4 ms·

Fwiw the sun exposure data was a questionnaire that asked women if they sunbathe never, a little, or a lot.

hn_user82179 2y ago
Is sunbathing even much of a thing anymore? I feel like I heard of people sunbathing in their yards or at the beach when I was younger (~20 years ago) but not so much now
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- riffic 2y ago
  go check out the beach or pool sometime.
- yxhuvud 2y ago
  In Sweden? Oh yes.
- JohnBooty 2y ago
  I'm a middle-aged white-skinned American and I do it sometimes. Probably about 20 minutes per week in the summer? I'm not trying to get a deep dark tan or anything. I just want to make my back and my chest match my arms and face a little bit more closely. Otherwise people laugh at you at pool parties!
anatnom 2y ago
From the paper[0]: > Four predetermined questions were posed regarding sun exposure: (i) How often do you sunbathe during the summertime? (never, 1−14 times, 15−30 times, >30 times); (ii) Do you sunbathe during the winter, such as on vacation to the mountains? (no, 1−3 days, 4−10 days, >10 days); (iii) Do you use tanning beds? (never, 1−3 times per year, 4−10 times per year, >10 times per year); and (iv) Do you go abroad on vacation to swim and sunbathe? (never, once every 1–2 years, once a year, two or more times per year). The four questions were dichotomized into yes/no in the analysis (i.e. sometimes versus no or never). We created a four-score variable as a measure of sun exposure depending on the number of ‘yes’ responses to the above questions on a scale from 0 (avoid sun exposure: reference) to 4 (greatest sun exposure). Sun exposure habits were categorized into three groups: zero ‘yes’ responses (avoidance of sun exposure; the main study group); ‘yes’ responses to one or two questions (moderate exposure); and ‘yes’ responses to three or four questions (greatest exposure). Of note, the surveys are of Swedish women and were conducted in Swedish. There could be some translation nuance for the word "sunbathe" which doesn't map well to English, or other cultural differences to explain the "but no one I know actually sunbathes..." thought that I immediately jump to. [0] https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/joim.12496 https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/joim.12496
- wodenokoto 2y ago
  > other cultural differences to explain the "but no one I know actually sunbathes..." thought that I immediately jump to. Having grown up in Denmark that thought sounds odd to me. People really don’t sunbathe where you’re from? What do people do on the beach, or in the park all summer? Not to mention at the tanning salon, before going on vacation to sunbathe at the beach (can’t look pale when sunbathing!)
  - dzhiurgis 2y ago
    Growing up Lithuania the term is “burning yourself” In NZ now - going to beach without protection even for an hour is suicide. Also avoid even going outside from 11am till 3pm at peak summer months.
    - alvah 2y ago
      "In NZ now - going to beach without protection even for an hour is suicide. Also avoid even going outside from 11am till 3pm at peak summer months." I live in Western Australia, which is much sunnier than anywhere in NZ, and this sounds hyperbolic to me.
      - seszett 2y ago
        Don't know about Australia but when I was on Kerguelen island which is at the same latitude as my homeplace on the coast of France, there was a very noticeable difference in UV content, you could absolutely burn in just an hour without protection (and it happened often).
      - dzhiurgis 2y ago
        Perth at peaks is about 2 average points higher than Auckland [0]. UV index does happen at peaks too. I've met plenty people here who "never wore a hat their life" and look like a prune. Personally I'm more comfortable at home than trying to find a shade everywhere you go. 0: https://www.ehinz.ac.nz/indicators/uv-exposure/daily-uv-levels/ https://www.ehinz.ac.nz/indicators/uv-exposure/daily-uv-leve...
causality0 2y ago
I swear, half the time I see a really cool paper it turns out some hokey methodology like this is behind it.
- apelapan 2y ago
  Why is it "hokey" to do register studies where you explore correlations and test various confounders? I'd say it is an extremely valuable , indispensable even, item in the scientific toolbelt.
  - yjftsjthsd-h 2y ago
    Because Correlation Is Not Causation™, and if they're doing correlation against self-reported data that involves people estimating things it's even less reliable. It still has value, yes, but that value is in finding things for more rigorous methods to examine, not in trying to draw conclusions from such shaky materials.
  - causality0 2y ago
    Because asking a group of people how often they sunbathe is a horrible way to measure sun exposure. Dishonest answers, imperfect memory, differing definitions of sunbathing, and the idea itself that sunbathing and tanning is a proxy for overall sun exposure when they likely don't even make up a significant fraction of a person's UV exposure. Bad, bad, bad.

Is sunbathing even much of a thing anymore? I feel like I heard of people sunbathing in their yards or at the beach when I was younger (~20 years ago) but not so much now

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
riffic 2y ago
go check out the beach or pool sometime.
yxhuvud 2y ago
In Sweden? Oh yes.
JohnBooty 2y ago
I'm a middle-aged white-skinned American and I do it sometimes. Probably about 20 minutes per week in the summer? I'm not trying to get a deep dark tan or anything. I just want to make my back and my chest match my arms and face a little bit more closely. Otherwise people laugh at you at pool parties!

anatnom 2y ago

From the paper[0]: > Four predetermined questions were posed regarding sun exposure: (i) How often do you sunbathe during the summertime? (never, 1−14 times, 15−30 times, >30 times); (ii) Do you sunbathe during the winter, such as on vacation to the mountains? (no, 1−3 days, 4−10 days, >10 days); (iii) Do you use tanning beds? (never, 1−3 times per year, 4−10 times per year, >10 times per year); and (iv) Do you go abroad on vacation to swim and sunbathe? (never, once every 1–2 years, once a year, two or more times per year). The four questions were dichotomized into yes/no in the analysis (i.e. sometimes versus no or never). We created a four-score variable as a measure of sun exposure depending on the number of ‘yes’ responses to the above questions on a scale from 0 (avoid sun exposure: reference) to 4 (greatest sun exposure). Sun exposure habits were categorized into three groups: zero ‘yes’ responses (avoidance of sun exposure; the main study group); ‘yes’ responses to one or two questions (moderate exposure); and ‘yes’ responses to three or four questions (greatest exposure). Of note, the surveys are of Swedish women and were conducted in Swedish. There could be some translation nuance for the word "sunbathe" which doesn't map well to English, or other cultural differences to explain the "but no one I know actually sunbathes..." thought that I immediately jump to. [0] https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/joim.12496 https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/joim.12496

wodenokoto 2y ago
> other cultural differences to explain the "but no one I know actually sunbathes..." thought that I immediately jump to. Having grown up in Denmark that thought sounds odd to me. People really don’t sunbathe where you’re from? What do people do on the beach, or in the park all summer? Not to mention at the tanning salon, before going on vacation to sunbathe at the beach (can’t look pale when sunbathing!)
- dzhiurgis 2y ago
  Growing up Lithuania the term is “burning yourself” In NZ now - going to beach without protection even for an hour is suicide. Also avoid even going outside from 11am till 3pm at peak summer months.
  - alvah 2y ago
    "In NZ now - going to beach without protection even for an hour is suicide. Also avoid even going outside from 11am till 3pm at peak summer months." I live in Western Australia, which is much sunnier than anywhere in NZ, and this sounds hyperbolic to me.
    - seszett 2y ago
      Don't know about Australia but when I was on Kerguelen island which is at the same latitude as my homeplace on the coast of France, there was a very noticeable difference in UV content, you could absolutely burn in just an hour without protection (and it happened often).
    - dzhiurgis 2y ago
      Perth at peaks is about 2 average points higher than Auckland [0]. UV index does happen at peaks too. I've met plenty people here who "never wore a hat their life" and look like a prune. Personally I'm more comfortable at home than trying to find a shade everywhere you go. 0: https://www.ehinz.ac.nz/indicators/uv-exposure/daily-uv-levels/ https://www.ehinz.ac.nz/indicators/uv-exposure/daily-uv-leve...

causality0 2y ago

I swear, half the time I see a really cool paper it turns out some hokey methodology like this is behind it.

apelapan 2y ago
Why is it "hokey" to do register studies where you explore correlations and test various confounders? I'd say it is an extremely valuable , indispensable even, item in the scientific toolbelt.
- yjftsjthsd-h 2y ago
  Because Correlation Is Not Causation™, and if they're doing correlation against self-reported data that involves people estimating things it's even less reliable. It still has value, yes, but that value is in finding things for more rigorous methods to examine, not in trying to draw conclusions from such shaky materials.
- causality0 2y ago
  Because asking a group of people how often they sunbathe is a horrible way to measure sun exposure. Dishonest answers, imperfect memory, differing definitions of sunbathing, and the idea itself that sunbathing and tanning is a proxy for overall sun exposure when they likely don't even make up a significant fraction of a person's UV exposure. Bad, bad, bad.