15 ms·

The USDA's gardening zones shifted, this map shows you what's changed

472 points by geox 3y ago

ericmay 3y ago
I thought that was a really nice website and visual journey.
nathanaldensr 3y ago
[flagged]
- fred_is_fred 3y ago
  I tried to actually use the map but nothing worked including the zip code search, it was pretty frustrating.
  - giraffe_lady 3y ago
    It's city state not zip code.
    - fred_is_fred 3y ago
      Oops. The real map does zip code so I assumed that it would work there.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
blinding-streak 3y ago
Amazing job by NPR. Made a very dry topic really interesting.
taylodl 3y ago
There have been 3 updates to the zones in the past 50 years. Some of the updates are due to better accuracy after years of collecting data, but the 800-pound gorilla in the room is climate change. Where I live, winters are 4.5 degrees warmer. It has definitely affected my gardening.
- onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
  > Where I live, winters are 4.5 degrees warmer. 4.5 degrees warmer since when? And where?
  - angry_moose 3y ago
    The map has an explanation: About this data The 2012 USDA hardiness zones were calculated using the average lowest winter temperature for the observation period of 1976-2005. The new zones are calculated using the years 1991-2020. These two observation windows overlap. Colors show the difference between the two 30-year averages for each place on the map. My area is 3.8F warmer using this method.
  - playingalong 3y ago
    FWIW they likely mean Fahrenheit. I.e. 2.5 Celsius.
    - taylodl 3y ago
      Yes, I did. 4.5 degrees Celsius would be a newsworthy increase in winter temperatures! :)
      - voisin 3y ago
        Where I am at, in the Canadian Rockies, the daily temperature this winter was routinely 7-9 degrees Celsius above average (1970-2020) according to my iOS Weather app. They introduced this feature last year and I have been checking it nearly every day. Other than a cold snap in January (that killed my bees!) the weather was warmer every single day.
        taylodl 3y ago
        You're hitting on another issue we gardeners are noticing - overall the temps are warmer, causing things to bud early, but there are still cold snaps. The cold snaps aren't any colder than they should be for the time of year, the problem is the inter-snap days are a lot warmer. This increased variance in temperature is actually worse than the average temperature getting warmer.
resource_waste 3y ago
[flagged]
- coldpie 3y ago
  > I am wondering why gardening is so popular. Because it's fun. It's cool & normal for people to shift hobbies. Sounds like you're ready to move on to a new one!
- NeoTar 3y ago
  Gardening isn't for everyone. You are completely allowed to have your own opinions ! Although perhaps we have a gap in our language here, since you seem to be against growing vegetables/herbs exclusively rather than what I'd call gardening which includes growing all plants, flowers, etc. Having a 'nice' looking garden (or at least one where you can sit comfortably) is the outcome of that sort of gardening. There are very few vegetables where growing them makes yourself much sense (economically). There are a few where you can 'fire and forget' basically, but even then it's a up-to few hours preparing the soil. In my climate zone, mint would be one - it's basically a weed, so it will grow and spread by itself. Also - you can't get Basil in store where you are? In the UK and Germany it's available either as fresh leaves, or as small plants costing about probably $1-2 each.
  - lupusreal 3y ago
    I've found that growing heirloom tomatos is essentially effort-free; they keep coming back year after year without me having to do anything but pick them before the rats get to them. That "garden" is basically just a weed patch that makes free food.
  - more_corn 3y ago
    I can see how it stopped being fun for you. No problem, go do something else you enjoy. I personally love to go out into the garden and just be there. I trimmed some branches yesterday because it needed doing but I didn’t go out there to do a chore. I went out because it was beautiful and I wanted to be there. I make a lot of money too and can work whenever. But taking frequent breaks keeps me sharp. I think better when I have some breaks and a few minutes in the garden is refreshing. I’m actually getting more into growing food. I have some ginger sprouting on my counter and can’t wait to find a home for it in the yard. The plum trees are captivating, we had a spectacular apple year last year. There’s something calm and sweet about going out to the tree, picking apples and turning them into a pie. To each his own though. I’d never push my hobbies on someone else or challenge anyone who started to find one of theirs unfulfilling.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
WarOnPrivacy 3y ago
West central FL has been losing winter. Anecdotally, I felt my lowest temps of the year go from teens (1990s) to high 30s & 40s. Not sure if it was my perception, I looked up a chart and it confirmed the trend. edit: I can't find the chart I saw for my region. The closest is this: Avg Jan temps but for whole state. https://www.ncei.noaa.gov/access/monitoring/climate-at-a-glance/statewide/time-series/8/tavg/1/1/1992-2024?base_prd=true&begbaseyear=1901&endbaseyear=2000 https://www.ncei.noaa.gov/access/monitoring/climate-at-a-gla...
kop316 3y ago
If you actually want to view the map: https://planthardiness.ars.usda.gov/ https://planthardiness.ars.usda.gov/ The frame link goes to: https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/b1d1fd9b284e46dcaa43959bec439b44/ https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/b1d1fd9b284e46dcaa4...
- queuebert 3y ago
  Thank you. That website was an abomination. Scrolling to do anything but move the content up should be highly discouraged.
  - Workaccount2 3y ago
    The difference between people who look at data to be informed and people who look at data to feel informed.
    - jameshart 3y ago
      The website linked is a news article, not a map.
      - toss1 3y ago
        Yes, and the complaint is that news should be about informing, not about entertaining to make people feel informed [0]. This is more infotainment than information. [0] This concept implemented at scale by Roger Ailes, founder of Fox news, who famously said "Our viewers don't want be informed, they want to feel informed", which became the motto of the newsroom One ref among many: https://www.marketplace.org/2017/05/18/roger-ailes-transformed-american-politics-contact-sport/ https://www.marketplace.org/2017/05/18/roger-ailes-transform...
        jameshart 3y ago
        The article provides useful context about how much the hardiness grades have changed, where, and why; it provides context about what these ratings do and don’t mean; it adds context about other climate changes that aren’t captured in this data; and it frames it with advice about planting, underpinned by a visually interesting data plot, and a tool that allows you to explore that data in a way that makes it personally relevant to you. Why on earth would you choose an article like this to jump on a hobby horse about infotainment?
jrgd 3y ago
and that's the canadian version; for those living up-north and frustrated like me to not be able to see something continent-wide http://planthardiness.gc.ca/?m=1 http://planthardiness.gc.ca/?m=1 i would love to see something for the south as well (just quickly googled) https://davisla.wordpress.com/plant-zones/south-america-plant-hardiness-zone-map/ https://davisla.wordpress.com/plant-zones/south-america-plan... I'm unsure though if they receive an update recently or if they will anytime soon
- thrusong 3y ago
  Thank you for this— I was equally frustrated I couldn't look up Canada too!
mithr 3y ago
Really nicely delivered, and a pretty great practical illustration (to the right audience) of the effects of global warming.
rqtwteye 3y ago
I so much hate this format where you have to scroll for each little paragraph and can't jump quickly from one part to another.
asdajksah2123 3y ago
I wish the US had a similar "bug zone". Where I live has seen a whole slew of bugs that did not exist beyond several states South making it all the way up here over the last decade and a half.
- JKCalhoun 3y ago
  Armadillos now as far north as Illinois, Nebraska. Wild.
- tcmart14 3y ago
  I havn't seen maps for bugs in general. But there are some maps the track specific bugs. Like I check for maps regarding ticks. They are getting farther and farther north.
- greenie_beans 3y ago
  this is a cool idea
dgrin91 3y ago
I'm really curious about the taxonomy of these zones. Why are there 13 zones with an 'a' and 'b' zone for each number? Why not just 26 zones?
- bombcar 3y ago
  The Plant Hardiness Zone Map (PHZM) is based on the average annual extreme minimum winter temperature, displayed as 10-degree F zones ranging from zone 1 (coldest) to zone 13 (warmest). Each zone is divided into half zones designated as ‘a’ and ‘b’. For example, 7a and 7b are 5-degree F increments representing the colder and warmer halves of zone 7, respectively. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardiness_zone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardiness_zone (It was originally the 13 bands, but as things got more detailed they realized splitting them made a difference, I suspect.)
- hosh 3y ago
  The “a” and “b” zones subdivides it. Zone 10 is tropical, and never gets frost. Each “a” and “b” represents a 5 degree range. You can also create microclimates, local areas where the zone effectively shifts up or down about 5 degrees. As an aside, there is a heat hardiness zone that rarely gets talked about.
  - madcaptenor 3y ago
    You can find that if you scroll down the article far enough, or at https://ahsgardening.org/about-us/news-press/cool_timeline/heat-zone-map-developed/ https://ahsgardening.org/about-us/news-press/cool_timeline/h... - it's based on the number of days above 86 degrees F (30 degrees C). I would like to see these two maps overlaid on each other somehow.
- VyseofArcadia 3y ago
  Because it was initially divided into 13 zones. In 1990 they subdivided each zone into a and b zones. I'm not finding any rationale on why subdividing instead of renumbering, but it probably alleviated confusion at the time. If you're in zone 6b, but you're used to thinking of yourself as zone 6, you're still mostly right even if you forget whether you're in a or b. Easier to remember than suddenly you're in zone 13.
willcodeforfoo 3y ago
Really nice data visualization... PMTiles! https://apps.npr.org/plant-hardiness-garden-map/assets/synced/pmtiles/usda_zones.pmtiles https://apps.npr.org/plant-hardiness-garden-map/assets/synce...
monkburger 3y ago
I've gone from 6b to 7a. Winters almost do not exist here in the mid-Atlantic. Sure, there are some cold snaps, but they do not last as long as 20 to 30 years ago. Snowfall? Getting less and less with an occasional nor'easter here and there. Ancedotally, in late February, I had to mow the lawn. We've started measuring TTFF. (Time-to-first-frost). Historically, it was in early to mid October for decades. Now it's pushing mid-November. The growing seasons are longer, for sure.
- kbenson 3y ago
  > Winters almost do not exist here ... Snowfall? Getting less and less with an occasional nor'easter here and there. That seems like a regional saying, which translates very poorly to an online global audience. I read winters almost do not exist and assumed you were being more literal than "there's less snow". It's snowed here 2-3 times in the last couple decades, each time for maybe a minute or two. I still wouldn't say we don't have a winter. For this area, winter is when it rains. Which is different than summer because there's no rain in the summer, almost ever (maybe one day on average as freak weather). Edit: I seem to have struck a nerve here, but I'm not sure why noting that a particular turn of phrase might be confusing to people from other areas would do so.
  - monkburger 3y ago
    Our last big snowstorm was in 2016. Afterwards we were in a snowfall drought for years (well below average) We had a few close calls for big snow, but they never materialized. This is unheard of. Even during strong El Nino patterns, the east coast is supposed to receive good snowfall. It did not happen. Even with a -NAO, -AO, +PNA!
    - kbenson 3y ago
      My point was that in some areas they equate winter with snow, and reduction of snow seems to be interpreted as no winter. If the weather patter is still notably different than summer, it's winter. Equating snow in the current area to winter and lack of it to not being winter is a regional thing. It makes certain statements, like "winters almost do not exist here" come across very differently to people in other regions, which what what I was trying to express. For example, my initial interpretation of your early statements in that comment was that you were saying there's little difference between fall and spring from winter, that your winters don't have a noticeable difference to the other seasons. From the rest of your comment it sounds like it's just somewhat milder than it used to be, but still notably different weather pattern.
unnamed76ri 3y ago
When this new map was first released, it was very amusing watching people in gardening Facebook groups start planning to grow plants that have died whenever they tried in the past. Just because the government gave them a new number, they think it suddenly changed the reality on the ground. I grow 25+ kinds of fruit and I’d love to add more. But the reality is that fruits like figs and muscadines still die every winter where I am at.
TylerE 3y ago
Does anyone else HATE pages like this? Just show me the damn map and not 5 different pop up overlays, many animated, depending on how hard scrolled down I am. Oh, and their "zip code" search is broken, it takes me to the state capital over a hundred miles away, in a totally different climactic zone. Doubly broken.
- tzs 3y ago
  They don't have a zip code search as far as I can tell. It asks you to enter your city and state or use the "Surprise me!" button.
  - TylerE 3y ago
    99.9% of web search forms that ask for a city accept a zip code, and are often more accurate when doing so, as even a mid sized city can be composed of dozens of zip codes, never mind places like Central Manhattan where some zipcodes resolve all the way down to single buildings.
    - itslennysfault 3y ago
      ...but this page is part of the 0.1% (by your math) that actually wants what it asked for. So, this is just a case of user error. Enter what it asked for and it works great.
      - tuumi 3y ago
        Harrison Township, Michigan goes to Harrison City, PA. I then tried the city to the south - Saint Clair Shores, MI and that took me to San Antonio, Texas. I'm working in East China, Michigan and that took me to East Chicago, Indiana. I ended up just using Detroit, MI to get anything useful. So, no, that doesn't work either.
  - interestica 3y ago
    As a Canadian, constraining the data viz by political border is annoying.
mattgrice 3y ago
It is very nice to see US-targeted media use F. All climate related news seems to use C and I'd bet that 95%+ of Americans don't know 2 degrees C = 3.6 degrees F. So most Americans are underestimating the effects of climate change by almost a factor of 2. And those are the ones that believe in it. I think the US should move to SI but as long as we haven't (and have actually taken steps backwards during the Bush administration) as far as I am concerned it is journalistic malpractice if not active disinformation to report temperature changes in C in US media.
- nemo44x 3y ago
  > I think the US should move to SI F is a much better unit than C for everyday use.
  - kd5bjo 3y ago
    Having lived in regions that use both, I have to say that there’s not much difference in everyday experience once you’ve gotten used to it. I don’t think I’d like to be dealing with Kelvin (the actual SI temperature unit) on an everyday basis, though. Or maybe I’d get used to it just as easily as switching between C and F.
  - Illniyar 3y ago
    I've used C all my life, but moved to the US lately and trying to start using F. Probably the easiest measurement change to get used to. There's very little difference in actual practice. C makes it easier to reason regarding freezing/boiling - it's simpler to think about if it's going to snow by relating it to 0 then 32. But that's about the only difference in day to day use I can think of. I haven't heard any reason to prefer F over C however (unlike Feet for example).
    - DataDive 3y ago
      > Probably the easiest measurement change to get used to. here is a counter-anecdotal evidence I moved to the US 25 years ago, still hate F with passion I gave it a serious go. After trying to get used to F for 20-some years, I went back and set all my thermometers and online weather maps to Celsius. Farenheit is an absurdly bad scale choice. It is needlessly granular for everyday use and feels wholly arbitrary. 32 degrees is freezing, so how far is 19 F from freezing? 32-19 ... ummm 13 degrees and that is as far as 32+19 ... ummm 51 degrees ... what are we talking about? -10 and +10 Celsius ... I still don't know if 120F would burn my hands or not, if 150 F scalds or not. I have no sense about temperatures above 100F (and that one only because it is a threshold for fever)
throwaway2016a 3y ago
This is cool but I found the UX confusing at first. It was not intuitive to me at all I had to scroll to see more information.
- pwagland 3y ago
  100% this! I thought that the website was just broken under Safari, it was only when I tried it in Chrome that I accidentally scrolled and discovered that actually it did work in Safari after all.
g051051 3y ago
The worst excesses of "modern" web presentation, coupled with a complete lack of actual gardening info...I'm completely baffled. 1% "here's your zone", and 99% "your zone is almost no use for gardening"
Illniyar 3y ago
This is such a well made site. Nice to look at, not too flashy and very informative. Made me keep reading on a subject I care not at all about.
cyanydeez 3y ago
They refuse to update so many hazard maps due to improved science, im amazed no ones disputed this
swalling 3y ago
This NPR map looks wrong in some places, I would just trust the actual USDA map https://planthardiness.ars.usda.gov/ https://planthardiness.ars.usda.gov/ For instance, the NPR source says that Portland, OR was reclassified as 9b, whereas the actual USDA map says that depending on your elevation, it's still either 8a or 8b.
downrightmike 3y ago
That little walking plant is cool for 5 seconds, but super annoying and you can't close it
adversaryIdiot 3y ago
how can i get that cute ass pot walking around my screen 24/7?
hasselhoftd 3y ago
[dead]
zwieback 3y ago
No change in my hometown of Corvallis OR but plenty of change in the areas surrounding the Willamette Valley.
Tiktaalik 3y ago
Was at the garden centre yesterday and on some plants over top the regular labels the store had put their own stickers on top: “Not winter hardy in our new climate” Kind of a “buyer beware” type thing for long time customers used to buying these plants that while previously dependable perennials now might not be. Really disturbing stuff to see.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- bagels 3y ago
  Because the minimum temperature is higher or lower than before?
  - Tiktaalik 3y ago
    I suspect due to colder weather and because of more erraticness. We've had some colder stretches and we're now experiencing more sudden cold snaps deeper into Spring. Latter situation especially bad if a plant is coming out of dormancy and then experiences freezing temperatures. The label I saw was on a native to Mexico plant.
tonymet 3y ago
[flagged]
VoodooJuJu 3y ago
I was excited to see this and the changes that occurred, but this "map" is one of those preachy hyperinteractive visual storytelling scrollslop things that the likes of NYT routinely creates. Anyone have a link to the actual map of the zone changes without the interactive TikTok experience?
j-bos 3y ago
While I didn't have patience to see the full page, the walking potted plant works perfectly on mobile! It was nice.
heavyset_go 3y ago
Doesn't work on my end with Firefox.

472 points by geox 3y ago

ericmay 3y ago

I thought that was a really nice website and visual journey.

nathanaldensr 3y ago

[flagged]

fred_is_fred 3y ago
I tried to actually use the map but nothing worked including the zip code search, it was pretty frustrating.
- giraffe_lady 3y ago
  It's city state not zip code.
  - fred_is_fred 3y ago
    Oops. The real map does zip code so I assumed that it would work there.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

blinding-streak 3y ago

Amazing job by NPR. Made a very dry topic really interesting.

taylodl 3y ago

There have been 3 updates to the zones in the past 50 years. Some of the updates are due to better accuracy after years of collecting data, but the 800-pound gorilla in the room is climate change. Where I live, winters are 4.5 degrees warmer. It has definitely affected my gardening.

onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
> Where I live, winters are 4.5 degrees warmer. 4.5 degrees warmer since when? And where?
- angry_moose 3y ago
  The map has an explanation: About this data The 2012 USDA hardiness zones were calculated using the average lowest winter temperature for the observation period of 1976-2005. The new zones are calculated using the years 1991-2020. These two observation windows overlap. Colors show the difference between the two 30-year averages for each place on the map. My area is 3.8F warmer using this method.
- playingalong 3y ago
  FWIW they likely mean Fahrenheit. I.e. 2.5 Celsius.
  - taylodl 3y ago
    Yes, I did. 4.5 degrees Celsius would be a newsworthy increase in winter temperatures! :)
    - voisin 3y ago
      Where I am at, in the Canadian Rockies, the daily temperature this winter was routinely 7-9 degrees Celsius above average (1970-2020) according to my iOS Weather app. They introduced this feature last year and I have been checking it nearly every day. Other than a cold snap in January (that killed my bees!) the weather was warmer every single day.
      - taylodl 3y ago
        You're hitting on another issue we gardeners are noticing - overall the temps are warmer, causing things to bud early, but there are still cold snaps. The cold snaps aren't any colder than they should be for the time of year, the problem is the inter-snap days are a lot warmer. This increased variance in temperature is actually worse than the average temperature getting warmer.

resource_waste 3y ago

[flagged]

coldpie 3y ago
> I am wondering why gardening is so popular. Because it's fun. It's cool & normal for people to shift hobbies. Sounds like you're ready to move on to a new one!
NeoTar 3y ago
Gardening isn't for everyone. You are completely allowed to have your own opinions ! Although perhaps we have a gap in our language here, since you seem to be against growing vegetables/herbs exclusively rather than what I'd call gardening which includes growing all plants, flowers, etc. Having a 'nice' looking garden (or at least one where you can sit comfortably) is the outcome of that sort of gardening. There are very few vegetables where growing them makes yourself much sense (economically). There are a few where you can 'fire and forget' basically, but even then it's a up-to few hours preparing the soil. In my climate zone, mint would be one - it's basically a weed, so it will grow and spread by itself. Also - you can't get Basil in store where you are? In the UK and Germany it's available either as fresh leaves, or as small plants costing about probably $1-2 each.
- lupusreal 3y ago
  I've found that growing heirloom tomatos is essentially effort-free; they keep coming back year after year without me having to do anything but pick them before the rats get to them. That "garden" is basically just a weed patch that makes free food.
- more_corn 3y ago
  I can see how it stopped being fun for you. No problem, go do something else you enjoy. I personally love to go out into the garden and just be there. I trimmed some branches yesterday because it needed doing but I didn’t go out there to do a chore. I went out because it was beautiful and I wanted to be there. I make a lot of money too and can work whenever. But taking frequent breaks keeps me sharp. I think better when I have some breaks and a few minutes in the garden is refreshing. I’m actually getting more into growing food. I have some ginger sprouting on my counter and can’t wait to find a home for it in the yard. The plum trees are captivating, we had a spectacular apple year last year. There’s something calm and sweet about going out to the tree, picking apples and turning them into a pie. To each his own though. I’d never push my hobbies on someone else or challenge anyone who started to find one of theirs unfulfilling.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

WarOnPrivacy 3y ago

West central FL has been losing winter. Anecdotally, I felt my lowest temps of the year go from teens (1990s) to high 30s & 40s. Not sure if it was my perception, I looked up a chart and it confirmed the trend. edit: I can't find the chart I saw for my region. The closest is this: Avg Jan temps but for whole state. https://www.ncei.noaa.gov/access/monitoring/climate-at-a-glance/statewide/time-series/8/tavg/1/1/1992-2024?base_prd=true&begbaseyear=1901&endbaseyear=2000 https://www.ncei.noaa.gov/access/monitoring/climate-at-a-gla...

kop316 3y ago

If you actually want to view the map: https://planthardiness.ars.usda.gov/ https://planthardiness.ars.usda.gov/ The frame link goes to: https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/b1d1fd9b284e46dcaa43959bec439b44/ https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/b1d1fd9b284e46dcaa4...

queuebert 3y ago
Thank you. That website was an abomination. Scrolling to do anything but move the content up should be highly discouraged.
- Workaccount2 3y ago
  The difference between people who look at data to be informed and people who look at data to feel informed.
  - jameshart 3y ago
    The website linked is a news article, not a map.
    - toss1 3y ago
      Yes, and the complaint is that news should be about informing, not about entertaining to make people feel informed [0]. This is more infotainment than information. [0] This concept implemented at scale by Roger Ailes, founder of Fox news, who famously said "Our viewers don't want be informed, they want to feel informed", which became the motto of the newsroom One ref among many: https://www.marketplace.org/2017/05/18/roger-ailes-transformed-american-politics-contact-sport/ https://www.marketplace.org/2017/05/18/roger-ailes-transform...
      - jameshart 3y ago
        The article provides useful context about how much the hardiness grades have changed, where, and why; it provides context about what these ratings do and don’t mean; it adds context about other climate changes that aren’t captured in this data; and it frames it with advice about planting, underpinned by a visually interesting data plot, and a tool that allows you to explore that data in a way that makes it personally relevant to you. Why on earth would you choose an article like this to jump on a hobby horse about infotainment?

jrgd 3y ago

and that's the canadian version; for those living up-north and frustrated like me to not be able to see something continent-wide http://planthardiness.gc.ca/?m=1 http://planthardiness.gc.ca/?m=1 i would love to see something for the south as well (just quickly googled) https://davisla.wordpress.com/plant-zones/south-america-plant-hardiness-zone-map/ https://davisla.wordpress.com/plant-zones/south-america-plan... I'm unsure though if they receive an update recently or if they will anytime soon

thrusong 3y ago
Thank you for this— I was equally frustrated I couldn't look up Canada too!

mithr 3y ago

Really nicely delivered, and a pretty great practical illustration (to the right audience) of the effects of global warming.

rqtwteye 3y ago

I so much hate this format where you have to scroll for each little paragraph and can't jump quickly from one part to another.

asdajksah2123 3y ago

I wish the US had a similar "bug zone". Where I live has seen a whole slew of bugs that did not exist beyond several states South making it all the way up here over the last decade and a half.

JKCalhoun 3y ago
Armadillos now as far north as Illinois, Nebraska. Wild.
tcmart14 3y ago
I havn't seen maps for bugs in general. But there are some maps the track specific bugs. Like I check for maps regarding ticks. They are getting farther and farther north.
greenie_beans 3y ago
this is a cool idea

dgrin91 3y ago

I'm really curious about the taxonomy of these zones. Why are there 13 zones with an 'a' and 'b' zone for each number? Why not just 26 zones?

bombcar 3y ago
The Plant Hardiness Zone Map (PHZM) is based on the average annual extreme minimum winter temperature, displayed as 10-degree F zones ranging from zone 1 (coldest) to zone 13 (warmest). Each zone is divided into half zones designated as ‘a’ and ‘b’. For example, 7a and 7b are 5-degree F increments representing the colder and warmer halves of zone 7, respectively. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardiness_zone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardiness_zone (It was originally the 13 bands, but as things got more detailed they realized splitting them made a difference, I suspect.)
hosh 3y ago
The “a” and “b” zones subdivides it. Zone 10 is tropical, and never gets frost. Each “a” and “b” represents a 5 degree range. You can also create microclimates, local areas where the zone effectively shifts up or down about 5 degrees. As an aside, there is a heat hardiness zone that rarely gets talked about.
- madcaptenor 3y ago
  You can find that if you scroll down the article far enough, or at https://ahsgardening.org/about-us/news-press/cool_timeline/heat-zone-map-developed/ https://ahsgardening.org/about-us/news-press/cool_timeline/h... - it's based on the number of days above 86 degrees F (30 degrees C). I would like to see these two maps overlaid on each other somehow.
VyseofArcadia 3y ago
Because it was initially divided into 13 zones. In 1990 they subdivided each zone into a and b zones. I'm not finding any rationale on why subdividing instead of renumbering, but it probably alleviated confusion at the time. If you're in zone 6b, but you're used to thinking of yourself as zone 6, you're still mostly right even if you forget whether you're in a or b. Easier to remember than suddenly you're in zone 13.

willcodeforfoo 3y ago

Really nice data visualization... PMTiles! https://apps.npr.org/plant-hardiness-garden-map/assets/synced/pmtiles/usda_zones.pmtiles https://apps.npr.org/plant-hardiness-garden-map/assets/synce...

monkburger 3y ago

I've gone from 6b to 7a. Winters almost do not exist here in the mid-Atlantic. Sure, there are some cold snaps, but they do not last as long as 20 to 30 years ago. Snowfall? Getting less and less with an occasional nor'easter here and there. Ancedotally, in late February, I had to mow the lawn. We've started measuring TTFF. (Time-to-first-frost). Historically, it was in early to mid October for decades. Now it's pushing mid-November. The growing seasons are longer, for sure.

kbenson 3y ago
> Winters almost do not exist here ... Snowfall? Getting less and less with an occasional nor'easter here and there. That seems like a regional saying, which translates very poorly to an online global audience. I read winters almost do not exist and assumed you were being more literal than "there's less snow". It's snowed here 2-3 times in the last couple decades, each time for maybe a minute or two. I still wouldn't say we don't have a winter. For this area, winter is when it rains. Which is different than summer because there's no rain in the summer, almost ever (maybe one day on average as freak weather). Edit: I seem to have struck a nerve here, but I'm not sure why noting that a particular turn of phrase might be confusing to people from other areas would do so.
- monkburger 3y ago
  Our last big snowstorm was in 2016. Afterwards we were in a snowfall drought for years (well below average) We had a few close calls for big snow, but they never materialized. This is unheard of. Even during strong El Nino patterns, the east coast is supposed to receive good snowfall. It did not happen. Even with a -NAO, -AO, +PNA!
  - kbenson 3y ago
    My point was that in some areas they equate winter with snow, and reduction of snow seems to be interpreted as no winter. If the weather patter is still notably different than summer, it's winter. Equating snow in the current area to winter and lack of it to not being winter is a regional thing. It makes certain statements, like "winters almost do not exist here" come across very differently to people in other regions, which what what I was trying to express. For example, my initial interpretation of your early statements in that comment was that you were saying there's little difference between fall and spring from winter, that your winters don't have a noticeable difference to the other seasons. From the rest of your comment it sounds like it's just somewhat milder than it used to be, but still notably different weather pattern.

unnamed76ri 3y ago

When this new map was first released, it was very amusing watching people in gardening Facebook groups start planning to grow plants that have died whenever they tried in the past. Just because the government gave them a new number, they think it suddenly changed the reality on the ground. I grow 25+ kinds of fruit and I’d love to add more. But the reality is that fruits like figs and muscadines still die every winter where I am at.

TylerE 3y ago

Does anyone else HATE pages like this? Just show me the damn map and not 5 different pop up overlays, many animated, depending on how hard scrolled down I am. Oh, and their "zip code" search is broken, it takes me to the state capital over a hundred miles away, in a totally different climactic zone. Doubly broken.

tzs 3y ago
They don't have a zip code search as far as I can tell. It asks you to enter your city and state or use the "Surprise me!" button.
- TylerE 3y ago
  99.9% of web search forms that ask for a city accept a zip code, and are often more accurate when doing so, as even a mid sized city can be composed of dozens of zip codes, never mind places like Central Manhattan where some zipcodes resolve all the way down to single buildings.
  - itslennysfault 3y ago
    ...but this page is part of the 0.1% (by your math) that actually wants what it asked for. So, this is just a case of user error. Enter what it asked for and it works great.
    - tuumi 3y ago
      Harrison Township, Michigan goes to Harrison City, PA. I then tried the city to the south - Saint Clair Shores, MI and that took me to San Antonio, Texas. I'm working in East China, Michigan and that took me to East Chicago, Indiana. I ended up just using Detroit, MI to get anything useful. So, no, that doesn't work either.
- interestica 3y ago
  As a Canadian, constraining the data viz by political border is annoying.

mattgrice 3y ago

It is very nice to see US-targeted media use F. All climate related news seems to use C and I'd bet that 95%+ of Americans don't know 2 degrees C = 3.6 degrees F. So most Americans are underestimating the effects of climate change by almost a factor of 2. And those are the ones that believe in it. I think the US should move to SI but as long as we haven't (and have actually taken steps backwards during the Bush administration) as far as I am concerned it is journalistic malpractice if not active disinformation to report temperature changes in C in US media.

nemo44x 3y ago
> I think the US should move to SI F is a much better unit than C for everyday use.
- kd5bjo 3y ago
  Having lived in regions that use both, I have to say that there’s not much difference in everyday experience once you’ve gotten used to it. I don’t think I’d like to be dealing with Kelvin (the actual SI temperature unit) on an everyday basis, though. Or maybe I’d get used to it just as easily as switching between C and F.
- Illniyar 3y ago
  I've used C all my life, but moved to the US lately and trying to start using F. Probably the easiest measurement change to get used to. There's very little difference in actual practice. C makes it easier to reason regarding freezing/boiling - it's simpler to think about if it's going to snow by relating it to 0 then 32. But that's about the only difference in day to day use I can think of. I haven't heard any reason to prefer F over C however (unlike Feet for example).
  - DataDive 3y ago
    > Probably the easiest measurement change to get used to. here is a counter-anecdotal evidence I moved to the US 25 years ago, still hate F with passion I gave it a serious go. After trying to get used to F for 20-some years, I went back and set all my thermometers and online weather maps to Celsius. Farenheit is an absurdly bad scale choice. It is needlessly granular for everyday use and feels wholly arbitrary. 32 degrees is freezing, so how far is 19 F from freezing? 32-19 ... ummm 13 degrees and that is as far as 32+19 ... ummm 51 degrees ... what are we talking about? -10 and +10 Celsius ... I still don't know if 120F would burn my hands or not, if 150 F scalds or not. I have no sense about temperatures above 100F (and that one only because it is a threshold for fever)

throwaway2016a 3y ago

This is cool but I found the UX confusing at first. It was not intuitive to me at all I had to scroll to see more information.

pwagland 3y ago
100% this! I thought that the website was just broken under Safari, it was only when I tried it in Chrome that I accidentally scrolled and discovered that actually it did work in Safari after all.

g051051 3y ago

The worst excesses of "modern" web presentation, coupled with a complete lack of actual gardening info...I'm completely baffled. 1% "here's your zone", and 99% "your zone is almost no use for gardening"

Illniyar 3y ago

This is such a well made site. Nice to look at, not too flashy and very informative. Made me keep reading on a subject I care not at all about.

cyanydeez 3y ago

They refuse to update so many hazard maps due to improved science, im amazed no ones disputed this

swalling 3y ago

This NPR map looks wrong in some places, I would just trust the actual USDA map https://planthardiness.ars.usda.gov/ https://planthardiness.ars.usda.gov/ For instance, the NPR source says that Portland, OR was reclassified as 9b, whereas the actual USDA map says that depending on your elevation, it's still either 8a or 8b.

downrightmike 3y ago

That little walking plant is cool for 5 seconds, but super annoying and you can't close it

adversaryIdiot 3y ago

how can i get that cute ass pot walking around my screen 24/7?

hasselhoftd 3y ago

[dead]

zwieback 3y ago

No change in my hometown of Corvallis OR but plenty of change in the areas surrounding the Willamette Valley.

Tiktaalik 3y ago

Was at the garden centre yesterday and on some plants over top the regular labels the store had put their own stickers on top: “Not winter hardy in our new climate” Kind of a “buyer beware” type thing for long time customers used to buying these plants that while previously dependable perennials now might not be. Really disturbing stuff to see.

deleted 3y ago
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bagels 3y ago
Because the minimum temperature is higher or lower than before?
- Tiktaalik 3y ago
  I suspect due to colder weather and because of more erraticness. We've had some colder stretches and we're now experiencing more sudden cold snaps deeper into Spring. Latter situation especially bad if a plant is coming out of dormancy and then experiences freezing temperatures. The label I saw was on a native to Mexico plant.

tonymet 3y ago

[flagged]

VoodooJuJu 3y ago

I was excited to see this and the changes that occurred, but this "map" is one of those preachy hyperinteractive visual storytelling scrollslop things that the likes of NYT routinely creates. Anyone have a link to the actual map of the zone changes without the interactive TikTok experience?

j-bos 3y ago

While I didn't have patience to see the full page, the walking potted plant works perfectly on mobile! It was nice.

heavyset_go 3y ago

Doesn't work on my end with Firefox.