6 ms·

There are more people struggling these days than the mainstream news reports. The lines at the food banks where I live are much longer than they were before COV

There are more people struggling these days than the mainstream news reports. The lines at the food banks where I live are much longer than they were before COVID. One of the local food banks says they're distributing three times as many meals per month as they served before the pandemic. And this is an area of relatively high employment. People working service jobs simply can't afford the basics, and that's a problem. Part of capitalism's implied promise is that if you work full time, you should be able to feed and house yourself. But for huge numbers of people, that doesn't seem to be true anymore.

mariodiana 2y ago
I also don’t understand people on a tech forum not being more sympathetic about the economy’s troubles. Is tech not in a recession? That’s ludicrous. Tech is in a bad way.
mlinhares 2y ago
There’s no such implied promise, it’s the other way around: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reserve_army_of_labour https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reserve_army_of_labour
- diamondap 2y ago
  OK, maybe it isn't capitalism but US society that implies that promise. Many (insensitive) people respond to tales of economic woe by saying, "Get a job!" As if that's going to solve even your basic money woes. As others in this discussion have noted, many people employed full time still struggle to provide the basics. That part of the social contract just isn't holding up for a lot of people. And that's a recipe for social unrest.
- rangestransform 2y ago
  This sounds vaguely like the observation that retail checkout employees get stupider when the economy is good, because everyone with 2 brain cells to rub together moves to more gainful employment, and walmart has to really start scraping the bottom of the barrel
cpursley 2y ago
I don’t think I’d define the situation we’re in as capitalism.
hollywood_court 2y ago
It's really getting out of hand. I see it here with my coworkers in our small company. There are only 6 employees here total. 3 of my coworkers commute for 1hr+ away each way because they can't afford to live in our town. And then they don't eat. With their work schedule and their commute they're gone from home for 12hrs or more per day so they can't meal prep. And they can't afford to dine out. So they simply don't eat breakfast or lunch. I told my CEO that my past success and my wife are effectively subsidizing his company. Because I could not afford to work here it I had not been so successful earlier and if my wife didn't have a great job with great benefits. In fact, I'm seriously considering leaving my role when the summer starts because childcare for my 5 year old son is going to cost ~55% of my net pay each month. But my CEO and his family of 4 have been to Disney World twice since October 2023. And they're going to Europe for 2 weeks this summer.
- saalweachter 2y ago
  I feel like the owner/operator of a six-person company styling themselves the "CEO" is symbolic of something, somehow.
  - hollywood_court 2y ago
    Definitely. And his wife is the "Executive Assistant" although I've only seen her in the office 4-5 times since I started in October.
- ProllyInfamous 2y ago
  "Keep up all your hard work and next year I'll take you for a drive in my new sports car!" —Some Boss, probably
  - hollywood_court 2y ago
    I know you're kidding, but one of my neighbors gets super excited because his boss allows him to job his sports car to lunch sometimes. My neighbor can't afford his own sports car but at least he gets to drive one to McDonald's a few times per month.
resource_waste 2y ago
> The lines at the food banks where I live are much longer than they were before COVID. what does this really mean? Like food is so cheap we are obese. So does this mean more people want freebies? Tasty brand name foods? My neighbor thought we were poor and gave us food they got from a foodbank, it was really nice (but odd) stuff. In 2024 I can't really understand using food as a measurement. There is too much.
- btbuildem 2y ago
  Well, if you can't understand, why such strong opinions? Read up about basics of nutrition, about how poverty and obesity are correlated, what "food deserts" are, the differences between processed and healthy foods, etc.
  - resource_waste 2y ago
    Funny you mention that. Its my expertise. Food Deserts are defined in a way that is unhelpful, I live in a food desert in one of the richest counties. I have 0 grocery stores within 1 mile. But I have 6 grocery stores within 3 miles. Go ahead with the conventional sayings: Tell me the fallacious remark about McDoubles being the healthiest cheapest food ever. Go ahead and say something incorrect like processed foods are cheaper than fresh foods. In a few years you are going to change from thinking Fat is the devil to carbs are the devil. Then you will take up fasting, then keto, then gluten free. People in the US have too much money to care about food. These are people getting dopamine from food pleasure. No one wants to admit it.
    - btbuildem 2y ago
      No one will push against the claim there's far too many calories available, on average, in Western countries. That consumption is the automatic answer to anything that ails, it could be argued as well. It reeks of ignorance and obstinate privilege to claim people are too rich to care about food [1] [2], that having to travel 3 miles to get food is not a barrier to access [3] [4]. Saying that processed foods are more expensive than fresh is an outright lie [5][6][7]. The HN discussion forums are one of the last remaining places where we can expect civil and informed online discourse. Please try and keep with that spirit. 1: https://www.feedingamerica.org/about-us/press-room/53-million-received-help-2021 https://www.feedingamerica.org/about-us/press-room/53-millio... 2: https://gitnux.org/food-bank-statistics/ https://gitnux.org/food-bank-statistics/ 3: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/food-bank-use-highest-in-canadian-history-hunger-count-2023-report-1.7006464 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/food-bank-use-highest-in-cana... 4: https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/what-are-food-deserts#definition https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/what-are-food-dese... 5: https://foodispower.org/access-health/food-deserts/ https://foodispower.org/access-health/food-deserts/ 6: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9967271/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9967271/ 7: https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/press-releases/healthy-vs-unhealthy-diet-costs-1-50-more/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/press-releases/healthy-vs-... 8: https://www.aier.org/article/why-unhealthy-food-is-cheap-and-plentiful/ https://www.aier.org/article/why-unhealthy-food-is-cheap-and...

mariodiana 2y ago

I also don’t understand people on a tech forum not being more sympathetic about the economy’s troubles. Is tech not in a recession? That’s ludicrous. Tech is in a bad way.

mlinhares 2y ago

There’s no such implied promise, it’s the other way around: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reserve_army_of_labour https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reserve_army_of_labour

diamondap 2y ago
OK, maybe it isn't capitalism but US society that implies that promise. Many (insensitive) people respond to tales of economic woe by saying, "Get a job!" As if that's going to solve even your basic money woes. As others in this discussion have noted, many people employed full time still struggle to provide the basics. That part of the social contract just isn't holding up for a lot of people. And that's a recipe for social unrest.
rangestransform 2y ago
This sounds vaguely like the observation that retail checkout employees get stupider when the economy is good, because everyone with 2 brain cells to rub together moves to more gainful employment, and walmart has to really start scraping the bottom of the barrel

cpursley 2y ago

I don’t think I’d define the situation we’re in as capitalism.

hollywood_court 2y ago

It's really getting out of hand. I see it here with my coworkers in our small company. There are only 6 employees here total. 3 of my coworkers commute for 1hr+ away each way because they can't afford to live in our town. And then they don't eat. With their work schedule and their commute they're gone from home for 12hrs or more per day so they can't meal prep. And they can't afford to dine out. So they simply don't eat breakfast or lunch. I told my CEO that my past success and my wife are effectively subsidizing his company. Because I could not afford to work here it I had not been so successful earlier and if my wife didn't have a great job with great benefits. In fact, I'm seriously considering leaving my role when the summer starts because childcare for my 5 year old son is going to cost ~55% of my net pay each month. But my CEO and his family of 4 have been to Disney World twice since October 2023. And they're going to Europe for 2 weeks this summer.

saalweachter 2y ago
I feel like the owner/operator of a six-person company styling themselves the "CEO" is symbolic of something, somehow.
- hollywood_court 2y ago
  Definitely. And his wife is the "Executive Assistant" although I've only seen her in the office 4-5 times since I started in October.
ProllyInfamous 2y ago
"Keep up all your hard work and next year I'll take you for a drive in my new sports car!" —Some Boss, probably
- hollywood_court 2y ago
  I know you're kidding, but one of my neighbors gets super excited because his boss allows him to job his sports car to lunch sometimes. My neighbor can't afford his own sports car but at least he gets to drive one to McDonald's a few times per month.

resource_waste 2y ago

> The lines at the food banks where I live are much longer than they were before COVID. what does this really mean? Like food is so cheap we are obese. So does this mean more people want freebies? Tasty brand name foods? My neighbor thought we were poor and gave us food they got from a foodbank, it was really nice (but odd) stuff. In 2024 I can't really understand using food as a measurement. There is too much.

btbuildem 2y ago
Well, if you can't understand, why such strong opinions? Read up about basics of nutrition, about how poverty and obesity are correlated, what "food deserts" are, the differences between processed and healthy foods, etc.
- resource_waste 2y ago
  Funny you mention that. Its my expertise. Food Deserts are defined in a way that is unhelpful, I live in a food desert in one of the richest counties. I have 0 grocery stores within 1 mile. But I have 6 grocery stores within 3 miles. Go ahead with the conventional sayings: Tell me the fallacious remark about McDoubles being the healthiest cheapest food ever. Go ahead and say something incorrect like processed foods are cheaper than fresh foods. In a few years you are going to change from thinking Fat is the devil to carbs are the devil. Then you will take up fasting, then keto, then gluten free. People in the US have too much money to care about food. These are people getting dopamine from food pleasure. No one wants to admit it.
  - btbuildem 2y ago
    No one will push against the claim there's far too many calories available, on average, in Western countries. That consumption is the automatic answer to anything that ails, it could be argued as well. It reeks of ignorance and obstinate privilege to claim people are too rich to care about food [1] [2], that having to travel 3 miles to get food is not a barrier to access [3] [4]. Saying that processed foods are more expensive than fresh is an outright lie [5][6][7]. The HN discussion forums are one of the last remaining places where we can expect civil and informed online discourse. Please try and keep with that spirit. 1: https://www.feedingamerica.org/about-us/press-room/53-million-received-help-2021 https://www.feedingamerica.org/about-us/press-room/53-millio... 2: https://gitnux.org/food-bank-statistics/ https://gitnux.org/food-bank-statistics/ 3: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/food-bank-use-highest-in-canadian-history-hunger-count-2023-report-1.7006464 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/food-bank-use-highest-in-cana... 4: https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/what-are-food-deserts#definition https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/what-are-food-dese... 5: https://foodispower.org/access-health/food-deserts/ https://foodispower.org/access-health/food-deserts/ 6: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9967271/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9967271/ 7: https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/press-releases/healthy-vs-unhealthy-diet-costs-1-50-more/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/press-releases/healthy-vs-... 8: https://www.aier.org/article/why-unhealthy-food-is-cheap-and-plentiful/ https://www.aier.org/article/why-unhealthy-food-is-cheap-and...