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New iPad Pro with M4 chip and Apple Pencil Pro

114 points by praseodym 2y ago

bilsbie 2y ago
Would it be possible to code on this? I’m looking for an alternative to sitting at a desk all day.
- KeplerBoy 2y ago
  sure, you can expose your workstation with a vscode tunnel and access stuff via the web.
  - hbn 2y ago
    Seems overkill to get an M4-powered device to use as a dumb terminal.
- 1023bytes 2y ago
  Not really. But you can remote into a real computer.
  - bilsbie 2y ago
    So a windows tablet would make more sense?
    - natrys 2y ago
      Why not an Android with termux? I guess it would depend upon your software stack, but my editor (Emacs) will have native Android port soon and I am stoked to try it. The latest Snapdragon processors are fairly powerful (and Mediatek/Dimensity ones aren't lagging behind either).
      - bilsbie 2y ago
        Please report back!
- reachableceo 2y ago
  I code on mine frequently. Using working copy and buffer. With git push and ci/cd it’s a great experience.
  - bilsbie 2y ago
    What’s buffer? ( I’m getting no relevant search results)
yakshaving_jgt 2y ago
The iPad is an excellent form factor for using on aeroplanes. I wish my iPad would let me play Fallout 4. That, with a normal Xbox controller, would be just perfect for passing the time while flying.
retskrad 2y ago
Apple is just being slick. The M4 is a slightly tweaked M3.
- vlod 2y ago
  I was wondering why they keep comparing it to the M2 [0] rather than the M3. I guess the M3 never got to the iPad. [0]: https://www.apple.com/ipad-pro/ https://www.apple.com/ipad-pro/ (search for: learn how m4 powers performance)
  - eitally 2y ago
    Fwiw, when they launched the M3 MacBook they also compared it primarily to the M1 rather than the M2... same reasons.
- minimaxir 2y ago
  Honestly this just makes me happier that I invested in a M3 MacBook Pro.
jsheard 2y ago
Is this tandem OLED display a first? I'm familiar with stacked LCD displays, they've been around for a while though mainly in reference monitors due to their inefficiency, but this is the first I've heard of anyone stacking two OLEDs on top of each other.
- etempleton 2y ago
  First I have heard of it in a consumer device. I suspect this is why the M4 is launching with this device. They are probably using the added efficiency to power the Tandem OLED without sacrificing performance / battery life compared to the previous gen. I will be interested to see what this looks like in person and if it makes it to consumer televisions. I personally find OLED bright enough for indoor use, but a lot of people complain about the reduced brightness on OLED TVs and monitors.
  - jwells89 2y ago
    The most common situation where screen brightness is an issue for me is in rooms with big windows and a lot of natural light. On sunny days I find ~400nits to be about the minimum required to cut through glare on matte displays… for mirror-like glossy displays it’s even higher.
  - jsheard 2y ago
    Aside from higher peak brightness I would assume it's also less prone to burn-in, the rate that OLED pixels degrade is proportional to how bright they run, and distributing the brightness over two stacked layers means each layer only needs to run roughly half as bright. Not exactly half since the top layer won't be perfectly transparent, but close enough.
- nerdjon 2y ago
  I was curious about that also, trying to look past the marketing speak on whether or not this is actually as big of a thing as they are saying it is? Particularly compared to OLED on TV's.
- throwaway290 2y ago
chrisshroba 2y ago
The gyroscope and haptic feedback in the apple pencil pro seem pretty cool for artists and other creative uses!
- jeffbee 2y ago
  Yeah, it looks pretty awesome, I am just a little afraid of the price. I want to see one of these in person so I can feel the textured screen. Does it actually have a "feel"? I currently use a textured screen cover for iPad art and it has a great feel but everything else about it is terrible, from the mandatory daily cleaning to the way it grinds pencil tips. But I guess I will never find out since it would cost $1548 to replace my existing 12.9 iPad Pro, net of the trade-in. Yikes. Could probably get double the trade value they are offering on eBay or Craigslist.
daft_pink 2y ago
It doesn’t move the needle for me to purchase it. My m1 iPad Pro still does everything I want it to and I don’t use it that often, but when I do I love it.
- etchalon 2y ago
  The curse of Apple Silicon. Everything's basically "fast enough" already.
  - divan 2y ago
    I have iPad Pro from 2020 (pre M1). It's still way faster than I need (most heavy work I do on laptop) and still unbelievably good. The only thing I miss is the ability to read under the bright sun. New Tandem screen unlikely to change it, so I'm opting in for 13.3" e-paper tablet. As I often read academic papers, that should be a killer one, but new 13" iPads also look promising for that!
    - cjk2 2y ago
      I have the same problem. I still print mine out and read them on paper. Low tech but it's the best experience.
      - divan 2y ago
        I ordered Onyx Boox Tab X – seems to be the only real option out there. It has Android, so it's possible to use your favorite reader/app on it (I'm using ReadCube Papers). Can't wait to try it.
  - cjk2 2y ago
    That's a good point actually. I can't seem to even bend my M1 Pro MBP. It just eats everything I throw at it and shrugs. It's coming up to 3 years old now and looks like and works like the day it was made.
    - ailurooo 2y ago
wannacboatmovie 2y ago
So they've officially killed off the last iPad with a home button. Elderly folks let out a collective groan since swapping a simple UI for an additional .5" of screen space seems like a poor tradeoff.
- alephnerd 2y ago
  That button is an increasingly expensive component at scale, as it's a separate component to manufacture and build a supply chain for, as well as an additional component to add which can potentially fail. This is why most carmakers are moving towards touchscreens now as well. If you want to keep prices roughly comparable to previous SKUs in the midst of trade and supply chain kerfuffles, there has to be cost cutting somewhere.
  - switch007 2y ago
    Apple is indeed struggling and need to cut costs in every conceivable way
    - alephnerd 2y ago
      Every company that has some form of manufacturing is doing similar cost reductions. Supply Chain is hard enough in a globalized world, and it's only gotten even harder now that a multi-year pandemic shutdown, trade wars, and tariffs are coming to play.
    - paulmd 2y ago
      The fact that nerds constantly react sardonically like this is unfortunate for multiple areas of tech discussion, just like people react so negatively to the rising costs of gpu SKUs as well. It’s poisonous to actual debate and discussion, just children lashing out in anger that their toys are getting more expensive.
      - switch007 2y ago
        I think this highlights your financial privilege more than anything. And it’s pretty tone deaf during a time of some pretty shocking inflation, not all of which is justified
paxys 2y ago
Here's the new iDevice. Same as the old iDevice, just with a ton of marketing and a 5% performance improvement. And you can do nothing with the added performance because it still runs a fully locked down OS. Yawn.
- CooCooCaCha 2y ago
  OLED, faster chip, better camera, improved accessories are all pretty nice things and definitely not the same device. You Apple haters are tiresome. Hardware-wise what else do you want it to do?
- jinushaun 2y ago
  What’s wrong with that? Every new version is an upgrade for somebody. Not everyone is trying to upgrade every year. That’s wasteful.
  - dlivingston 2y ago
    Who is the 'somebody'? Genuinely, I don't understand what segment of consumers will actually be leveraging the compute in this device.
- ulfw 2y ago
  I have (sad) news for you: That goes for MOST of the world. Do you truly think in whatever new version of Nike sneakers there's truly something new and revolutionary in it or more likely "a ton of marketing and a 5% performance improvement"?
taco_emoji 2y ago
America's most innovative tech company introduces... Widget 7.0
iamsam123 2y ago
Interesting how many different offerings they have now outside of just spending the initial ~$1000 on the ipad itself. Purchasing the pencil, usb-c, key board, smart folio, logic pro (subscription), final cut (subscription), etc... I'd be curious to know the average age of an ipad in circulation is now. I used an ipad for school from 2012-2017, never used the apple pencil, but it always worked great for my needs. My girlfriend got one for med school and uses it with the pencil especially when shes not at home.
- alephnerd 2y ago
  +1 on the med student usecase. Same with my SO.
- cm2187 2y ago
  The non replaceable battery is I believe the way the make old ipads obsolete.
  - fckgw 2y ago
    A new battery is ~$100 parts and labor
    - cm2187 2y ago
      Not from Apple. They run it through a software that "tests" the battery and always returns "good" and tell you they can't do anything for you.
      - amiantos 2y ago
        Tinfoil hat talk.
        slackfan 2y ago
        do not believe your lying eyes!
      - 2y ago
anonymouse008 2y ago
@apple team: whomever approved your hydraulic press imagery forgot that "standing on the shoulders of giants" is an appreciation of, not a license to stomp on. words matter, images matter, it's how you tell us who you are.
- numpad0 2y ago
  I think it conveys its concept well: a lesser equivalent at high cost, aimed to destroy things of value, embracing AI cultural revolution.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
- ncr100 2y ago
  It was repulsive and disturbing to me. That piano could have been used. * My other comment https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40292445 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40292445
  - anonymouse008 2y ago
    Even if 'no animals were harmed' in the making, as in they pulled some filming tricks... it's still a disturbing message. They once understood 'marketing is about values' // what a sad value they proclaimed today, destroy the essence for our entertainment.
- kylehotchkiss 2y ago
  I don’t get the controversy about this. At landfills with self service all over the USA, probably tens of thousands of Americans dumped substantially more useful stuff than that into the hydraulic trash compactor machine today. I sincerely don’t know what to do with old printers, I’d probably go drop it in there. Along with a bunch of old doors from my house. Sure they could be reused but how am I supposed to find the time and energy to get them to a new home? Have you ever tried to bring a bunch of stuff to goodwill? They sure say no to a lot of it!
drewcon 2y ago
I would buy this JUST for the camera being in a place that makes face unlock not fail 99% of the time because I'm covering the camera with my thumb.
- cjk2 2y ago
  Ah yeah this pisses me off on my M2 iPad Pro. Totally agree there. I'm still not buying it though.
- nijuashi 2y ago
  YES! This was a long overdue “feature”.
jauntywundrkind 2y ago
Every time Apple ups their display game, I shout, "Finally, someone else will have to take action & up their game! This will finally spurn everyone else into trying!" So far, not much luck! And once again, Apple critically one-upping their themselves, while it feels like no one's started competing with the old product. OLED with 1000 nit full screen sdr output? That's 4x what most OLED monitors can do! 1600 nit hdr is great too. These are amazing systems, must be stunning to see. I wish there were general purpose computers like this that could run Linux. I wish others could compete. Apple keeps being the SpaceX to the industry's Boeing.
hartator 2y ago
Running MacOS on this will be a dream. Very hard to be productive coding on iPadOS. Even if it does become more and more possible with side-by-side windows, native terminals, and more versatile copy/paste.
- fragmede 2y ago
  You just know there's a lucky Apple engineer out there that has MacOS running on a iPad for testing purposes.
blindriver 2y ago
I try really hard to use my iPad but I forget about it most days. Sometimes I’ll watch movies on it in bed and that’s about it. A complete waste of money for me. The only time it truly was helpful was during online interviews when I could draw system design diagrams with the Apple pencil on them during zoom calls instead of using a mouse. Haven’t really used them since.
cletus 2y ago
I'm struggling to see why I'd buy this over a Macbook Air. I have an iPad Air. I use it a lot but generally just to watch Netflix or Youtube. I don't enjoy typing on it at all. I have the Air specifically because it's TouchID. I hate FaceID with a passion. But this update has pushed up the iPad Pro price well into the Macbook territory and that's a much more capable and flexible device.
- cjk2 2y ago
  Tha main reasons I own an (11") iPad Pro are, you can write on it, which is really damn useful, you can wedge it places like tables on planes easier, it weighs hardly anything and you can charge it off a phone charger. Plus being TB based I can suck stuff off my camera without a dongle or any of that faff. But yeah an MBA is more powerful, but it doesn't have those attributes. If I was to start again I'd buy a bottom end Mac Studio for the 32Gb RAM baseline config, hang some TB drives off it and use the iPad as my "portable" computer.
- D13Fd 2y ago
  The MacBook Air is better for sure, and if you only buy one, buy that one -- full stop. But I use both, every day, at the same time. They are designed to work together. With universal control, my iPad sits next to my screen at work, and I do some things on the iPad, some on the MacBook. I also use my iPad on its own around the house. It's also incredibly nice for CAD work (Shapr3d) and photo processing (Lightroom). The iPad is much more resilient to water, food, and dust. I design things in Shapr3d on the iPad and take the iPad to the garage to build them -- a little sawdust does not hurt it and it's easy to clean. It's also much better if you want to read while eating, especially with kids around. The keyboard doesn't get in the way and spilled water won't hurt it either. I use it while cooking and to watch TV while washing dishes. The other thing the iPad can do that the MBA can't is that it's easily shareable. If you work with others, it's easy to pull up a PDF on an iPad and hand it to someone to look at or even annotate with the pencil. There is no awkward standing over your shoulder or handing off a laptop. Everyone instantly knows how to work with you on the iPad, and to review whatever you want them to review and hand it back. Overall I still use my MacBook Air more, and it's more capable. You can't do serious coding or development work on the iPad, for example. But it's very much worth having the iPad as well, at least for me.
busymom0 2y ago
I think the iPad hardware has been outstanding for many years. It's the software which is is limiting it constantly. They should let us put macOS or Linux on it. Or be able to do full on dev work (I realize some dev work is possible). If I could do my iOS and Android app dev on iPad, it would be instant buy.
- asabla 2y ago
  I think vittualization would be enough. Especially if it works well with an external monitor.
  - busymom0 2y ago
    I need to be able to debug apps on physical devices from the iPad. And it needs to be wired connection because debugging over wifi even on my Mac is very bad (lots of complaints online about it too).
- dan-allen 2y ago
  Yeah iPad hardware is sadly limited by software and I think Apple shoots themselves in the foot. It took them a long time to start allowing apps to use meaningful amounts of ram and managing custom fonts is a mess. I also suspect the limited number of “pro” apps is partly thanks to how the App Store runs. If I were going to invest in developing powerful software for iPad, being at App Review’s whims and ever-changing policies seems like a pretty big risk.
Geee 2y ago
Anyone has experience with CAD modeling in Shapr3d with the Pencil? Does it make sense buying this device for this purpose?
fwef64 2y ago
With every new iPad they release I'm hopeful they add a support for virtualization. If I could run linux in a docker on an iPad I would switch to it as my main computing instantly, but as of right now I don't see a reason to upgrade what's basically a glorified ebook reader and Netflix player.
- transpute 2y ago
  iPad Pro's 2024 hardware overachievement eclipses even the iPhone, for the first time. Will iPadOS 18 be unshackled to drive the M4? We'll find out at WWDC next month, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40287922 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40287922
a2128 2y ago
Apple's sections about the environment in their announcements always makes me feel like I'm being gaslit as they mention anything but repair and supporting the consumer's right to reduce and re-use
- cjk2 2y ago
  The iPad is the notable omission from the Self Service Repair thing they are doing. I suspect it's just classified as disposable/recyclable. (yes this annoys me)
  - sp332 2y ago
    The larger one is 5.1mm thick. There aren't separate components any more, it's a smear of glue with some silicon and batteries suspended in it.
  - ncr100 2y ago
    AH could that be why their "thinnest iPad" advertisement was to crush usable piano, metronome, etc? the iPad division // department does NOT respect reuse?
- ninininino 2y ago
  I think the source of your sort of unconscious discomfort is because corporate speak is not about truth or justice or any moral/ethical system, it's about reputation-management of the firm and profit. They usually won't make direct provable lies, but will leave out any information that does not boost their reputation even if it's relevant or contradicts their messaging. But importantly, they are appealing to a sense of moral virtue when they brag about environmental responsibility or privacy, even if they aren't taking a lens of truth and justice to their analysis and messaging, but a biased one that ultimately favors profit. This dissonance in tone vs real motive is really painful to people who care about nuance and truth and moral good, because it means they muddy the waters of what is right and wrong and confuse us.
- gorwell 2y ago
  They're bold enough to say they're carbon neutral. "Today, Apple is carbon neutral for global corporate operations, and by 2030, plans to be carbon neutral across the entire manufacturing supply chain and life cycle of every product."
rnadomvirlabe 2y ago
Am I reading this right that I can't use my Apple Pencil 2 on a new iPad Air or Pro? I have to buy the new pencil? What?
- bydo 2y ago
  That does seem to be the case: https://www.apple.com/shop/select-apple-pencil https://www.apple.com/shop/select-apple-pencil I don't see any real reason to upgrade from my M1 iPad Pro anyway, but that's disappointing.
  - minimaxir 2y ago
    That would also explain why retailers have been doing deep discounts on the current Pencil lately.
    - Bud 2y ago
      [dead]
- w14 2y ago
  Possibly because they have moved the front camera and the charging no longer works with the old pen.
r0fl 2y ago
In Canada a fully loaded iPad Pro with nanotexture screen, 2TB, keyboard, pencil pro and apple care + tax is $5035.28 Wild to think that they sell 10,000s if not 100,000s of these configurations
- balls187 2y ago
  I am of the mindset that the fully tricked out apple models are for two groups nearly exclusively: 1) People who want to show off that money is no issue to them 2) Creative Firms with huge budgets for Apple gear.
renewiltord 2y ago
Wow, I didn't realize Final Cut Pro had all these features! The background clipping is sick. The document scanning is something I use my iphone for a lot and this new business with the flash to stitch sounds great.
virgildotcodes 2y ago
The fact that they specifically shouted out a portion of the M4 as being dedicated to driving the stacked OLED displays makes me think they'll be moving some of their laptops to OLED imminently as well.
jihadjihad 2y ago
> With these advanced features, Apple Pencil Pro allows users to bring their ideas to life in entirely new ways, and developers can also create their own custom interactions. Can someone please make it so that if you turn the "Pencil" upside down it acts as an eraser, like a real pencil would?
- ayewo 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - killerdhmo 2y ago
    its been 9 years of Apple Pencil and they haven't done this yet, why would they start now?
    - mcphage 2y ago
      They just added new features to this one—those are things they hadn't done for 9 years, either.
- goosedragons 2y ago
  I think it would depend on there being bits for the iPad to track where the tip is for it to work well. Kinda funny that Apple calls their stylus a Pencil and lack this functionality while the Surface and Wacom "Pens" do.
- sircastor 2y ago
  I understand the desire to mimic an existing tool, but I would find this feature (more specifically if it were limited to that) to be really annoying. To me this is an example of skeuomorphism that forces an older experience into the digital one.
  - nickthegreek 2y ago
    But you wouldn't be required to use it, just erase how you do now. I would love for this and for it to be customizable. It could be used to become a highlighter/selector tool or some other concept that we don't know yet. Adding in more features to a pencil and ones that mimic and improve on old analog equivalents sounds exactly like that kind of improvements I would like to see.
mcculley 2y ago
I just bought an almost completely maxed out MacBook Pro and it annoys me that every other Apple product brags about having a cellular modem and no matter how much one is willing to spend, one cannot have a cellular modem in their power user laptop offering.
- minimaxir 2y ago
  If you have an iPhone, the Personal Hotspot integration is surprisingly seamless, albeit not ideal.
  - mcculley 2y ago
    I have had an iPhone since 2012 and an Apple laptop since they were called PowerBooks. I am often in road warrior mode. No, it is not seamless. I have to restart it quite often. It is nowhere near as convenient and always on like it is with my Apple Watch and iPhone and iPad. And it burns two batteries at once. I am convinced that it is the Qualcomm royalty situation that keeps Apple from shipping a cellular modem like Dell does.
    - riversflow 2y ago
      Really? Man, I hate to say this, but how long have you been restoring your iPhone and Mac when you replace them? Maybe you are importing a bug with your settings/environment. I've literally never had to restart my hotspot for my Mac in using both for over 10 years, at times as my daily driver for the internet. Has it gotten worse in the last few years? I haven't been using it as much lately, but 2015-2019 that was basically my main way of browsing the web on my Mac. Worked flawlessly the whole time, kinda amazing to be honest.
      - mcculley 2y ago
        I have experienced this flakiness using Migration Assistant, using restores from backup, and with fresh installs. Many people do. I believe that it works for some people who don't need it very often. I am happy for them.
mfiguiere 2y ago
Two different M4 chips come with the new iPad Pro depending on the selected storage capacity. > Apple M4 chip Models with 256GB or 512GB storage: 9-core CPU with 3 performance cores and 6 efficiency cores 10-core GPU > Models with 1TB or 2TB storage: 10-core CPU with 4 performance cores and 6 efficiency cores 10-core GPU
015a 2y ago
I genuinely don't grok who is buying iPad Pros; outside of maybe artists & graphic designers? Maybe? But even there, wacomb-like tablets on Mac is still super popular, and the iPad Air in a bigger size is going to be crazy popular. A 13" iPad Pro with keyboard is $1650. And you can't even get the nanotexture glass below 1TB; so that + keyboard is approaching $2300. Who is buying this?
- baby 2y ago
  Me. Use it to read pdfs, draw, watch youtube and netflix, or as my laptop when I’m traveling. Best purchase I made.
- fshbbdssbbgdd 2y ago
  Currently an iPad Air with the Magic Keyboard is my main personal computer. I’ve found that it’s the most enjoyable device to use for internet browsing. It replaced my Chromebook, which had that role before. Like the Chromebook, it’s got a physical keyboard, so it’s good for typing. The cantilever also places the screen closer to my hands, helping me to fluidly switch between keyboard and touch navigation, which both work well. The browser is noticeably snappier than my Chromebook was, although that might come down to a better processor generation. A secondary use-case is watching movies while traveling. I did my taxes on there too - Google sheets, scanning receipts from the camera into the Files app, all work well. I plugged in a monitor for that. The one thing I’m not doing on there is coding. I only do that on my work laptop. If I had personal programming projects, I’d surely be using a laptop that lets me run my own code as my personal computer. The price for the new Pro sure is high, but I’m tempted. The phone’s 120Hz OLED has spoiled me. Surely they sell more of the cheaper models, but they might as well make a halo device to rake in as much margin as they can from people who are willing to pay for the best.
  - janlukacs 2y ago
    Why not use a Macbook Air for a full experience?
    - fshbbdssbbgdd 2y ago
chankstein38 2y ago
I don't understand the fluff about thin devices. I bought an iPad air a few years back and every time I picked it up the screen warped and I could see my fingers pressing through the back. I got a case for it thinking that'd help but I could still see it happen if I pressed hard enough. Returned immediately for the iPad Pro. I can't help but expect this would have similar problems AND it's Pro priced.
- w-ll 2y ago
  Also they wobble when places on a table, why cant they make it thicker, give more battery. Like this is crazy that the pencil is thicker. https://www.apple.com/newsroom/images/2024/05/apple-unveils-stunning-new-ipad-pro-with-m4-chip-and-apple-pencil-pro/article/Apple-iPad-Pro-Apple-Pencil-Pro-240507_big.jpg.large.jpg https://www.apple.com/newsroom/images/2024/05/apple-unveils-...
  - reaperducer 2y ago
    Also they wobble when places on a table, It's a feature, not a bug. Just like the iPhones, it doesn't sit flat on a table so that people can't grind dirt into it and scratch up the back and complain on the internet about how it scratches all the time.
    - w-ll 2y ago
      first i heard that excuses. maybe dont have a glass back, maybe add more battery life, maybe not let phones (and now ipads bend in pockets or bags?
- transpute 2y ago
  > the fluff about thin device So that iPad Pro + Magic Keyboard is close to Macbook.
  - joshspankit 2y ago
    But again: why focus on thinness in a pro device?
transpute 2y ago
The entry price for a virtualization-optimized iPad Pro (née Ultra?) is $1600 USD for 4 performance cores, 16GB RAM and 1TB storage. Keyboard, pencil, LTE will push the cost over $2K. Is that sufficient tribute for Apple to unlock M4 and iOS 18 support for nested virtualization of macOS and Linux? Until then, iSH Linux emulation on iPad Pro offers a functional CLI, patience exercises and redlined CPU cores for hand warming.
- rbanffy 2y ago
  Different form factors and different use cases. They don't want to make a sub-par laptop out of an industry-leading tablet.
  - transpute 2y ago
    Why spend expensive silicon real estate on hardware virtualization rather than AI with Neural Engine? Why make a Macbook-aesthetic Magic Keyboard for iPad Pro? Why was iOS implemented as a subsystem of macOS? > They don't want to make a sub-par laptop out of an industry-leading tablet Fortunately for healthy competition, Microsoft/HP/Dell/Lenovo don't have that constraint for their new Arm devices, based on M3-competitive Qualcomm SoC from former Apple Silicon talent.
    - rbanffy 2y ago
      > Why spend expensive silicon real estate on hardware virtualization rather than AI with Neural Engine? Security is one good reason. Virtualisation allows near-complete sandboxing of applications or application sets for mixed personal/corporate use. > Why make a Macbook-aesthetic Magic Keyboard for iPad Pro? Because people use iPads for writing e-mails sometimes. > Why was iOS implemented as a subsystem of macOS? Because it'd be easier to develop a single core for two different user interfaces. > Fortunately for healthy competition, Microsoft/HP/Dell/Lenovo don't have that constraint for their new Arm devices, based on M3-competitive Qualcomm SoC from former Apple Silicon talent. I'll not hold my breath waiting for Qualcomm (or anyone else, for that matter) to catch up. At least for now, Apple has blocked a lot of production capacity at leading process nodes.
robbyiq999 2y ago
The ipad pro is an absolutely stunning and amazing piece of hardware. The sad part is, to get the most out of it; say as a power user, you'll likely be spending a combined ~$300 a month subscription for any of its 'killer apps' on the app store. The subscription model for me personally has been such a turn off for these locked down apple products.
vadersb 2y ago
I was a long-time iPad fan for more than a decade, currently using 5 year old iPad Pro 10.5 which works flawlessly but its battery is quite degraded already. With these new iPads introduced I no longer have a viable upgrade path: iPad pro is a no-go for me because of OLED screen (which I strongly oppose, PWM, irregular subpixels, etc.) and newly introduced iPad Air doesn't have 120Hz display (or ProMotion in Apple terms). So, there are no new iPads with LCD display and ProMotion. What a sad state both Apple hardware and Apple software are in.
- rbanffy 2y ago
  Your requirements seem exceedingly demanding. What use are you making of the iPad that is not fulfilled by their current line?
- deergomoo 2y ago
  > What a sad state both Apple hardware That seems a tad dramatic. Why don’t you buy a (now) previous gen iPad Pro? That’s LCD (mini-LED if you get the 12.9”), ProMotion, still absurdly thin and powerful (especially for anything you can actually do with an iPad), and likely soon discounted to clear stock.
  - vadersb 2y ago
    Yeah, going with prev gen iPad Pro would definitely be a valid choice. I was talking about the general state of Apple hardware and software, not only iPad. The fact that base iPhone 15 model has 60hz screen (while obviously having more than enough power to drive 120hz display) is frustrating. Personally I perceive it as a hostile stance towards anyone who considers themselves a tech enthusiast. There are many more examples of that. Like pop up warning about 10% battery left forcibly stops current audio message recording. Inexcusable.
- canoebuilder 2y ago
  Would you mind going into more details about what you see as the OLED downsides? Is it just Apple’s variant, or the broader product category?
AISnakeOil 2y ago
What do people even use iPads for?
lysecret 2y ago
Sad to see no iPad mini. That one’s my favourite. Would be cool to have it with pro motion.
- cheshire137 2y ago
  I was wanting a Mini update, too.
joshlemer 2y ago
An under-appreciated user base for tablets is musicians. I can't speak to other genres but in recent years in the classical music world, a ton of professional and amateur musicians, and private tutors, have made the switch from paper sheet music, towards tablets. Most of the marketing around iPad and other tablets seems to target visual art, video editing, music editing, etc. But where a tablet may be a nice supplement to a desktop/laptop for those uses, it is a total game changer for sheet music since it can replace folders upon folders and boxes of sheet music which people have to lug around all over, and no other form factor can replace paper. The iPad Pro, 12.9" has been by far the most popular model which, paired with the ForScore app (https://forscore.co/ https://forscore.co/), lets users easily read and annotate sheet music. What's interesting about THIS release for the sheet music use case is that, anything less than the 12.9" screen is just simply too small for reading music off of, full stop. 11" will not do. But musicians have been forced to fork over way too much money for the grossly overpowered pro model because it was the only one with the largest screen size. With this release, finally musicians can purchase a more appropriately-powered and appropriately priced 13" iPad Air, with a base model going for $800 rather than the pro model which starts at $1400. However, for what it's worth, after doing a lot of research for my purchase I ended up going with the Samsung Galaxy S9 Ultra which actually sports a whopping 14.6" screen, allowing you to view two pages of sheet music in landscape mode. It also comes with the pen included for the price of about $765 USD. Samsung also makes available a cover which has a really cool origami design that allows you to prop up the device in portrait mode, which I haven't seen on any other tablet (https://www.samsung.com/ie/mobile-accessories/galaxy-tab-s9-ultra-smart-book-cover-black-ef-bx910pbegww/ https://www.samsung.com/ie/mobile-accessories/galaxy-tab-s9-...). This is actually perfect for sheet music reading! You can get by playing around the house without even a music stand, since you can just let it stand on its own. I was cautious about going the non-standard route with the Samsung rather than the iPad but I have to say I am quite pleased with the result, having used the tablet for practice every day for about a month. ForScore isn't available on Android but I have loved working MobileSheets (with https://www.zubersoft.com/mobilesheets/ https://www.zubersoft.com/mobilesheets/) which is actually cross-platform (windows/mac/android/ios). I'm just a hobbyist myself, but it removes a lot of friction in my daily practice, private lessons, and rehearsals. I'm currently studying out of 3 different study books, as well as some scale studies, then some random duets, and then some "just for fun" pieces like the Halo game soundtrack. Then my orchestra has pieces. Using the app allows me to instantly navigate between all these much more easily than on paper, and I don't have to remember which books/pieces to take to lessons/orchestra/practice, everything's there all the time. Plus, the ability to annotate music non-destructively lets me make better progress. I'm more willing to highlight tricky spots to remember what to focus on. Or, if I'm working through an etude book, I can annotate/re-annotate what tempo I practiced it at, so I can make sure I'm slowly making progress increasing speed. Sorry for the long rant, all this is just to say that tablets for musicians are super awesome! There are also other benefits, like for instance with a tablet, you can get a bluetooth foot pedal which allows you to use your foot to turn pages which can be a challenge during performances (piano performances often even have a human page turner sitting beside the performer). Some people even use facial gestures like winking to trigger page turns. This person has also done a lot of research on different tablets and produced a great report https://www.tablets-for-musicians.net/best-tablets/ https://www.tablets-for-musicians.net/best-tablets/
tiffanyh 2y ago
(I mistaken posted this on the wrong thread, so re-posting) Nano-Texture I really hope this comes to all Apple products soon (iPhones, all iPads, etc). It's some of the best anti-reflective tech I've seen that keeps color and brightness deep & bright.
- kylehotchkiss 2y ago
  It should be a replaceable screen cover. Then if it gets scratched by the wrong microfiber you can undo the mistake
ksec 2y ago
I think I should dig up all the comments about how iPad or iPhone cant be any thinner. Now I wish an iPhone Plus with this sort of thickness. Or basically an iPad Pro mini that is the size of iPhone.
Tiktaalik 2y ago
All these new chips and tbh it doesn't really matter if I still can't code on it yet. These devices have been absolute workflow game changers for the artists in my life, but for coders, it's like a toy and nothing more. They're handcuffed from doing any creative work with it. It's incredible how powerful these devices are, but so much potential only usable for watching youtube.
- jimbobthrowawy 2y ago
  Running code from outside of the appstore is coming within the next six months in the EU. That should alleviate the problem somewhat. I look forward to apple getting more compliant with how the DMA is actually supposed to function.
  - joshspankit 2y ago
    > That should alleviate the problem somewhat. This comment comes across as being from someone who has never paid attention to Apple’s business tactics. No offence. Maybe I’m on the opposite end and too cynical, but I don’t think we know a) whether Apple will practice malicious compliance in a way that makes the ruling meaningless or b) whether they will comply at all. And if they do comply in any way, we don’t know how long they will keep it that way before clawing back little by little or simply ending that compliance.
- qwerpy 2y ago
  Also missing a fully functional ad blocker.
  - shmoogy 2y ago
    Rumor is safari will have a good one built in and some kind of ai to select and remove ads on pages you want.
  - nunez 2y ago
    AdGuard works pretty well?
Vingdoloras 2y ago
What's creeping me out is that there's zero mention of how the nano-texture display affects pencil use. The nano-texture on the standalone display Apple offered a while back was very fragile (if I remember correctly)... I would imagine touching it, let alone dragging a pencil across it, could very quickly leave visible scratches? If not - will this wear through Apple Pencil tips like they're made of rubber?
joshspankit 2y ago
And now the pencil gets a “you’re poor if you own the old one” branding.
zerof1l 2y ago
>Thinnest Apple Product Ever The engineering efforts invested into thinning down devices could be more wisely spent on making them better. Sounds like an arbitrary top-down marketing requirement limitation. Who cares if their iPad is 1mm thinner? Dave Jones did some quick calculations and if the iPad was 1mm thicker, the battery capacity would be at least 50% more! And if it was 2mm ticker, the camera lenses would be flush with the back instead of sticking out.

114 points by praseodym 2y ago

bilsbie 2y ago

Would it be possible to code on this? I’m looking for an alternative to sitting at a desk all day.

KeplerBoy 2y ago
sure, you can expose your workstation with a vscode tunnel and access stuff via the web.
- hbn 2y ago
  Seems overkill to get an M4-powered device to use as a dumb terminal.
1023bytes 2y ago
Not really. But you can remote into a real computer.
- bilsbie 2y ago
  So a windows tablet would make more sense?
  - natrys 2y ago
    Why not an Android with termux? I guess it would depend upon your software stack, but my editor (Emacs) will have native Android port soon and I am stoked to try it. The latest Snapdragon processors are fairly powerful (and Mediatek/Dimensity ones aren't lagging behind either).
    - bilsbie 2y ago
      Please report back!
reachableceo 2y ago
I code on mine frequently. Using working copy and buffer. With git push and ci/cd it’s a great experience.
- bilsbie 2y ago
  What’s buffer? ( I’m getting no relevant search results)

yakshaving_jgt 2y ago

The iPad is an excellent form factor for using on aeroplanes. I wish my iPad would let me play Fallout 4. That, with a normal Xbox controller, would be just perfect for passing the time while flying.

retskrad 2y ago

Apple is just being slick. The M4 is a slightly tweaked M3.

vlod 2y ago
I was wondering why they keep comparing it to the M2 [0] rather than the M3. I guess the M3 never got to the iPad. [0]: https://www.apple.com/ipad-pro/ https://www.apple.com/ipad-pro/ (search for: learn how m4 powers performance)
- eitally 2y ago
  Fwiw, when they launched the M3 MacBook they also compared it primarily to the M1 rather than the M2... same reasons.
minimaxir 2y ago
Honestly this just makes me happier that I invested in a M3 MacBook Pro.

jsheard 2y ago

Is this tandem OLED display a first? I'm familiar with stacked LCD displays, they've been around for a while though mainly in reference monitors due to their inefficiency, but this is the first I've heard of anyone stacking two OLEDs on top of each other.

etempleton 2y ago
First I have heard of it in a consumer device. I suspect this is why the M4 is launching with this device. They are probably using the added efficiency to power the Tandem OLED without sacrificing performance / battery life compared to the previous gen. I will be interested to see what this looks like in person and if it makes it to consumer televisions. I personally find OLED bright enough for indoor use, but a lot of people complain about the reduced brightness on OLED TVs and monitors.
- jwells89 2y ago
  The most common situation where screen brightness is an issue for me is in rooms with big windows and a lot of natural light. On sunny days I find ~400nits to be about the minimum required to cut through glare on matte displays… for mirror-like glossy displays it’s even higher.
- jsheard 2y ago
  Aside from higher peak brightness I would assume it's also less prone to burn-in, the rate that OLED pixels degrade is proportional to how bright they run, and distributing the brightness over two stacked layers means each layer only needs to run roughly half as bright. Not exactly half since the top layer won't be perfectly transparent, but close enough.
nerdjon 2y ago
I was curious about that also, trying to look past the marketing speak on whether or not this is actually as big of a thing as they are saying it is? Particularly compared to OLED on TV's.
throwaway290 2y ago

chrisshroba 2y ago

The gyroscope and haptic feedback in the apple pencil pro seem pretty cool for artists and other creative uses!

jeffbee 2y ago
Yeah, it looks pretty awesome, I am just a little afraid of the price. I want to see one of these in person so I can feel the textured screen. Does it actually have a "feel"? I currently use a textured screen cover for iPad art and it has a great feel but everything else about it is terrible, from the mandatory daily cleaning to the way it grinds pencil tips. But I guess I will never find out since it would cost $1548 to replace my existing 12.9 iPad Pro, net of the trade-in. Yikes. Could probably get double the trade value they are offering on eBay or Craigslist.

daft_pink 2y ago

It doesn’t move the needle for me to purchase it. My m1 iPad Pro still does everything I want it to and I don’t use it that often, but when I do I love it.

etchalon 2y ago
The curse of Apple Silicon. Everything's basically "fast enough" already.
- divan 2y ago
  I have iPad Pro from 2020 (pre M1). It's still way faster than I need (most heavy work I do on laptop) and still unbelievably good. The only thing I miss is the ability to read under the bright sun. New Tandem screen unlikely to change it, so I'm opting in for 13.3" e-paper tablet. As I often read academic papers, that should be a killer one, but new 13" iPads also look promising for that!
  - cjk2 2y ago
    I have the same problem. I still print mine out and read them on paper. Low tech but it's the best experience.
    - divan 2y ago
      I ordered Onyx Boox Tab X – seems to be the only real option out there. It has Android, so it's possible to use your favorite reader/app on it (I'm using ReadCube Papers). Can't wait to try it.
- cjk2 2y ago
  That's a good point actually. I can't seem to even bend my M1 Pro MBP. It just eats everything I throw at it and shrugs. It's coming up to 3 years old now and looks like and works like the day it was made.
  - ailurooo 2y ago

wannacboatmovie 2y ago

So they've officially killed off the last iPad with a home button. Elderly folks let out a collective groan since swapping a simple UI for an additional .5" of screen space seems like a poor tradeoff.

alephnerd 2y ago
That button is an increasingly expensive component at scale, as it's a separate component to manufacture and build a supply chain for, as well as an additional component to add which can potentially fail. This is why most carmakers are moving towards touchscreens now as well. If you want to keep prices roughly comparable to previous SKUs in the midst of trade and supply chain kerfuffles, there has to be cost cutting somewhere.
- switch007 2y ago
  Apple is indeed struggling and need to cut costs in every conceivable way
  - alephnerd 2y ago
    Every company that has some form of manufacturing is doing similar cost reductions. Supply Chain is hard enough in a globalized world, and it's only gotten even harder now that a multi-year pandemic shutdown, trade wars, and tariffs are coming to play.
  - paulmd 2y ago
    The fact that nerds constantly react sardonically like this is unfortunate for multiple areas of tech discussion, just like people react so negatively to the rising costs of gpu SKUs as well. It’s poisonous to actual debate and discussion, just children lashing out in anger that their toys are getting more expensive.
    - switch007 2y ago
      I think this highlights your financial privilege more than anything. And it’s pretty tone deaf during a time of some pretty shocking inflation, not all of which is justified

paxys 2y ago

Here's the new iDevice. Same as the old iDevice, just with a ton of marketing and a 5% performance improvement. And you can do nothing with the added performance because it still runs a fully locked down OS. Yawn.

CooCooCaCha 2y ago
OLED, faster chip, better camera, improved accessories are all pretty nice things and definitely not the same device. You Apple haters are tiresome. Hardware-wise what else do you want it to do?
jinushaun 2y ago
What’s wrong with that? Every new version is an upgrade for somebody. Not everyone is trying to upgrade every year. That’s wasteful.
- dlivingston 2y ago
  Who is the 'somebody'? Genuinely, I don't understand what segment of consumers will actually be leveraging the compute in this device.
ulfw 2y ago
I have (sad) news for you: That goes for MOST of the world. Do you truly think in whatever new version of Nike sneakers there's truly something new and revolutionary in it or more likely "a ton of marketing and a 5% performance improvement"?

taco_emoji 2y ago

America's most innovative tech company introduces... Widget 7.0

iamsam123 2y ago

Interesting how many different offerings they have now outside of just spending the initial ~$1000 on the ipad itself. Purchasing the pencil, usb-c, key board, smart folio, logic pro (subscription), final cut (subscription), etc... I'd be curious to know the average age of an ipad in circulation is now. I used an ipad for school from 2012-2017, never used the apple pencil, but it always worked great for my needs. My girlfriend got one for med school and uses it with the pencil especially when shes not at home.

alephnerd 2y ago
+1 on the med student usecase. Same with my SO.
cm2187 2y ago
The non replaceable battery is I believe the way the make old ipads obsolete.
- fckgw 2y ago
  A new battery is ~$100 parts and labor
  - cm2187 2y ago
    Not from Apple. They run it through a software that "tests" the battery and always returns "good" and tell you they can't do anything for you.
    - amiantos 2y ago
      Tinfoil hat talk.
      - slackfan 2y ago
        do not believe your lying eyes!
    - 2y ago

anonymouse008 2y ago

@apple team: whomever approved your hydraulic press imagery forgot that "standing on the shoulders of giants" is an appreciation of, not a license to stomp on. words matter, images matter, it's how you tell us who you are.

numpad0 2y ago
I think it conveys its concept well: a lesser equivalent at high cost, aimed to destroy things of value, embracing AI cultural revolution.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
ncr100 2y ago
It was repulsive and disturbing to me. That piano could have been used. * My other comment https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40292445 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40292445
- anonymouse008 2y ago
  Even if 'no animals were harmed' in the making, as in they pulled some filming tricks... it's still a disturbing message. They once understood 'marketing is about values' // what a sad value they proclaimed today, destroy the essence for our entertainment.
kylehotchkiss 2y ago
I don’t get the controversy about this. At landfills with self service all over the USA, probably tens of thousands of Americans dumped substantially more useful stuff than that into the hydraulic trash compactor machine today. I sincerely don’t know what to do with old printers, I’d probably go drop it in there. Along with a bunch of old doors from my house. Sure they could be reused but how am I supposed to find the time and energy to get them to a new home? Have you ever tried to bring a bunch of stuff to goodwill? They sure say no to a lot of it!

drewcon 2y ago

I would buy this JUST for the camera being in a place that makes face unlock not fail 99% of the time because I'm covering the camera with my thumb.

cjk2 2y ago
Ah yeah this pisses me off on my M2 iPad Pro. Totally agree there. I'm still not buying it though.
nijuashi 2y ago
YES! This was a long overdue “feature”.

jauntywundrkind 2y ago

Every time Apple ups their display game, I shout, "Finally, someone else will have to take action & up their game! This will finally spurn everyone else into trying!" So far, not much luck! And once again, Apple critically one-upping their themselves, while it feels like no one's started competing with the old product. OLED with 1000 nit full screen sdr output? That's 4x what most OLED monitors can do! 1600 nit hdr is great too. These are amazing systems, must be stunning to see. I wish there were general purpose computers like this that could run Linux. I wish others could compete. Apple keeps being the SpaceX to the industry's Boeing.

hartator 2y ago

Running MacOS on this will be a dream. Very hard to be productive coding on iPadOS. Even if it does become more and more possible with side-by-side windows, native terminals, and more versatile copy/paste.

fragmede 2y ago
You just know there's a lucky Apple engineer out there that has MacOS running on a iPad for testing purposes.

blindriver 2y ago

I try really hard to use my iPad but I forget about it most days. Sometimes I’ll watch movies on it in bed and that’s about it. A complete waste of money for me. The only time it truly was helpful was during online interviews when I could draw system design diagrams with the Apple pencil on them during zoom calls instead of using a mouse. Haven’t really used them since.

cletus 2y ago

I'm struggling to see why I'd buy this over a Macbook Air. I have an iPad Air. I use it a lot but generally just to watch Netflix or Youtube. I don't enjoy typing on it at all. I have the Air specifically because it's TouchID. I hate FaceID with a passion. But this update has pushed up the iPad Pro price well into the Macbook territory and that's a much more capable and flexible device.

cjk2 2y ago
Tha main reasons I own an (11") iPad Pro are, you can write on it, which is really damn useful, you can wedge it places like tables on planes easier, it weighs hardly anything and you can charge it off a phone charger. Plus being TB based I can suck stuff off my camera without a dongle or any of that faff. But yeah an MBA is more powerful, but it doesn't have those attributes. If I was to start again I'd buy a bottom end Mac Studio for the 32Gb RAM baseline config, hang some TB drives off it and use the iPad as my "portable" computer.
D13Fd 2y ago
The MacBook Air is better for sure, and if you only buy one, buy that one -- full stop. But I use both, every day, at the same time. They are designed to work together. With universal control, my iPad sits next to my screen at work, and I do some things on the iPad, some on the MacBook. I also use my iPad on its own around the house. It's also incredibly nice for CAD work (Shapr3d) and photo processing (Lightroom). The iPad is much more resilient to water, food, and dust. I design things in Shapr3d on the iPad and take the iPad to the garage to build them -- a little sawdust does not hurt it and it's easy to clean. It's also much better if you want to read while eating, especially with kids around. The keyboard doesn't get in the way and spilled water won't hurt it either. I use it while cooking and to watch TV while washing dishes. The other thing the iPad can do that the MBA can't is that it's easily shareable. If you work with others, it's easy to pull up a PDF on an iPad and hand it to someone to look at or even annotate with the pencil. There is no awkward standing over your shoulder or handing off a laptop. Everyone instantly knows how to work with you on the iPad, and to review whatever you want them to review and hand it back. Overall I still use my MacBook Air more, and it's more capable. You can't do serious coding or development work on the iPad, for example. But it's very much worth having the iPad as well, at least for me.

busymom0 2y ago

I think the iPad hardware has been outstanding for many years. It's the software which is is limiting it constantly. They should let us put macOS or Linux on it. Or be able to do full on dev work (I realize some dev work is possible). If I could do my iOS and Android app dev on iPad, it would be instant buy.

asabla 2y ago
I think vittualization would be enough. Especially if it works well with an external monitor.
- busymom0 2y ago
  I need to be able to debug apps on physical devices from the iPad. And it needs to be wired connection because debugging over wifi even on my Mac is very bad (lots of complaints online about it too).
dan-allen 2y ago
Yeah iPad hardware is sadly limited by software and I think Apple shoots themselves in the foot. It took them a long time to start allowing apps to use meaningful amounts of ram and managing custom fonts is a mess. I also suspect the limited number of “pro” apps is partly thanks to how the App Store runs. If I were going to invest in developing powerful software for iPad, being at App Review’s whims and ever-changing policies seems like a pretty big risk.

Geee 2y ago

Anyone has experience with CAD modeling in Shapr3d with the Pencil? Does it make sense buying this device for this purpose?

fwef64 2y ago

With every new iPad they release I'm hopeful they add a support for virtualization. If I could run linux in a docker on an iPad I would switch to it as my main computing instantly, but as of right now I don't see a reason to upgrade what's basically a glorified ebook reader and Netflix player.

transpute 2y ago
iPad Pro's 2024 hardware overachievement eclipses even the iPhone, for the first time. Will iPadOS 18 be unshackled to drive the M4? We'll find out at WWDC next month, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40287922 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40287922

a2128 2y ago

Apple's sections about the environment in their announcements always makes me feel like I'm being gaslit as they mention anything but repair and supporting the consumer's right to reduce and re-use

cjk2 2y ago
The iPad is the notable omission from the Self Service Repair thing they are doing. I suspect it's just classified as disposable/recyclable. (yes this annoys me)
- sp332 2y ago
  The larger one is 5.1mm thick. There aren't separate components any more, it's a smear of glue with some silicon and batteries suspended in it.
- ncr100 2y ago
  AH could that be why their "thinnest iPad" advertisement was to crush usable piano, metronome, etc? the iPad division // department does NOT respect reuse?
ninininino 2y ago
I think the source of your sort of unconscious discomfort is because corporate speak is not about truth or justice or any moral/ethical system, it's about reputation-management of the firm and profit. They usually won't make direct provable lies, but will leave out any information that does not boost their reputation even if it's relevant or contradicts their messaging. But importantly, they are appealing to a sense of moral virtue when they brag about environmental responsibility or privacy, even if they aren't taking a lens of truth and justice to their analysis and messaging, but a biased one that ultimately favors profit. This dissonance in tone vs real motive is really painful to people who care about nuance and truth and moral good, because it means they muddy the waters of what is right and wrong and confuse us.
gorwell 2y ago
They're bold enough to say they're carbon neutral. "Today, Apple is carbon neutral for global corporate operations, and by 2030, plans to be carbon neutral across the entire manufacturing supply chain and life cycle of every product."

rnadomvirlabe 2y ago

Am I reading this right that I can't use my Apple Pencil 2 on a new iPad Air or Pro? I have to buy the new pencil? What?

bydo 2y ago
That does seem to be the case: https://www.apple.com/shop/select-apple-pencil https://www.apple.com/shop/select-apple-pencil I don't see any real reason to upgrade from my M1 iPad Pro anyway, but that's disappointing.
- minimaxir 2y ago
  That would also explain why retailers have been doing deep discounts on the current Pencil lately.
  - Bud 2y ago
    [dead]
w14 2y ago
Possibly because they have moved the front camera and the charging no longer works with the old pen.

r0fl 2y ago

In Canada a fully loaded iPad Pro with nanotexture screen, 2TB, keyboard, pencil pro and apple care + tax is $5035.28 Wild to think that they sell 10,000s if not 100,000s of these configurations

balls187 2y ago
I am of the mindset that the fully tricked out apple models are for two groups nearly exclusively: 1) People who want to show off that money is no issue to them 2) Creative Firms with huge budgets for Apple gear.

renewiltord 2y ago

Wow, I didn't realize Final Cut Pro had all these features! The background clipping is sick. The document scanning is something I use my iphone for a lot and this new business with the flash to stitch sounds great.

virgildotcodes 2y ago

The fact that they specifically shouted out a portion of the M4 as being dedicated to driving the stacked OLED displays makes me think they'll be moving some of their laptops to OLED imminently as well.

jihadjihad 2y ago

> With these advanced features, Apple Pencil Pro allows users to bring their ideas to life in entirely new ways, and developers can also create their own custom interactions. Can someone please make it so that if you turn the "Pencil" upside down it acts as an eraser, like a real pencil would?

ayewo 2y ago
[flagged]
- killerdhmo 2y ago
  its been 9 years of Apple Pencil and they haven't done this yet, why would they start now?
  - mcphage 2y ago
    They just added new features to this one—those are things they hadn't done for 9 years, either.
goosedragons 2y ago
I think it would depend on there being bits for the iPad to track where the tip is for it to work well. Kinda funny that Apple calls their stylus a Pencil and lack this functionality while the Surface and Wacom "Pens" do.
sircastor 2y ago
I understand the desire to mimic an existing tool, but I would find this feature (more specifically if it were limited to that) to be really annoying. To me this is an example of skeuomorphism that forces an older experience into the digital one.
- nickthegreek 2y ago
  But you wouldn't be required to use it, just erase how you do now. I would love for this and for it to be customizable. It could be used to become a highlighter/selector tool or some other concept that we don't know yet. Adding in more features to a pencil and ones that mimic and improve on old analog equivalents sounds exactly like that kind of improvements I would like to see.

mcculley 2y ago

I just bought an almost completely maxed out MacBook Pro and it annoys me that every other Apple product brags about having a cellular modem and no matter how much one is willing to spend, one cannot have a cellular modem in their power user laptop offering.

minimaxir 2y ago
If you have an iPhone, the Personal Hotspot integration is surprisingly seamless, albeit not ideal.
- mcculley 2y ago
  I have had an iPhone since 2012 and an Apple laptop since they were called PowerBooks. I am often in road warrior mode. No, it is not seamless. I have to restart it quite often. It is nowhere near as convenient and always on like it is with my Apple Watch and iPhone and iPad. And it burns two batteries at once. I am convinced that it is the Qualcomm royalty situation that keeps Apple from shipping a cellular modem like Dell does.
  - riversflow 2y ago
    Really? Man, I hate to say this, but how long have you been restoring your iPhone and Mac when you replace them? Maybe you are importing a bug with your settings/environment. I've literally never had to restart my hotspot for my Mac in using both for over 10 years, at times as my daily driver for the internet. Has it gotten worse in the last few years? I haven't been using it as much lately, but 2015-2019 that was basically my main way of browsing the web on my Mac. Worked flawlessly the whole time, kinda amazing to be honest.
    - mcculley 2y ago
      I have experienced this flakiness using Migration Assistant, using restores from backup, and with fresh installs. Many people do. I believe that it works for some people who don't need it very often. I am happy for them.

mfiguiere 2y ago

Two different M4 chips come with the new iPad Pro depending on the selected storage capacity. > Apple M4 chip Models with 256GB or 512GB storage: 9-core CPU with 3 performance cores and 6 efficiency cores 10-core GPU > Models with 1TB or 2TB storage: 10-core CPU with 4 performance cores and 6 efficiency cores 10-core GPU

015a 2y ago

I genuinely don't grok who is buying iPad Pros; outside of maybe artists & graphic designers? Maybe? But even there, wacomb-like tablets on Mac is still super popular, and the iPad Air in a bigger size is going to be crazy popular. A 13" iPad Pro with keyboard is $1650. And you can't even get the nanotexture glass below 1TB; so that + keyboard is approaching $2300. Who is buying this?

baby 2y ago
Me. Use it to read pdfs, draw, watch youtube and netflix, or as my laptop when I’m traveling. Best purchase I made.
fshbbdssbbgdd 2y ago
Currently an iPad Air with the Magic Keyboard is my main personal computer. I’ve found that it’s the most enjoyable device to use for internet browsing. It replaced my Chromebook, which had that role before. Like the Chromebook, it’s got a physical keyboard, so it’s good for typing. The cantilever also places the screen closer to my hands, helping me to fluidly switch between keyboard and touch navigation, which both work well. The browser is noticeably snappier than my Chromebook was, although that might come down to a better processor generation. A secondary use-case is watching movies while traveling. I did my taxes on there too - Google sheets, scanning receipts from the camera into the Files app, all work well. I plugged in a monitor for that. The one thing I’m not doing on there is coding. I only do that on my work laptop. If I had personal programming projects, I’d surely be using a laptop that lets me run my own code as my personal computer. The price for the new Pro sure is high, but I’m tempted. The phone’s 120Hz OLED has spoiled me. Surely they sell more of the cheaper models, but they might as well make a halo device to rake in as much margin as they can from people who are willing to pay for the best.
- janlukacs 2y ago
  Why not use a Macbook Air for a full experience?
  - fshbbdssbbgdd 2y ago

chankstein38 2y ago

I don't understand the fluff about thin devices. I bought an iPad air a few years back and every time I picked it up the screen warped and I could see my fingers pressing through the back. I got a case for it thinking that'd help but I could still see it happen if I pressed hard enough. Returned immediately for the iPad Pro. I can't help but expect this would have similar problems AND it's Pro priced.

w-ll 2y ago
Also they wobble when places on a table, why cant they make it thicker, give more battery. Like this is crazy that the pencil is thicker. https://www.apple.com/newsroom/images/2024/05/apple-unveils-stunning-new-ipad-pro-with-m4-chip-and-apple-pencil-pro/article/Apple-iPad-Pro-Apple-Pencil-Pro-240507_big.jpg.large.jpg https://www.apple.com/newsroom/images/2024/05/apple-unveils-...
- reaperducer 2y ago
  Also they wobble when places on a table, It's a feature, not a bug. Just like the iPhones, it doesn't sit flat on a table so that people can't grind dirt into it and scratch up the back and complain on the internet about how it scratches all the time.
  - w-ll 2y ago
    first i heard that excuses. maybe dont have a glass back, maybe add more battery life, maybe not let phones (and now ipads bend in pockets or bags?
transpute 2y ago
> the fluff about thin device So that iPad Pro + Magic Keyboard is close to Macbook.
- joshspankit 2y ago
  But again: why focus on thinness in a pro device?

transpute 2y ago

The entry price for a virtualization-optimized iPad Pro (née Ultra?) is $1600 USD for 4 performance cores, 16GB RAM and 1TB storage. Keyboard, pencil, LTE will push the cost over $2K. Is that sufficient tribute for Apple to unlock M4 and iOS 18 support for nested virtualization of macOS and Linux? Until then, iSH Linux emulation on iPad Pro offers a functional CLI, patience exercises and redlined CPU cores for hand warming.

rbanffy 2y ago
Different form factors and different use cases. They don't want to make a sub-par laptop out of an industry-leading tablet.
- transpute 2y ago
  Why spend expensive silicon real estate on hardware virtualization rather than AI with Neural Engine? Why make a Macbook-aesthetic Magic Keyboard for iPad Pro? Why was iOS implemented as a subsystem of macOS? > They don't want to make a sub-par laptop out of an industry-leading tablet Fortunately for healthy competition, Microsoft/HP/Dell/Lenovo don't have that constraint for their new Arm devices, based on M3-competitive Qualcomm SoC from former Apple Silicon talent.
  - rbanffy 2y ago
    > Why spend expensive silicon real estate on hardware virtualization rather than AI with Neural Engine? Security is one good reason. Virtualisation allows near-complete sandboxing of applications or application sets for mixed personal/corporate use. > Why make a Macbook-aesthetic Magic Keyboard for iPad Pro? Because people use iPads for writing e-mails sometimes. > Why was iOS implemented as a subsystem of macOS? Because it'd be easier to develop a single core for two different user interfaces. > Fortunately for healthy competition, Microsoft/HP/Dell/Lenovo don't have that constraint for their new Arm devices, based on M3-competitive Qualcomm SoC from former Apple Silicon talent. I'll not hold my breath waiting for Qualcomm (or anyone else, for that matter) to catch up. At least for now, Apple has blocked a lot of production capacity at leading process nodes.

robbyiq999 2y ago

The ipad pro is an absolutely stunning and amazing piece of hardware. The sad part is, to get the most out of it; say as a power user, you'll likely be spending a combined ~$300 a month subscription for any of its 'killer apps' on the app store. The subscription model for me personally has been such a turn off for these locked down apple products.

vadersb 2y ago

I was a long-time iPad fan for more than a decade, currently using 5 year old iPad Pro 10.5 which works flawlessly but its battery is quite degraded already. With these new iPads introduced I no longer have a viable upgrade path: iPad pro is a no-go for me because of OLED screen (which I strongly oppose, PWM, irregular subpixels, etc.) and newly introduced iPad Air doesn't have 120Hz display (or ProMotion in Apple terms). So, there are no new iPads with LCD display and ProMotion. What a sad state both Apple hardware and Apple software are in.

rbanffy 2y ago
Your requirements seem exceedingly demanding. What use are you making of the iPad that is not fulfilled by their current line?
deergomoo 2y ago
> What a sad state both Apple hardware That seems a tad dramatic. Why don’t you buy a (now) previous gen iPad Pro? That’s LCD (mini-LED if you get the 12.9”), ProMotion, still absurdly thin and powerful (especially for anything you can actually do with an iPad), and likely soon discounted to clear stock.
- vadersb 2y ago
  Yeah, going with prev gen iPad Pro would definitely be a valid choice. I was talking about the general state of Apple hardware and software, not only iPad. The fact that base iPhone 15 model has 60hz screen (while obviously having more than enough power to drive 120hz display) is frustrating. Personally I perceive it as a hostile stance towards anyone who considers themselves a tech enthusiast. There are many more examples of that. Like pop up warning about 10% battery left forcibly stops current audio message recording. Inexcusable.
canoebuilder 2y ago
Would you mind going into more details about what you see as the OLED downsides? Is it just Apple’s variant, or the broader product category?

AISnakeOil 2y ago

What do people even use iPads for?

lysecret 2y ago

Sad to see no iPad mini. That one’s my favourite. Would be cool to have it with pro motion.

cheshire137 2y ago
I was wanting a Mini update, too.

joshlemer 2y ago

An under-appreciated user base for tablets is musicians. I can't speak to other genres but in recent years in the classical music world, a ton of professional and amateur musicians, and private tutors, have made the switch from paper sheet music, towards tablets. Most of the marketing around iPad and other tablets seems to target visual art, video editing, music editing, etc. But where a tablet may be a nice supplement to a desktop/laptop for those uses, it is a total game changer for sheet music since it can replace folders upon folders and boxes of sheet music which people have to lug around all over, and no other form factor can replace paper. The iPad Pro, 12.9" has been by far the most popular model which, paired with the ForScore app (https://forscore.co/ https://forscore.co/), lets users easily read and annotate sheet music. What's interesting about THIS release for the sheet music use case is that, anything less than the 12.9" screen is just simply too small for reading music off of, full stop. 11" will not do. But musicians have been forced to fork over way too much money for the grossly overpowered pro model because it was the only one with the largest screen size. With this release, finally musicians can purchase a more appropriately-powered and appropriately priced 13" iPad Air, with a base model going for $800 rather than the pro model which starts at $1400. However, for what it's worth, after doing a lot of research for my purchase I ended up going with the Samsung Galaxy S9 Ultra which actually sports a whopping 14.6" screen, allowing you to view two pages of sheet music in landscape mode. It also comes with the pen included for the price of about $765 USD. Samsung also makes available a cover which has a really cool origami design that allows you to prop up the device in portrait mode, which I haven't seen on any other tablet (https://www.samsung.com/ie/mobile-accessories/galaxy-tab-s9-ultra-smart-book-cover-black-ef-bx910pbegww/ https://www.samsung.com/ie/mobile-accessories/galaxy-tab-s9-...). This is actually perfect for sheet music reading! You can get by playing around the house without even a music stand, since you can just let it stand on its own. I was cautious about going the non-standard route with the Samsung rather than the iPad but I have to say I am quite pleased with the result, having used the tablet for practice every day for about a month. ForScore isn't available on Android but I have loved working MobileSheets (with https://www.zubersoft.com/mobilesheets/ https://www.zubersoft.com/mobilesheets/) which is actually cross-platform (windows/mac/android/ios). I'm just a hobbyist myself, but it removes a lot of friction in my daily practice, private lessons, and rehearsals. I'm currently studying out of 3 different study books, as well as some scale studies, then some random duets, and then some "just for fun" pieces like the Halo game soundtrack. Then my orchestra has pieces. Using the app allows me to instantly navigate between all these much more easily than on paper, and I don't have to remember which books/pieces to take to lessons/orchestra/practice, everything's there all the time. Plus, the ability to annotate music non-destructively lets me make better progress. I'm more willing to highlight tricky spots to remember what to focus on. Or, if I'm working through an etude book, I can annotate/re-annotate what tempo I practiced it at, so I can make sure I'm slowly making progress increasing speed. Sorry for the long rant, all this is just to say that tablets for musicians are super awesome! There are also other benefits, like for instance with a tablet, you can get a bluetooth foot pedal which allows you to use your foot to turn pages which can be a challenge during performances (piano performances often even have a human page turner sitting beside the performer). Some people even use facial gestures like winking to trigger page turns. This person has also done a lot of research on different tablets and produced a great report https://www.tablets-for-musicians.net/best-tablets/ https://www.tablets-for-musicians.net/best-tablets/

tiffanyh 2y ago

(I mistaken posted this on the wrong thread, so re-posting) Nano-Texture I really hope this comes to all Apple products soon (iPhones, all iPads, etc). It's some of the best anti-reflective tech I've seen that keeps color and brightness deep & bright.

kylehotchkiss 2y ago
It should be a replaceable screen cover. Then if it gets scratched by the wrong microfiber you can undo the mistake

ksec 2y ago

I think I should dig up all the comments about how iPad or iPhone cant be any thinner. Now I wish an iPhone Plus with this sort of thickness. Or basically an iPad Pro mini that is the size of iPhone.

Tiktaalik 2y ago

All these new chips and tbh it doesn't really matter if I still can't code on it yet. These devices have been absolute workflow game changers for the artists in my life, but for coders, it's like a toy and nothing more. They're handcuffed from doing any creative work with it. It's incredible how powerful these devices are, but so much potential only usable for watching youtube.

jimbobthrowawy 2y ago
Running code from outside of the appstore is coming within the next six months in the EU. That should alleviate the problem somewhat. I look forward to apple getting more compliant with how the DMA is actually supposed to function.
- joshspankit 2y ago
  > That should alleviate the problem somewhat. This comment comes across as being from someone who has never paid attention to Apple’s business tactics. No offence. Maybe I’m on the opposite end and too cynical, but I don’t think we know a) whether Apple will practice malicious compliance in a way that makes the ruling meaningless or b) whether they will comply at all. And if they do comply in any way, we don’t know how long they will keep it that way before clawing back little by little or simply ending that compliance.
qwerpy 2y ago
Also missing a fully functional ad blocker.
- shmoogy 2y ago
  Rumor is safari will have a good one built in and some kind of ai to select and remove ads on pages you want.
- nunez 2y ago
  AdGuard works pretty well?

Vingdoloras 2y ago

What's creeping me out is that there's zero mention of how the nano-texture display affects pencil use. The nano-texture on the standalone display Apple offered a while back was very fragile (if I remember correctly)... I would imagine touching it, let alone dragging a pencil across it, could very quickly leave visible scratches? If not - will this wear through Apple Pencil tips like they're made of rubber?

joshspankit 2y ago

And now the pencil gets a “you’re poor if you own the old one” branding.

zerof1l 2y ago

>Thinnest Apple Product Ever The engineering efforts invested into thinning down devices could be more wisely spent on making them better. Sounds like an arbitrary top-down marketing requirement limitation. Who cares if their iPad is 1mm thinner? Dave Jones did some quick calculations and if the iPad was 1mm thicker, the battery capacity would be at least 50% more! And if it was 2mm ticker, the camera lenses would be flush with the back instead of sticking out.