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> Luxury vehicles with limited market Models 3/Y are literally one of the cheapest EVs available in EU/US? > Hertz dumping them due to ROI problems Hertz fra

by rapsey 3y ago

> Luxury vehicles with limited market Models 3/Y are literally one of the cheapest EVs available in EU/US? > Hertz dumping them due to ROI problems Hertz frankly had a pretty terrible strategy going in. Buying a ton of cars without any infrastructure for them (Hertz locations without chargers).

Hamuko 3y ago
>Models 3/Y are literally one of the cheapest EVs available in EU/US? BYD Dolphin is 34 990 € and a Tesla Model 3 is 41 990 €. And both are pretty high up there in comparison to like a hybrid Toyota Corolla.
constantcrying 3y ago
What? That is total nonsense. The ID.3 is much cheaper, even ignoring VW picking up the government subsidies. With the subsidies it costs about as much as an ID.5. Of course prices get much lower, with actual low end EVs which started to hit the market. Tesla is anything but the cheapest EV.
dutchbrit 3y ago
> Models 3/Y are literally one of the cheapest EVs available in EU/US? They aren't (in EU)? Dacia Spring, Citroën e-C3, Fiat 500e, BYD Dolphin, ID.3 & Peugeot e-208 to name a few are quite a bit cheaper.
tnolet 3y ago
> Models 3/Y are literally one of the cheapest EVs available in EU/US? Er, no. Peugeot, Renault, Volkswagen etc. all make (way) cheaper models. Heck, even Volvo now has an EV (the EX30) that is ~EUR 8k cheaper than a Model y. Not even mentioning the Asian brand like Hyundai etc.
- pvaldes 3y ago
  Shh... I'll tell you a secret. For years and years a lot of the electric vehicles in lots of brands, weren't meant to be sold. The public were even advised by the car dealers not to buy them, and they were made so unattractive as possible. In part because the carmakers were probably unsure about its long term performance with a totally new technology, but the main reason was other. It just happens that the environmental emissions of a car maker fleet was calculated as the average of emissions from all their models in the current market. Those tiny, squared EV that looked like toys were built with the only purpose to decrease the brand average value. Thus they could have models contaminating more in the upper categories. (Plus painting the brand in green for PR purposes). All of this changed after Tesla started to show its claws and to be taken seriously.
  - arethuza 3y ago
    But as you say this has all changed - all those brands are now pushing electric cars as strongly as Tesla?
  - constantcrying 3y ago
    This certainly isn't true now though. No matter what the car makers want, they have to face the reality that in the relatively near future non EVs will be banned. Right now VW is even protesting suggestions that the coming ICE ban should be overturned.
  - kstrauser 3y ago
    That’s an extraordinary claim requiring extraordinary proof. I can’t imagine any brand spending tens of millions of dollars to make a car that they don’t want to sell. I’d also like to see evidence that fleet fuel economy is (mileage / number of unique car models) and not (mileage / number of cars sold).
    - arethuza 3y ago
      To be fair back ~8 or so years ago VW did have e-Golfs in dealer showrooms but the actual dealerships seemed really reluctant to sell them - my wife asked about one at the back of a showroom and basically had the salesman spend his time explaining why not to buy it even though it was rather more expensive than the car she ended up buying. Things have totally changed though VW-group dealerships now really push electric cars and its the ICE cars that are stuck in the back.
      - constantcrying 3y ago
        Might just have been the dealer wanting to sell your wife a better car. Also cost != margin. >Things have totally changed though VW-group dealerships now really push electric cars and its the ICE cars that are stuck in the back. Yes. The e-Golf was essentially a Beta Test, a Golf 7 built into an EV. Nowadays VW EVs have their own dedicated platform.
Projectiboga 3y ago
This post was about the US market not Europe or anywhere else.
drcongo 3y ago
This user's comment history is mostly Elon shilling. I presume the other comments are supposed to make us think it's not astroturf.

by rapsey 3y ago

Hamuko 3y ago

>Models 3/Y are literally one of the cheapest EVs available in EU/US? BYD Dolphin is 34 990 € and a Tesla Model 3 is 41 990 €. And both are pretty high up there in comparison to like a hybrid Toyota Corolla.

constantcrying 3y ago

What? That is total nonsense. The ID.3 is much cheaper, even ignoring VW picking up the government subsidies. With the subsidies it costs about as much as an ID.5. Of course prices get much lower, with actual low end EVs which started to hit the market. Tesla is anything but the cheapest EV.

dutchbrit 3y ago

> Models 3/Y are literally one of the cheapest EVs available in EU/US? They aren't (in EU)? Dacia Spring, Citroën e-C3, Fiat 500e, BYD Dolphin, ID.3 & Peugeot e-208 to name a few are quite a bit cheaper.

tnolet 3y ago

> Models 3/Y are literally one of the cheapest EVs available in EU/US? Er, no. Peugeot, Renault, Volkswagen etc. all make (way) cheaper models. Heck, even Volvo now has an EV (the EX30) that is ~EUR 8k cheaper than a Model y. Not even mentioning the Asian brand like Hyundai etc.

pvaldes 3y ago
Shh... I'll tell you a secret. For years and years a lot of the electric vehicles in lots of brands, weren't meant to be sold. The public were even advised by the car dealers not to buy them, and they were made so unattractive as possible. In part because the carmakers were probably unsure about its long term performance with a totally new technology, but the main reason was other. It just happens that the environmental emissions of a car maker fleet was calculated as the average of emissions from all their models in the current market. Those tiny, squared EV that looked like toys were built with the only purpose to decrease the brand average value. Thus they could have models contaminating more in the upper categories. (Plus painting the brand in green for PR purposes). All of this changed after Tesla started to show its claws and to be taken seriously.
- arethuza 3y ago
  But as you say this has all changed - all those brands are now pushing electric cars as strongly as Tesla?
- constantcrying 3y ago
  This certainly isn't true now though. No matter what the car makers want, they have to face the reality that in the relatively near future non EVs will be banned. Right now VW is even protesting suggestions that the coming ICE ban should be overturned.
- kstrauser 3y ago
  That’s an extraordinary claim requiring extraordinary proof. I can’t imagine any brand spending tens of millions of dollars to make a car that they don’t want to sell. I’d also like to see evidence that fleet fuel economy is (mileage / number of unique car models) and not (mileage / number of cars sold).
  - arethuza 3y ago
    To be fair back ~8 or so years ago VW did have e-Golfs in dealer showrooms but the actual dealerships seemed really reluctant to sell them - my wife asked about one at the back of a showroom and basically had the salesman spend his time explaining why not to buy it even though it was rather more expensive than the car she ended up buying. Things have totally changed though VW-group dealerships now really push electric cars and its the ICE cars that are stuck in the back.
    - constantcrying 3y ago
      Might just have been the dealer wanting to sell your wife a better car. Also cost != margin. >Things have totally changed though VW-group dealerships now really push electric cars and its the ICE cars that are stuck in the back. Yes. The e-Golf was essentially a Beta Test, a Golf 7 built into an EV. Nowadays VW EVs have their own dedicated platform.

Projectiboga 3y ago

This post was about the US market not Europe or anywhere else.

drcongo 3y ago

This user's comment history is mostly Elon shilling. I presume the other comments are supposed to make us think it's not astroturf.