility to work on my startup. The allure of my startup is always calling, but its going to be a while before we see profit, and I've got a wife and bills waiting for me at home so I do what I can to stay sane. All the best.
- speric 14y ago
  Growing the startup to the point where I can do it full-time is my ultimate goal. I'll admit, it's not easy to stay focused at my day-job. It's not easy to stay focused anywhere for that matter. But I've had to learn to ignore the voice in my head when it's work/family time. Again, not easy, just one of those things you have to do. Learn to live with the excitement eating away at you. My situation is probably similar to yours; my day job, while not in software development, which I'd prefer, nevertheless gives me a lot of time to work on my startup, since I work close to home and have basically no commute, meaning I get home around 5pm everyday.
j45 14y ago
Thanks for sharing. There is more than one path.
gawker 14y ago
Thanks for sharing. I appreciate the part about providing for family. It's never easy when you have other people who depend on you and so it's comforting to hear of others who are in a similar situation.
pigs 14y ago
Nice writeup, but I would think watching Chelsea win the Champions League is the exact opposite of "an emotionally traumatic experience".
- speric 14y ago
  I was on the edge of my seat for the entire 2nd leg vs. Barcelona, and the final was draining. It's "how" they won it that was traumatic.
aculver 14y ago
Make that N=2. This post is very, very similar to my own experience after launching my "startup on the side" last year (http://www.limelightapp.com/ http://www.limelightapp.com/) and the advice closely parallels what I'd give to others as well. >> Get your spouse or SO's buy-in. Until that happens, I'd suggest not going forward. Agree completely. I think one key to gaining my wife's incredible support was the understanding we both had that Limelight came after her and the kids. Once we had that discussion, she made time for me to work on it once the kids were in bed. >> Something has to give, and it's usually your hobbies. I miss Japanese. :-(
- justindz 14y ago
  Do either you or the poster have advice regarding single parenting + full time job + nights/weekends-style startup? Possible? Was unclear if you were saying that spouse + support = okay, or just if spouse, then support = okay. Do you rely on the presence of a spouse who happens to be supporting to be able to even get the part time priority on the list below the rung to family?
  - speric 14y ago
    I just meant, if you have a spouse, then you need their support. If you don't have a spouse, I think you can still pull it off, but as I have never done a startup under those circumstances, any advice I'd give would be purely speculative. Practically speaking, you'd still have nights and weekends to work on your startup. Are you doing a startup with a cofounder? I'd be worried, from an emotional standpoint, about doing a startup under those conditions without any moral support (from either a spouse or cofounder). Everyone is different but the dark secret of startup life (especially bootstrapped on the side) is that it's tough, and you can get depressed easily for a number of reasons. Having someone in the trenches with you is a great help, emotionally.
  - mountaineer 14y ago
    That's a tough question. To me, it seems like it would come down to social life (including dating) and the startup. I know that when my wife is out of town, once the kids are asleep, I've got almost a full work day's worth of uninterrupted time to work. But, I'm free from worry about socializing.
talentchef 14y ago
As Eric's co-founder, I'm encouraged he put this out there. We have regular conversations about staying focused and not letting the "what if" scenarios rule the tasks at hand. I think there is huge value in constrained resources early in the life of your startup and certainly one of the most scarce is time. This external time constraint has to focus our efforts for maximum ROI. Of course this constraint also keeps us agile as we don't have the luxury of excess anything. An old, wise chicken restaurant founder (Truett Cathy) said in his book, Eat More Chicken, Inspire More People, (paraphrasing terribly) "Growing slowly allows you to grow into your success and your mistakes.". We still dream about success, about trend lines that go up (and they are), but focusing on the resources at hand to make that dream a reality has been our key to date. I'd love for everything to move faster from a growth perspective of course but keeping priorities straight means speed is exchanged for quality of life, agile and lean growth, and the unsung hero in the startup world, sanity.
abcd_f 14y ago
What's an "elder?"
- speric 14y ago
  In my denomination (http://www.opc.org http://www.opc.org), an elder is a servant of the congregation, teaching, administering the Lord's Supper, providing counseling to members, and generally overseeing the work of the church, among other things. Elders work alongside pastors. Here's a good summary: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presbyterian_polity#The_Elder http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presbyterian_polity#The_Elder
- ChaseB 14y ago
  http://lmgtfy.com/?q=what%27s+an+elder http://lmgtfy.com/?q=what%27s+an+elder
  - abcd_f 14y ago
    This is not reddit, bud.
- will_work4tears 14y ago
  Not sure, but I wonder how he can be considered "elder" at 29...
  - speric 14y ago
    While most elders tend to be older men, there's no minimum age requirement. I am young for an elder but there are pastors in my denomination in their early 30's. It's unusual but not unheard of.
- pnathan 14y ago
  In the context he used it in, an lay office of a Protestant church. They typically serve as advisors/leaders/mentors. Usually they seem to be middle-aged or older, IME.
  - 14y ago
mxu 14y ago
It feels good to know my situation is not unique. Thanks for sharing!
ogd 14y ago
someone on HN believes in God? No judgments, I just thought hacker and atheist were deeply intertwined. Perhaps I just picked up the wrong impression from Reddit.
- SimHacker 14y ago
  Usually hackers are very good at logic, which precludes believing the self-contradictory bible and religious dogma, but some people are very good at compartmentalizing their brains and avoiding applying logic to some parts of their lives, apparently.
  - lisper 14y ago
    http://blog.rongarret.info/2009/04/hooked-on-god-religion-as-drug.html http://blog.rongarret.info/2009/04/hooked-on-god-religion-as...
  - dpiers 14y ago
    Belief in a higher power is not completely illogical. I build/design things, and take apart and analyze other people's designs. Looking at the universe, from the smallest particles to the largest galaxies, I see a beautifully complex system of interdependent cogs that mesh together perfectly to enable life to exist. I have yet to come across an intricate system that did not have a designer, and it would be illogical for me to believe the universe just exists.
    - SimHacker 14y ago
      There's a huge difference between a tentative belief in a vaguely defined "higher power", and a confident belief in a well defined organized religious dogma or bible full of self-contradictions and logical impossibilities. Faith in beliefs that are provably wrong is illogical (but EXTREMELY common), and that's the basis of organized religion, which presumes to provide you with all the answers to questions that don't even make sense to ask. Organized religions are afraid to say "I don't know" and simply lie instead. Most programmers should be smart and logical enough to reject that kind of bullshit, but my point is that some have their minds so compartmentalized that they fall for it hook line and sinker. Everyone was shocked that Brendan Eich turned out to be a religiously motivated homophobe. He may be able to think logically about algorithms and programming language design, but his thought process about ethics and human rights is so illogical, severely flawed and compartmentalized that he's afraid to discuss it in public. That kind of religiously motivated irrationality is detrimental to a start-up, high tech company or open source project that needs to attract the best people regardless of their sexual preference, race, sex, etc.
kevinf 14y ago
Thanks for the post Eric. I enjoyed it on a lot of levels. I'm the founder of a new startup (http://cojourneo.com http://cojourneo.com) where we're hoping to a help entrepreneurs deal with many of the issues you raised. I really appreciated you prioritizing the "Inner Life." Our startup is actually funded by a former top VC, now life coach, Jerry Colonna who helps founders discover and develop their "inner life." You think you don't need an inner life until you are a founder of Etsy, General Assembly, etc. (his clients!) and you discover your resources aren't cutting it anymore during hypergrowth and you're at your co-founder's throat. I think you would appreciate Jerry's blog: http://www.themonsterinyourhead.com http://www.themonsterinyourhead.com And, here's my blog post that also addresses how not to be "consumed" by your work. Perhaps some would argue that the answer is better "work-life balance," but I guess I subscribe to a totally different approach & paradigm altogether. As Jerry would say, "work-life balance is bullshit." http://blog.cojourneo.com/post/23620551683/be-the-masterpiece-part-2 http://blog.cojourneo.com/post/23620551683/be-the-masterpiec... This might sound crazy to some people... but, it's life to me. :-) Oh, and I'm a Christian too. We should touch base.
mountaineer 14y ago
I've been doing side-projects while supporting a family for over 8 years now and I share a lot of your experiences. One of them led to being acquihired at a funded startup in the same area. It was a lot easier when there was one kid. Now with 3, like yourself, I find it's near impossible to get any kind of consistent focus. However, I know the hours are usually there, so that's my problem more than anything. However, I will say this. If you're thinking about starting a startup on the side, don't. That's my advice, don't do it. If you're a young hacker without kids, make a full-time go at it. If you've already got kids, save until you can. While I admire the poster's ability to juggle so many things, this cannot be maintained for more than a year, maybe two before you will come to resent one or more of your job, your family, your partners. If you do go ahead, make office hours and stick to them. That's the only thing I've ever found to be effective in terms of relieving the need to work on it. Of course will I take my own advice? Probably not, once you start, it's hard to stop, the allure is too tempting to scratch an itch, solve a problem, or learn a new technology. But, don't say I didn't warn you.
- speric 14y ago
  Everyone's different, but I've been doing this particular startup for 2 1/2 years and don't resent anyone yet. I've had times where I felt like burnout was coming, and when that happens I just take a few days "off" from working on the startup.
- AznHisoka 14y ago
  I am doing this and I dun even got a kid nor a wife and I already resent it after a year... So I can't Imagine what it must be like doing it while raising kids
elchief 14y ago
Up-vote, purely for not misspelling "Lose".
Dewitters79 14y ago
Good to see I'm not alone! I'm 33 with 2 kids, working on http://www.koonsolo.com http://www.koonsolo.com in my spare time. I have the advantage that my hobby is my startup: creating games. It's still hard to find the time though. My advice: get plenty of sleep to stay productive. But with a small baby, even this is sometimes hard to get. Best of success to every spare time entrepreneur daddy! :)
- clbrook 14y ago
  ...and mommies too!
ams6110 14y ago
Get your spouse or SO's buy-in. The challenge here is does SO really understand a priori what [s]he is buying into.
- a5seo 14y ago
  I agree-- the ways it affects your SO's life is impossible to understand. I started a bootstrap startup on the side while married (but before kids) which I eventually sold. Not a huge exit, but we don't have to worry about money anymore. Here's what I can tell a spouse: - Prepare for your startup spouse (SS) to be mentally distracted pretty much all the time (even when they're just hanging out with the kids). - Expect your SS to be really tired. They'll probably try to steal time for their startup by sacrificing sleep. They'll need understanding and kindness when they drag their ass out of bed on under 5 hrs of sleep. - Expect your SS to be more excited about taking a stay-cation to code than traveling thousands of miles to go on vacation with the in-laws. - Once your SS has customers or employees, you probably will not have a true "no devices" vacation for 7-10 years. - Don't pressure SS to get a partner; if they don't already have a partner, recruiting one likely will NOT relieve their workload and allow them to focus on you more. Also, don't expect SS to see value in partnering, since the other person may or may not be good, and could very well create more stress and pressure (not to mention dilute your upside and introduce conflicts over vision/direction). - Expect NOT to go bed at the same time as your SS. - Expect NOT to watch the same TV shows (if any) as your SS; once the kids are down, SS will be coding. - Expect your SS to be really bad remembering details about what's going on with the kids, house, pets, etc. Just remember, they aren't that way because they don't care, they just can't keep those details in their head. You'll need to be the czar of that stuff (or have VERY clear delineation of responsibility). - Expect to need to plan date nights. I'd recommend buying a bottle of wine and not feeling bad about have a few glasses if that's what it takes to get SS to relax and forget about their project. In general, plan activities that don't let SS get bored-- otherwise you'll be hanging out with someone whose mind has drifted off in thought. - If all goes well, SS may be able to quit their job, be master of his/her own destiny, and maybe even sell the business and walk away finally independent. - Understand the upside will most likely be some payout between $1 and $10M which really won't change your lifestyle, but will make you very wealthy with time and options, which honestly, f---ing rocks.
AznHisoka 14y ago
Where do friends fit in? You seem to think that they are expendable since you don't see those Saturday soccer mornings as particularly important.
- speric 14y ago
  Friends are certainly not expendable but the reality is, there's just not a lot of time for them during the week. But I don't think this is a "startup on the side" thing; most of my friends who are married with kids don't hang out much anyway. In my particular situation, Saturday nights and Sunday afternoons and evenings are usually when we'll hang out with other families. But again, I think that's more a function of having young kids than of doing a startup.
  - AznHisoka 14y ago
    Yeah I hear ya. Funny thing is as I get older and most my friends start having families, I end up losing friends. Being single sucks because they rather also hang out with other families too.
DigitalSea 14y ago
I've been doing the same thing for about 5 years now. I think I've somewhat nailed splitting time between family, friends, employment obligations and having a life. I get by on 6 hours sleep a night (my body is used to that amount now, any more and I feel like crap). I stay up late working on my ideas, get up early working on my ideas, use my laptop on the train commute to work (35 minutes), use any spare time I can during my lunch break to work on my projects. Support of your spouse is a must, no doubt about that. If your spouse see's all of your time spent on the computer as just that, "being on the computer" forget about having a startup the support isn't there. I'm fortunate enough to have a supportive spouse who understands I want to succeed not only for us, but because I'm tired of making other people money and have untamed entrepreneurial spirit. Great article.
elliottcarlson 14y ago
The most important lesson I learned the hard way was not prioritizing things correctly. At one point in my relationship I was working obscene hours to get a project done by a certain deadline. The timeline was completely unreasonable - and my employer just as much. Sadly, I take my work seriously and will do anything I can to get things launched on time and this sadly involved plenty of late nights in the office just to come home and continue to work after dinner and even pulling an all nighter. This had serious repercussions on my health, my literal sanity and worst of all on my relationship. I have since left that job and have learned that prioritizing your life like this article states is extremely important, and you will be happier staying organized.
tevih 14y ago
These are things everybody here knows. It just helps to read, and reread it, to keep us focused, and get the support from the community, knowing we all have to squeeze 37 hour days into a measly 24.
emmelaich 14y ago
Great post. Here's the bit I'd like to emphasise: > When you're with your family or friends, "be there" mentally You know those ads for laptops with the perfect family plus dog on the beach or at the park, with one of the parents using a laptop? What a horrible lie. Never do that. It says to your kids/spouse that even when you're there you're not there.
flojito 14y ago
My 2 cents: I just spend 7 hours working each day (5 off 7). The remaining time I just live! Having fun with my 2 kids: reading, playing, practising martial arts. To sum up: enjoying the life, it's too wonderful to spend it working :-)
andreer 14y ago
It seems amazing what you can find time for, I'm inspired. I'd be very curious to see it quantified in a schedule of your typical (or any) week, to see how it all fits together.
- speric 14y ago
  There's no typical week; I try to be as flexible as possible. Maybe in a future post I can just detail the last week. Great idea.
hilti 14y ago
Great Post! To me, the toughest part is to focus on an idea, because the internet is full of inspiration.
ahmadss 14y ago
The one thing you mentioned in your post but, in my opinion, didn't emphasize enough, is the fact that you have a co-founder helping you with this. I've found that it's a much easier sell a side project to the family when you have a team mate believing in this idea and willing to work at it with you. That early "validation" goes a long way in justifying time away from the family to spend hacking/coding/selling.
- speric 14y ago
  Fair point.
acconrad 14y ago
Talk about hitting home. This was me a year ago, except my girlfriend (who I then planned to marry) broke up with me. > "By far the biggest win in my situation is the support of my wife. She not only tolerates my involvement in a startup, she actively supports me and roots for me. She wants to see us succeed." Truer words have never been spoken. You don't lose your family by equal parts self-discipline but ALSO having a spouse that supports and tolerates that kind of craziness. It makes sense why doctors marry doctors, lawyers marry lawyers, PhDs marry PhDs...cause someone working the 9 to 5 cannot appreciate, nor empathize, with the other person's extended (and often erratic) working schedule. They'll feel neglected since they have more free time, and it will be tough to relate and feel appreciated. This I know first hand.

217 points by speric 14y ago

Eric: Thanks for sharing, and great tips. As someone who is in the same boat, I'm always curious as to how others handle the situation. I'm assuming your goal is to leverage the success of your startup so that you can leave your day job? If so, how do you keep focused on your day job, when the excitement of your startup keeps pulling more at you, especially if you are as you start to see success? I'm in a day job that I hate (its soul crushing), but that gives me the flexibility to work on my startup. The allure of my startup is always calling, but its going to be a while before we see profit, and I've got a wife and bills waiting for me at home so I do what I can to stay sane. All the best.

speric 14y ago
Growing the startup to the point where I can do it full-time is my ultimate goal. I'll admit, it's not easy to stay focused at my day-job. It's not easy to stay focused anywhere for that matter. But I've had to learn to ignore the voice in my head when it's work/family time. Again, not easy, just one of those things you have to do. Learn to live with the excitement eating away at you. My situation is probably similar to yours; my day job, while not in software development, which I'd prefer, nevertheless gives me a lot of time to work on my startup, since I work close to home and have basically no commute, meaning I get home around 5pm everyday.

j45 14y ago

Thanks for sharing. There is more than one path.

gawker 14y ago

Thanks for sharing. I appreciate the part about providing for family. It's never easy when you have other people who depend on you and so it's comforting to hear of others who are in a similar situation.

pigs 14y ago

Nice writeup, but I would think watching Chelsea win the Champions League is the exact opposite of "an emotionally traumatic experience".

speric 14y ago
I was on the edge of my seat for the entire 2nd leg vs. Barcelona, and the final was draining. It's "how" they won it that was traumatic.

aculver 14y ago

Make that N=2. This post is very, very similar to my own experience after launching my "startup on the side" last year (http://www.limelightapp.com/ http://www.limelightapp.com/) and the advice closely parallels what I'd give to others as well. >> Get your spouse or SO's buy-in. Until that happens, I'd suggest not going forward. Agree completely. I think one key to gaining my wife's incredible support was the understanding we both had that Limelight came after her and the kids. Once we had that discussion, she made time for me to work on it once the kids were in bed. >> Something has to give, and it's usually your hobbies. I miss Japanese. :-(

justindz 14y ago
Do either you or the poster have advice regarding single parenting + full time job + nights/weekends-style startup? Possible? Was unclear if you were saying that spouse + support = okay, or just if spouse, then support = okay. Do you rely on the presence of a spouse who happens to be supporting to be able to even get the part time priority on the list below the rung to family?
- speric 14y ago
  I just meant, if you have a spouse, then you need their support. If you don't have a spouse, I think you can still pull it off, but as I have never done a startup under those circumstances, any advice I'd give would be purely speculative. Practically speaking, you'd still have nights and weekends to work on your startup. Are you doing a startup with a cofounder? I'd be worried, from an emotional standpoint, about doing a startup under those conditions without any moral support (from either a spouse or cofounder). Everyone is different but the dark secret of startup life (especially bootstrapped on the side) is that it's tough, and you can get depressed easily for a number of reasons. Having someone in the trenches with you is a great help, emotionally.
- mountaineer 14y ago
  That's a tough question. To me, it seems like it would come down to social life (including dating) and the startup. I know that when my wife is out of town, once the kids are asleep, I've got almost a full work day's worth of uninterrupted time to work. But, I'm free from worry about socializing.

talentchef 14y ago

As Eric's co-founder, I'm encouraged he put this out there. We have regular conversations about staying focused and not letting the "what if" scenarios rule the tasks at hand. I think there is huge value in constrained resources early in the life of your startup and certainly one of the most scarce is time. This external time constraint has to focus our efforts for maximum ROI. Of course this constraint also keeps us agile as we don't have the luxury of excess anything. An old, wise chicken restaurant founder (Truett Cathy) said in his book, Eat More Chicken, Inspire More People, (paraphrasing terribly) "Growing slowly allows you to grow into your success and your mistakes.". We still dream about success, about trend lines that go up (and they are), but focusing on the resources at hand to make that dream a reality has been our key to date. I'd love for everything to move faster from a growth perspective of course but keeping priorities straight means speed is exchanged for quality of life, agile and lean growth, and the unsung hero in the startup world, sanity.

abcd_f 14y ago

What's an "elder?"

speric 14y ago
In my denomination (http://www.opc.org http://www.opc.org), an elder is a servant of the congregation, teaching, administering the Lord's Supper, providing counseling to members, and generally overseeing the work of the church, among other things. Elders work alongside pastors. Here's a good summary: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presbyterian_polity#The_Elder http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presbyterian_polity#The_Elder
ChaseB 14y ago
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=what%27s+an+elder http://lmgtfy.com/?q=what%27s+an+elder
- abcd_f 14y ago
  This is not reddit, bud.
will_work4tears 14y ago
Not sure, but I wonder how he can be considered "elder" at 29...
- speric 14y ago
  While most elders tend to be older men, there's no minimum age requirement. I am young for an elder but there are pastors in my denomination in their early 30's. It's unusual but not unheard of.
pnathan 14y ago
In the context he used it in, an lay office of a Protestant church. They typically serve as advisors/leaders/mentors. Usually they seem to be middle-aged or older, IME.
- 14y ago

mxu 14y ago

It feels good to know my situation is not unique. Thanks for sharing!

ogd 14y ago

someone on HN believes in God? No judgments, I just thought hacker and atheist were deeply intertwined. Perhaps I just picked up the wrong impression from Reddit.

SimHacker 14y ago
Usually hackers are very good at logic, which precludes believing the self-contradictory bible and religious dogma, but some people are very good at compartmentalizing their brains and avoiding applying logic to some parts of their lives, apparently.
- lisper 14y ago
  http://blog.rongarret.info/2009/04/hooked-on-god-religion-as-drug.html http://blog.rongarret.info/2009/04/hooked-on-god-religion-as...
- dpiers 14y ago
  Belief in a higher power is not completely illogical. I build/design things, and take apart and analyze other people's designs. Looking at the universe, from the smallest particles to the largest galaxies, I see a beautifully complex system of interdependent cogs that mesh together perfectly to enable life to exist. I have yet to come across an intricate system that did not have a designer, and it would be illogical for me to believe the universe just exists.
  - SimHacker 14y ago
    There's a huge difference between a tentative belief in a vaguely defined "higher power", and a confident belief in a well defined organized religious dogma or bible full of self-contradictions and logical impossibilities. Faith in beliefs that are provably wrong is illogical (but EXTREMELY common), and that's the basis of organized religion, which presumes to provide you with all the answers to questions that don't even make sense to ask. Organized religions are afraid to say "I don't know" and simply lie instead. Most programmers should be smart and logical enough to reject that kind of bullshit, but my point is that some have their minds so compartmentalized that they fall for it hook line and sinker. Everyone was shocked that Brendan Eich turned out to be a religiously motivated homophobe. He may be able to think logically about algorithms and programming language design, but his thought process about ethics and human rights is so illogical, severely flawed and compartmentalized that he's afraid to discuss it in public. That kind of religiously motivated irrationality is detrimental to a start-up, high tech company or open source project that needs to attract the best people regardless of their sexual preference, race, sex, etc.

kevinf 14y ago

Thanks for the post Eric. I enjoyed it on a lot of levels. I'm the founder of a new startup (http://cojourneo.com http://cojourneo.com) where we're hoping to a help entrepreneurs deal with many of the issues you raised. I really appreciated you prioritizing the "Inner Life." Our startup is actually funded by a former top VC, now life coach, Jerry Colonna who helps founders discover and develop their "inner life." You think you don't need an inner life until you are a founder of Etsy, General Assembly, etc. (his clients!) and you discover your resources aren't cutting it anymore during hypergrowth and you're at your co-founder's throat. I think you would appreciate Jerry's blog: http://www.themonsterinyourhead.com http://www.themonsterinyourhead.com And, here's my blog post that also addresses how not to be "consumed" by your work. Perhaps some would argue that the answer is better "work-life balance," but I guess I subscribe to a totally different approach & paradigm altogether. As Jerry would say, "work-life balance is bullshit." http://blog.cojourneo.com/post/23620551683/be-the-masterpiece-part-2 http://blog.cojourneo.com/post/23620551683/be-the-masterpiec... This might sound crazy to some people... but, it's life to me. :-) Oh, and I'm a Christian too. We should touch base.

mountaineer 14y ago

I've been doing side-projects while supporting a family for over 8 years now and I share a lot of your experiences. One of them led to being acquihired at a funded startup in the same area. It was a lot easier when there was one kid. Now with 3, like yourself, I find it's near impossible to get any kind of consistent focus. However, I know the hours are usually there, so that's my problem more than anything. However, I will say this. If you're thinking about starting a startup on the side, don't. That's my advice, don't do it. If you're a young hacker without kids, make a full-time go at it. If you've already got kids, save until you can. While I admire the poster's ability to juggle so many things, this cannot be maintained for more than a year, maybe two before you will come to resent one or more of your job, your family, your partners. If you do go ahead, make office hours and stick to them. That's the only thing I've ever found to be effective in terms of relieving the need to work on it. Of course will I take my own advice? Probably not, once you start, it's hard to stop, the allure is too tempting to scratch an itch, solve a problem, or learn a new technology. But, don't say I didn't warn you.

speric 14y ago
Everyone's different, but I've been doing this particular startup for 2 1/2 years and don't resent anyone yet. I've had times where I felt like burnout was coming, and when that happens I just take a few days "off" from working on the startup.
AznHisoka 14y ago
I am doing this and I dun even got a kid nor a wife and I already resent it after a year... So I can't Imagine what it must be like doing it while raising kids

elchief 14y ago

Up-vote, purely for not misspelling "Lose".

Dewitters79 14y ago

Good to see I'm not alone! I'm 33 with 2 kids, working on http://www.koonsolo.com http://www.koonsolo.com in my spare time. I have the advantage that my hobby is my startup: creating games. It's still hard to find the time though. My advice: get plenty of sleep to stay productive. But with a small baby, even this is sometimes hard to get. Best of success to every spare time entrepreneur daddy! :)

clbrook 14y ago
...and mommies too!

ams6110 14y ago

Get your spouse or SO's buy-in. The challenge here is does SO really understand a priori what [s]he is buying into.

a5seo 14y ago
I agree-- the ways it affects your SO's life is impossible to understand. I started a bootstrap startup on the side while married (but before kids) which I eventually sold. Not a huge exit, but we don't have to worry about money anymore. Here's what I can tell a spouse: - Prepare for your startup spouse (SS) to be mentally distracted pretty much all the time (even when they're just hanging out with the kids). - Expect your SS to be really tired. They'll probably try to steal time for their startup by sacrificing sleep. They'll need understanding and kindness when they drag their ass out of bed on under 5 hrs of sleep. - Expect your SS to be more excited about taking a stay-cation to code than traveling thousands of miles to go on vacation with the in-laws. - Once your SS has customers or employees, you probably will not have a true "no devices" vacation for 7-10 years. - Don't pressure SS to get a partner; if they don't already have a partner, recruiting one likely will NOT relieve their workload and allow them to focus on you more. Also, don't expect SS to see value in partnering, since the other person may or may not be good, and could very well create more stress and pressure (not to mention dilute your upside and introduce conflicts over vision/direction). - Expect NOT to go bed at the same time as your SS. - Expect NOT to watch the same TV shows (if any) as your SS; once the kids are down, SS will be coding. - Expect your SS to be really bad remembering details about what's going on with the kids, house, pets, etc. Just remember, they aren't that way because they don't care, they just can't keep those details in their head. You'll need to be the czar of that stuff (or have VERY clear delineation of responsibility). - Expect to need to plan date nights. I'd recommend buying a bottle of wine and not feeling bad about have a few glasses if that's what it takes to get SS to relax and forget about their project. In general, plan activities that don't let SS get bored-- otherwise you'll be hanging out with someone whose mind has drifted off in thought. - If all goes well, SS may be able to quit their job, be master of his/her own destiny, and maybe even sell the business and walk away finally independent. - Understand the upside will most likely be some payout between $1 and $10M which really won't change your lifestyle, but will make you very wealthy with time and options, which honestly, f---ing rocks.

AznHisoka 14y ago

Where do friends fit in? You seem to think that they are expendable since you don't see those Saturday soccer mornings as particularly important.

speric 14y ago
Friends are certainly not expendable but the reality is, there's just not a lot of time for them during the week. But I don't think this is a "startup on the side" thing; most of my friends who are married with kids don't hang out much anyway. In my particular situation, Saturday nights and Sunday afternoons and evenings are usually when we'll hang out with other families. But again, I think that's more a function of having young kids than of doing a startup.
- AznHisoka 14y ago
  Yeah I hear ya. Funny thing is as I get older and most my friends start having families, I end up losing friends. Being single sucks because they rather also hang out with other families too.

DigitalSea 14y ago

I've been doing the same thing for about 5 years now. I think I've somewhat nailed splitting time between family, friends, employment obligations and having a life. I get by on 6 hours sleep a night (my body is used to that amount now, any more and I feel like crap). I stay up late working on my ideas, get up early working on my ideas, use my laptop on the train commute to work (35 minutes), use any spare time I can during my lunch break to work on my projects. Support of your spouse is a must, no doubt about that. If your spouse see's all of your time spent on the computer as just that, "being on the computer" forget about having a startup the support isn't there. I'm fortunate enough to have a supportive spouse who understands I want to succeed not only for us, but because I'm tired of making other people money and have untamed entrepreneurial spirit. Great article.

elliottcarlson 14y ago

The most important lesson I learned the hard way was not prioritizing things correctly. At one point in my relationship I was working obscene hours to get a project done by a certain deadline. The timeline was completely unreasonable - and my employer just as much. Sadly, I take my work seriously and will do anything I can to get things launched on time and this sadly involved plenty of late nights in the office just to come home and continue to work after dinner and even pulling an all nighter. This had serious repercussions on my health, my literal sanity and worst of all on my relationship. I have since left that job and have learned that prioritizing your life like this article states is extremely important, and you will be happier staying organized.

tevih 14y ago

These are things everybody here knows. It just helps to read, and reread it, to keep us focused, and get the support from the community, knowing we all have to squeeze 37 hour days into a measly 24.

emmelaich 14y ago

Great post. Here's the bit I'd like to emphasise: > When you're with your family or friends, "be there" mentally You know those ads for laptops with the perfect family plus dog on the beach or at the park, with one of the parents using a laptop? What a horrible lie. Never do that. It says to your kids/spouse that even when you're there you're not there.

flojito 14y ago

My 2 cents: I just spend 7 hours working each day (5 off 7). The remaining time I just live! Having fun with my 2 kids: reading, playing, practising martial arts. To sum up: enjoying the life, it's too wonderful to spend it working :-)

andreer 14y ago

It seems amazing what you can find time for, I'm inspired. I'd be very curious to see it quantified in a schedule of your typical (or any) week, to see how it all fits together.

speric 14y ago
There's no typical week; I try to be as flexible as possible. Maybe in a future post I can just detail the last week. Great idea.

hilti 14y ago

Great Post! To me, the toughest part is to focus on an idea, because the internet is full of inspiration.

ahmadss 14y ago

The one thing you mentioned in your post but, in my opinion, didn't emphasize enough, is the fact that you have a co-founder helping you with this. I've found that it's a much easier sell a side project to the family when you have a team mate believing in this idea and willing to work at it with you. That early "validation" goes a long way in justifying time away from the family to spend hacking/coding/selling.

speric 14y ago
Fair point.

acconrad 14y ago

Talk about hitting home. This was me a year ago, except my girlfriend (who I then planned to marry) broke up with me. > "By far the biggest win in my situation is the support of my wife. She not only tolerates my involvement in a startup, she actively supports me and roots for me. She wants to see us succeed." Truer words have never been spoken. You don't lose your family by equal parts self-discipline but ALSO having a spouse that supports and tolerates that kind of craziness. It makes sense why doctors marry doctors, lawyers marry lawyers, PhDs marry PhDs...cause someone working the 9 to 5 cannot appreciate, nor empathize, with the other person's extended (and often erratic) working schedule. They'll feel neglected since they have more free time, and it will be tough to relate and feel appreciated. This I know first hand.