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Remember also that who you are (or even just the fact that you are) is in a very large part due to them. You are also fully allowed to feel an unconditional gr

Remember also that who you are (or even just the fact that you are) is in a very large part due to them. You are also fully allowed to feel an unconditional gratitude (dare I say, love) towards them for simply existing, while accepting them as they are, as individuals, without owing each other anything, and regardless of what they have done or not done. It also takes some people way too long to realize this, and it can be a liberating feeling.

anonzzzies 2y ago
> Remember also that who you are (or even just the fact that you are) is in a very large part due to them. Remember that you didn't ask for that though.
silverquiet 2y ago
Not everyone is thrilled about existing, and they didn't get a say in that. I could never imagine having children and I never understood why people wanted them, and then I realized that these people must have actually enjoyed their childhood; a concept that was obviously foreign to me. I don't harbor any ill will towards my parents, but nothing for me is unconditional.
- Aeolun 2y ago
  I had a fantastic childhood (well, compared to the mean I guess), but that doesn’t mean my love of my parents is unconditional.
  - silverquiet 2y ago
    I suppose the implication is that most people who say they had miserable childhoods blame their parents; I might be a bit odd in that I think my parents did really well, but my problems are inherent to me, and that is why I can't really be mad at them. In some sense, you can blame your parents for everything since they provide both the nature and the nurture, but if you think they truly meant well, it's hard to resent them.
    - iteria 2y ago
      > if you think they truly meant well, it's hard to resent them. It's easy to resent someone who means well if what they're trying to do is make you miserable because they can't see how you could be happy. That's my parents. They can't fathom how I can enjoy my life and and have done everything in their power to keep me from living the way I want to live. They are willfully ignoring that I'm not them. They may have good intentions but I had a happy childhood in spite of them, not because of them. If adults in the world didn't take an interest in and see me, I could have been a miserable person. So in that sense, I do resent them. Good intentions don't mean anything when you refuse to acknowledge people as they are instead of who they are.
      - silverquiet 2y ago
        My parents are religious and I am not, but I wish I could believe what they believe.
      - Aeolun 2y ago
        > Good intentions don't mean anything when you refuse to acknowledge people as they are instead of who they are. Was the last part meant to be: “Who you want them to be?” I mean, that’s kinda hard as a parent, since you bring children into the world to raise them as you think they should be. If they then ignore all of that and go their own way, while perfectly acceptable, I can see how that’d suck for them. I guess that’s my biggest worry as a parent anyway. I want them to be happy, but I also want them to be what I consider to be ‘good’.
- slumberlust 2y ago
  We have a 3.5 year old who is amazing and has brought a lot of joy to our lives. I had a great childhood and still questioned if it was irresponsible to bring a child into a world of inherent suffering. Ultimately, planned parenting is a selfish act.
  - entropicdrifter 2y ago
    >Ultimately, planned parenting is a selfish act. I agree, but with the exception that parenting adopted children is not selfish
- bombcar 2y ago
  I know a decent handful of people who definitely did NOT enjoy their childhood (or at least had major issues that they'd rather not have had; it's not like they never had any fun whatsoever) who have quite enjoyable families now; they've intentionally set out to avoid the pitfalls that happened to them and actively work to identify other ones.
  - silverquiet 2y ago
    Mine was due to medical issues; not all pitfalls are avoidable.
growingkittens 2y ago
I am a good person in spite of my parents. My existence is difficult because my parents were abusive and negligent to a disabled child. My right to exist was questioned by the very people who created me. Is there a viable path toward realizing that I am 'allowed' to feel unconditional gratitude towards my parents for existing?
- malfist 2y ago
  I don't think gp was suggesting you should forgive all and love. Just, don't judge those that do (or don't), but maybe I'm reading it differently.
  - tomrod 2y ago
    It really seemed like the grandparent commentator was chiding the mention that relationships aren't only held together by blood, and that children don't have a choice in who birthed them nor who raised them through childhood. In many cases, perhaps more than most people are comfortable with, children are raised by malicious parents.
    - Aeolun 2y ago
      I don’t think children are raised by malicious parents (at least, in the far majority of cases). They’re just often raised by people that didn’t know what they were in for, and have no idea how to live, much less how to parent. It’s a miracle most kids turn out ok despite that, but I’m fairly certain it’s evolved to be that way.
      - KittenInABox 2y ago
        In the far majority of cases, people are behaving commonly, including common parent behavior. However, significant amounts of minorities exist in this state. Just because a demographic is a minority doesn't mean its considerate to behave as if the demographic doesn't exist at all. Some people are genuinely having children for completely malicious reasons, like using a child as a tool to trap a domestic abuse victim, for which no gratitude is warranted or reasonable. And I daresay telling those children "you are who you are because of them" is horrifying and cruel.
beretguy 2y ago
> Remember also that who you are (or even just the fact that you are) is in a very large part due to them. I’ve got a PTSD when it comes to being in a relationship and struggling to make my own family because my parents cheated on one another, and I’m in huge debt and living in friend’s house because I allowed them to move into my house after they lost their incomes due to covid. Yeah, I remember everything.
oblio 2y ago
You should probably add a clause in there that this refers to people with happy (or at least average) childhoods. The internet is fairly unfiltered (and uncensored) so you hear a lot about people with horribly childhoods. It's probably a good thing for humanity as a whole but man, does it bum you out sometimes... let alone living through said horrible childhoods.
- throw_pm23 2y ago
  No my point was that adopting this feeling of unconditional gratitude can be liberating even if one had a miserable childhood.
astura 2y ago
>You are also fully allowed to feel an unconditional gratitude (dare I say, love) towards them for simply existing Excuse me? This terrible life was imposed on me against my will be mean and evil people. I will absolutely not be "grateful" for it.

anonzzzies 2y ago

> Remember also that who you are (or even just the fact that you are) is in a very large part due to them. Remember that you didn't ask for that though.

silverquiet 2y ago

Not everyone is thrilled about existing, and they didn't get a say in that. I could never imagine having children and I never understood why people wanted them, and then I realized that these people must have actually enjoyed their childhood; a concept that was obviously foreign to me. I don't harbor any ill will towards my parents, but nothing for me is unconditional.

Aeolun 2y ago
I had a fantastic childhood (well, compared to the mean I guess), but that doesn’t mean my love of my parents is unconditional.
- silverquiet 2y ago
  I suppose the implication is that most people who say they had miserable childhoods blame their parents; I might be a bit odd in that I think my parents did really well, but my problems are inherent to me, and that is why I can't really be mad at them. In some sense, you can blame your parents for everything since they provide both the nature and the nurture, but if you think they truly meant well, it's hard to resent them.
  - iteria 2y ago
    > if you think they truly meant well, it's hard to resent them. It's easy to resent someone who means well if what they're trying to do is make you miserable because they can't see how you could be happy. That's my parents. They can't fathom how I can enjoy my life and and have done everything in their power to keep me from living the way I want to live. They are willfully ignoring that I'm not them. They may have good intentions but I had a happy childhood in spite of them, not because of them. If adults in the world didn't take an interest in and see me, I could have been a miserable person. So in that sense, I do resent them. Good intentions don't mean anything when you refuse to acknowledge people as they are instead of who they are.
    - silverquiet 2y ago
      My parents are religious and I am not, but I wish I could believe what they believe.
    - Aeolun 2y ago
      > Good intentions don't mean anything when you refuse to acknowledge people as they are instead of who they are. Was the last part meant to be: “Who you want them to be?” I mean, that’s kinda hard as a parent, since you bring children into the world to raise them as you think they should be. If they then ignore all of that and go their own way, while perfectly acceptable, I can see how that’d suck for them. I guess that’s my biggest worry as a parent anyway. I want them to be happy, but I also want them to be what I consider to be ‘good’.
slumberlust 2y ago
We have a 3.5 year old who is amazing and has brought a lot of joy to our lives. I had a great childhood and still questioned if it was irresponsible to bring a child into a world of inherent suffering. Ultimately, planned parenting is a selfish act.
- entropicdrifter 2y ago
  >Ultimately, planned parenting is a selfish act. I agree, but with the exception that parenting adopted children is not selfish
bombcar 2y ago
I know a decent handful of people who definitely did NOT enjoy their childhood (or at least had major issues that they'd rather not have had; it's not like they never had any fun whatsoever) who have quite enjoyable families now; they've intentionally set out to avoid the pitfalls that happened to them and actively work to identify other ones.
- silverquiet 2y ago
  Mine was due to medical issues; not all pitfalls are avoidable.

growingkittens 2y ago

I am a good person in spite of my parents. My existence is difficult because my parents were abusive and negligent to a disabled child. My right to exist was questioned by the very people who created me. Is there a viable path toward realizing that I am 'allowed' to feel unconditional gratitude towards my parents for existing?

malfist 2y ago
I don't think gp was suggesting you should forgive all and love. Just, don't judge those that do (or don't), but maybe I'm reading it differently.
- tomrod 2y ago
  It really seemed like the grandparent commentator was chiding the mention that relationships aren't only held together by blood, and that children don't have a choice in who birthed them nor who raised them through childhood. In many cases, perhaps more than most people are comfortable with, children are raised by malicious parents.
  - Aeolun 2y ago
    I don’t think children are raised by malicious parents (at least, in the far majority of cases). They’re just often raised by people that didn’t know what they were in for, and have no idea how to live, much less how to parent. It’s a miracle most kids turn out ok despite that, but I’m fairly certain it’s evolved to be that way.
    - KittenInABox 2y ago
      In the far majority of cases, people are behaving commonly, including common parent behavior. However, significant amounts of minorities exist in this state. Just because a demographic is a minority doesn't mean its considerate to behave as if the demographic doesn't exist at all. Some people are genuinely having children for completely malicious reasons, like using a child as a tool to trap a domestic abuse victim, for which no gratitude is warranted or reasonable. And I daresay telling those children "you are who you are because of them" is horrifying and cruel.

beretguy 2y ago

> Remember also that who you are (or even just the fact that you are) is in a very large part due to them. I’ve got a PTSD when it comes to being in a relationship and struggling to make my own family because my parents cheated on one another, and I’m in huge debt and living in friend’s house because I allowed them to move into my house after they lost their incomes due to covid. Yeah, I remember everything.

oblio 2y ago

You should probably add a clause in there that this refers to people with happy (or at least average) childhoods. The internet is fairly unfiltered (and uncensored) so you hear a lot about people with horribly childhoods. It's probably a good thing for humanity as a whole but man, does it bum you out sometimes... let alone living through said horrible childhoods.

throw_pm23 2y ago
No my point was that adopting this feeling of unconditional gratitude can be liberating even if one had a miserable childhood.

astura 2y ago

>You are also fully allowed to feel an unconditional gratitude (dare I say, love) towards them for simply existing Excuse me? This terrible life was imposed on me against my will be mean and evil people. I will absolutely not be "grateful" for it.