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And yet many countries have successful universal healthcare.

lotsofpulp 2y ago
I imagine those are dependent on population pyramids not turning upside down. But they seem to be at least flattening, if not turning upside down in all developed countries, hence my prediction of why there would be a change. I keep reading about NHS in the UK having issues holding it together.
- silverquiet 2y ago
  There's a PA at my general practitioner's office who's got to be about 80; it seems like a lot of healthcare jobs can be done into old age. I think about going the PA route after my next layoff actually because it seems like a job that could be a better fit for me.
- skhunted 2y ago
  The population pyramid is in better shape than many other countries with universal healthcare. Instead of imagining or searching for plausible sounding excuses study the issue a bit. A government run healthcare system can do much better than our current system and in a much more moral way.
- halostatue 2y ago
  The NHS (and many other UK institutions) has been starved of cash for fifteen years by the Tories led by increasingly incompetent PMs (I mean, seriously, if the best PM in the last fifteen years is David Cameron; frankly, a head of lettuce would have done better than most of the Tory caucus).
- gambiting 2y ago
  >>I keep reading about NHS in the UK having issues holding it together I'm in the UK and yep, the system is on the verge of collapse, but it feels like it's entirely by design so it can be finally privatised and killed off once and for all - it feels inevitable at this point. Basically right now it works for: - maternity - anything child related - emergency services(to an extent, unless you are literally dying you will still wait hours for an ambulance). Everything else is so massively underfunded it's a miracle it exists at all. A friend was referred to see a psychiatrist on the NHS recently - you know what the wait time is to see a psychiatrist on the NHS in our region? 210 weeks. About 4 years.
JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> yet many countries have successful universal healthcare Few which provide the level of care the upper middle class and above have come to expect in America. If you make more than $100 yo 167k (85th and 95th percentiles [1]), a good fraction of HN readers, you should be able to virtually walk into any medical establishment and get not only seen within a few days, but also tested and imaged by the latest technology, and consulted on by some of the best doctors in the world. You will do this without worrying about costs, because your employer has chosen an insurer who pitched on experience in addition to cost, because you have the market power to change jobs (or be heard by management) if your healthcare sucks. Universal healthcare means everyone on a PPO falls to the middle class’s HMO-esque standards. For us privileged few, that’s a tough pill to swallow. That is the fundamental injustice and tradeoff that locks us into the status quo, not some paranoia about socialism. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affluence_in_the_United_States https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affluence_in_the_United_Stat...
- skhunted 2y ago
  This is entirely wrong. My household income exceeds $300,000. My wife is a physician. It takes months to get an appointment with an ENT or dermatologist. In Germany, despite not being a citizen or having travel insurance I got an appointment with a dermatologist in 1 day. The cost was around 40 euros. These are anecdotes but they are just as valid as, “you should be able to virtually walk into..” statements. It was fear of socialism that caused the outrage at Clinton’s healthcare proposals. The fear and outrage was so great that for the first time in decades Republicans took control of the House of Representatives in 1994. Look up the number of times things being labeled communism and socialism has been used to try to halt legislation.
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > It takes months to get an appointment with an ENT or dermatologist Out of curiosity, where are you? (I should have geographically qualified my statement.) In New York, the Bay Area and even western Wyoming (in a wealthy enclave), I have never waited more than a week for an appointment. > fear and outrage was so great that for the first time in decades Republicans took control of the House of Representatives in 1992 Fair enough, will further qualify by last decades. The bracket I’m speaking of knows European healthcare. They understand it is generally high quality and much cheaper. But being able to demand an MRI or the surgeon of your choice when something goes wrong is a real perk, and the one politicians are talking about when they reference public medicine.

I imagine those are dependent on population pyramids not turning upside down. But they seem to be at least flattening, if not turning upside down in all developed countries, hence my prediction of why there would be a change. I keep reading about NHS in the UK having issues holding it together.

silverquiet 2y ago
There's a PA at my general practitioner's office who's got to be about 80; it seems like a lot of healthcare jobs can be done into old age. I think about going the PA route after my next layoff actually because it seems like a job that could be a better fit for me.
skhunted 2y ago
The population pyramid is in better shape than many other countries with universal healthcare. Instead of imagining or searching for plausible sounding excuses study the issue a bit. A government run healthcare system can do much better than our current system and in a much more moral way.
halostatue 2y ago
The NHS (and many other UK institutions) has been starved of cash for fifteen years by the Tories led by increasingly incompetent PMs (I mean, seriously, if the best PM in the last fifteen years is David Cameron; frankly, a head of lettuce would have done better than most of the Tory caucus).
gambiting 2y ago
>>I keep reading about NHS in the UK having issues holding it together I'm in the UK and yep, the system is on the verge of collapse, but it feels like it's entirely by design so it can be finally privatised and killed off once and for all - it feels inevitable at this point. Basically right now it works for: - maternity - anything child related - emergency services(to an extent, unless you are literally dying you will still wait hours for an ambulance). Everything else is so massively underfunded it's a miracle it exists at all. A friend was referred to see a psychiatrist on the NHS recently - you know what the wait time is to see a psychiatrist on the NHS in our region? 210 weeks. About 4 years.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

> yet many countries have successful universal healthcare Few which provide the level of care the upper middle class and above have come to expect in America. If you make more than $100 yo 167k (85th and 95th percentiles [1]), a good fraction of HN readers, you should be able to virtually walk into any medical establishment and get not only seen within a few days, but also tested and imaged by the latest technology, and consulted on by some of the best doctors in the world. You will do this without worrying about costs, because your employer has chosen an insurer who pitched on experience in addition to cost, because you have the market power to change jobs (or be heard by management) if your healthcare sucks. Universal healthcare means everyone on a PPO falls to the middle class’s HMO-esque standards. For us privileged few, that’s a tough pill to swallow. That is the fundamental injustice and tradeoff that locks us into the status quo, not some paranoia about socialism. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affluence_in_the_United_States https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affluence_in_the_United_Stat...

skhunted 2y ago
This is entirely wrong. My household income exceeds $300,000. My wife is a physician. It takes months to get an appointment with an ENT or dermatologist. In Germany, despite not being a citizen or having travel insurance I got an appointment with a dermatologist in 1 day. The cost was around 40 euros. These are anecdotes but they are just as valid as, “you should be able to virtually walk into..” statements. It was fear of socialism that caused the outrage at Clinton’s healthcare proposals. The fear and outrage was so great that for the first time in decades Republicans took control of the House of Representatives in 1994. Look up the number of times things being labeled communism and socialism has been used to try to halt legislation.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > It takes months to get an appointment with an ENT or dermatologist Out of curiosity, where are you? (I should have geographically qualified my statement.) In New York, the Bay Area and even western Wyoming (in a wealthy enclave), I have never waited more than a week for an appointment. > fear and outrage was so great that for the first time in decades Republicans took control of the House of Representatives in 1992 Fair enough, will further qualify by last decades. The bracket I’m speaking of knows European healthcare. They understand it is generally high quality and much cheaper. But being able to demand an MRI or the surgeon of your choice when something goes wrong is a real perk, and the one politicians are talking about when they reference public medicine.