6 ms·

I’m curious about the rewards/tokens aspect. Is this done using cryptocurrency (you mentioned bitcoin, urg, upthread), or something else?

hanniabu 2y ago
They smartly aren't answering b/c of how hostile HN is to crypto. Look how receptive these comments have been so far, that's a clear sign of HN's bias.
- ddtaylor 2y ago
  It's a subject that I am interested in and involved in yet I will never discuss it on Hacker News again. The attempts I made to genuinely interact related to crypto have been terrible on this website. It's unfortunate because I feel there is a very good discussion there regardless on whether you are for or against it but we don't get to see that discussion.
  - synctext 2y ago
    There is no crypto in Tribler. We have something much older then Bitcoin. It's a simple ledger who helped whom in the network. Simple case of earning points by helping others. Economically, its complex. Coin creation is decentralised, everybody prints their own 'money'. The value of that help-currency is based on how connected you are to the globally connected transaction graph. Then we maintain fairness in this micro-economy against freeriders. See study with 160 million trust records and 95k users [1]. [1] https://research.tudelft.nl/files/89353583/1_s2.0_S1389128621001705_main.pdf https://research.tudelft.nl/files/89353583/1_s2.0_S138912862...
    - hanniabu 2y ago
      > We have something much older then Bitcoin Then it's flawed. There's a reason why all earlier implementations failed. They were incomplete.
      - pessimizer 2y ago
        Yes, Tribler has completely failed as a cryptocurrency.
        0x457 2y ago
        To be fair, Bitcoin also failed as a cryptocurrency.
        CyberDildonics 2y ago
        It works fine if you're ok with paying $130 for a single transaction https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees.html#3m https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees...
    - kmacdough 2y ago
      Interesting I'll have to study this. I'm curious how this fares in the face of well- resourced adversaries. Also funny that the guy complaining about crypto convos went straight into hate mode for "not quite crypto" without any research or support. Presumably y'all have thought through this.
      - hanniabu 2y ago
        If it were able to withstand adversaries it would have been bitcoin before bitcoin
    - jerry1979 2y ago
      Interesting, it looks like it relies on a fraud detection scheme. Have you considered pairing Chaumian ecash with your reputation system?
  - unclebucknasty 2y ago
    I seem to remember a time when HN was much friendlier towards crypto. But, you have to admit the crypto community hasn't done itself any favors: Hype and endless promises that never came to fruition, astronomical transaction fees, frictionful technologies, exhausting volume of promising ("world-changing!") projects that under delivered (putting it mildly), rug pulls, thefts, and other outright scams, massive use cases for money laundering and criminal activity. Kind of hard to stay positive through all of that.
    - spencerflem 2y ago
      yeah- from the github repo linked "Numerous other projects try to create a generic approach using an ICO for funding and promising the early adopters a dazzling return-on-investment. Tribler is different. rant warning. We are non-profit academics. We do not want to replace the old elite with a new crypto-currency elite. What is changed if we replace backroom deals, lobbyists, middleman, and legal monopolies with the tools of the new elite: algorithms, early investor rewards, proof-of-dominating-stake, and smart contracts? Replacing the analog world and breading digital-native inequality does not make the world a better place." totally agreed, that's my problem with all of the bitcoin hype - it's mostly there to make the early investments more profitable which doesn't excite me much
      - hanniabu 2y ago
        > it's mostly there to make the early investments more profitable So like middlemen and the big businesses that exist now? Crypto democratizes
        spencerflem 2y ago
        yeah, a lot like that actually I like cryptography, the blockchain, decentralization etc. but the pitch of almost every ICO is- get in now and become massively rich (at the expense of people joining later), almost the exact same dynamic as investing in a company like Visa.
        Dylan16807 2y ago
- phone8675309 2y ago
  I'll be less hostile to crypto when the benefits of cryptocurrency outweigh the environmental destruction caused by its mining.
  - hanniabu 2y ago
    https://ethereum.org/en/energy-consumption/ https://ethereum.org/en/energy-consumption/
    - phone8675309 2y ago
      Ethereum is useless as a payment mechanism unless you like paying wildly varying fees, and therefore its benefits do not offset it (relatively less) energy use.
- ceejayoz 2y ago
  > Look how receptive these comments have been so far, that's a clear sign of HN's bias. Does "people don't like my idea, they must be biased" apply to murders, urethral sounding, and kicking puppies? Have you considered the possibility that some concepts earn hostility?
- toofy 2y ago
  what you call “bias” i call “learning from mistakes.” yes, i am biased against putting my hand on a burning stove top.

hanniabu 2y ago

They smartly aren't answering b/c of how hostile HN is to crypto. Look how receptive these comments have been so far, that's a clear sign of HN's bias.

ddtaylor 2y ago
It's a subject that I am interested in and involved in yet I will never discuss it on Hacker News again. The attempts I made to genuinely interact related to crypto have been terrible on this website. It's unfortunate because I feel there is a very good discussion there regardless on whether you are for or against it but we don't get to see that discussion.
- synctext 2y ago
  There is no crypto in Tribler. We have something much older then Bitcoin. It's a simple ledger who helped whom in the network. Simple case of earning points by helping others. Economically, its complex. Coin creation is decentralised, everybody prints their own 'money'. The value of that help-currency is based on how connected you are to the globally connected transaction graph. Then we maintain fairness in this micro-economy against freeriders. See study with 160 million trust records and 95k users [1]. [1] https://research.tudelft.nl/files/89353583/1_s2.0_S1389128621001705_main.pdf https://research.tudelft.nl/files/89353583/1_s2.0_S138912862...
  - hanniabu 2y ago
    > We have something much older then Bitcoin Then it's flawed. There's a reason why all earlier implementations failed. They were incomplete.
    - pessimizer 2y ago
      Yes, Tribler has completely failed as a cryptocurrency.
      - 0x457 2y ago
        To be fair, Bitcoin also failed as a cryptocurrency.
        CyberDildonics 2y ago
        It works fine if you're ok with paying $130 for a single transaction https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees.html#3m https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees...
  - kmacdough 2y ago
    Interesting I'll have to study this. I'm curious how this fares in the face of well- resourced adversaries. Also funny that the guy complaining about crypto convos went straight into hate mode for "not quite crypto" without any research or support. Presumably y'all have thought through this.
    - hanniabu 2y ago
      If it were able to withstand adversaries it would have been bitcoin before bitcoin
  - jerry1979 2y ago
    Interesting, it looks like it relies on a fraud detection scheme. Have you considered pairing Chaumian ecash with your reputation system?
- unclebucknasty 2y ago
  I seem to remember a time when HN was much friendlier towards crypto. But, you have to admit the crypto community hasn't done itself any favors: Hype and endless promises that never came to fruition, astronomical transaction fees, frictionful technologies, exhausting volume of promising ("world-changing!") projects that under delivered (putting it mildly), rug pulls, thefts, and other outright scams, massive use cases for money laundering and criminal activity. Kind of hard to stay positive through all of that.
  - spencerflem 2y ago
    yeah- from the github repo linked "Numerous other projects try to create a generic approach using an ICO for funding and promising the early adopters a dazzling return-on-investment. Tribler is different. rant warning. We are non-profit academics. We do not want to replace the old elite with a new crypto-currency elite. What is changed if we replace backroom deals, lobbyists, middleman, and legal monopolies with the tools of the new elite: algorithms, early investor rewards, proof-of-dominating-stake, and smart contracts? Replacing the analog world and breading digital-native inequality does not make the world a better place." totally agreed, that's my problem with all of the bitcoin hype - it's mostly there to make the early investments more profitable which doesn't excite me much
    - hanniabu 2y ago
      > it's mostly there to make the early investments more profitable So like middlemen and the big businesses that exist now? Crypto democratizes
      - spencerflem 2y ago
        yeah, a lot like that actually I like cryptography, the blockchain, decentralization etc. but the pitch of almost every ICO is- get in now and become massively rich (at the expense of people joining later), almost the exact same dynamic as investing in a company like Visa.
      - Dylan16807 2y ago
phone8675309 2y ago
I'll be less hostile to crypto when the benefits of cryptocurrency outweigh the environmental destruction caused by its mining.
- hanniabu 2y ago
  https://ethereum.org/en/energy-consumption/ https://ethereum.org/en/energy-consumption/
  - phone8675309 2y ago
    Ethereum is useless as a payment mechanism unless you like paying wildly varying fees, and therefore its benefits do not offset it (relatively less) energy use.
ceejayoz 2y ago
> Look how receptive these comments have been so far, that's a clear sign of HN's bias. Does "people don't like my idea, they must be biased" apply to murders, urethral sounding, and kicking puppies? Have you considered the possibility that some concepts earn hostility?
toofy 2y ago
what you call “bias” i call “learning from mistakes.” yes, i am biased against putting my hand on a burning stove top.