4 ms·

You do need to develop a very thick skin in OSS to be able to thrive. You need to learn to just block those issues+people, both in the repo and mentally. I'm a

You do need to develop a very thick skin in OSS to be able to thrive. You need to learn to just block those issues+people, both in the repo and mentally. I'm a nobody, but still some of my projects got a bit popular and I felt the heat, e.g. one of them was a CSS library which was very "beginner friendly", so people came constantly to the Issues to ask help with their CSS and how to do their job (not about the library)* so I decided to remove the Issues tab in Github. This lead to someone opening a PR insulting people. But I know for every AH like that, there's thousands or millions of people who do benefit of using my software, so I try to keep it up. I do work fulltime so now I have little time to do new projects, but still keep up with the PRs and occasional small improvements in existing ones (e.g. adding types definitions, or moving to ESM). * IMHO the move that happened where newbies stopped trying to learn how to properly ask questions in SO since that community didn't allow homework questions or low quality and started going to the repos of the projects they used to ask those very same questions

codezero 2y ago
or we could demand that users of free software shouldn't dictate the culture of the community and that maintainers don't need thick skin. Instead maybe we should ask that users should be respectful and courteous.
- EasyMark 2y ago
  People do ask, but the abrasive ones will double down on it a lot of the time. All I do on my two projects is just block them/ignore them. I've had people make up whole new accounts to get at me again after a block on reddit and twitter
- franciscop 2y ago
  You cannot do that with the current tools. I'd even argue that Microsoft's corporate goals are a bit at odds with the community best interests, e.g. adding friction to Github or to join/add to a project would decrease Github use, which is likely a KPI internally.
- junon 2y ago
  Wishful thinking. Humans suck. That won't change, and it's only gotten worse. It's not a fun reality, but it's reality. The sooner you can come to terms with that fact, the sooner you can begin to navigate around it.
legostormtroopr 2y ago
> You do need to develop a very thick skin in OSS to be able to thrive. Yet, users or submitters of open-source must be coddled? One of the chief complaints about Linus Torvolds is his blunt communication style in response to poor quality code. So OSS developers must be able to accept very harsh critism or even insults but always be kind to users who offer nothing in return?
- jraph 2y ago
  Torvalds was unnecessarily unrespectful. He fixed this. Now, he is still to the point and harsh when needed, but in a respectful way. That works and it's still as effective, if not better (because, it turns out, you are more eager to take something in account if it's not insulting you). > So OSS developers must be able to accept very harsh critism or even insults but always be kind to users who offer nothing in return? For one's own sake, yes, it's better to be able to take the messages one receives. And no, this doesn't grant you the permission to be sloppy and not careful when communicating with other human beings. Now of course if someone insulted you, you'd be forgiven to not be overly nice with this person. Though avoiding to lower yourself to this person's level is the better option if you can help it. I personally find that someone who insulted someone else who responded with class looks particularly bad.
  - mrlonglong 2y ago
    I remember Alan Cox quitting Linux development for the same reasons. Today he works on miniature railways and 8 bit microprocessors with Fuzix.
    - raverbashing 2y ago
      Wow, I missed this Well good for him!
- franciscop 2y ago
  > So OSS developers must be able to accept very harsh critism or even insults but always be kind to users who offer nothing in return? I absolutely didn't say that, please don't twist my words. Not only did I not answer about the OSS dev response, but I also didn't make a moral judgement of what must be done, both of which you are attributing to me. They can answer with insults for all I care, but that's a lose-lose situation. The way the OSS is set up today is that you WILL get shit, so you should be able to weather it without it affecting you.
skydhash 2y ago
I was reading “Working in Public” and one of the ideas I agree the most was that the community can use the software, but not direct it. While communication is important, I’d restrict it to the appropriate channel: Using a bug report tools for issue; A feeback/roadmap tool for enhancement request; A forum for user/user support; A wiki for Guides. The actual project management would be read-only.

codezero 2y ago

or we could demand that users of free software shouldn't dictate the culture of the community and that maintainers don't need thick skin. Instead maybe we should ask that users should be respectful and courteous.

EasyMark 2y ago
People do ask, but the abrasive ones will double down on it a lot of the time. All I do on my two projects is just block them/ignore them. I've had people make up whole new accounts to get at me again after a block on reddit and twitter
franciscop 2y ago
You cannot do that with the current tools. I'd even argue that Microsoft's corporate goals are a bit at odds with the community best interests, e.g. adding friction to Github or to join/add to a project would decrease Github use, which is likely a KPI internally.
junon 2y ago
Wishful thinking. Humans suck. That won't change, and it's only gotten worse. It's not a fun reality, but it's reality. The sooner you can come to terms with that fact, the sooner you can begin to navigate around it.

legostormtroopr 2y ago

> You do need to develop a very thick skin in OSS to be able to thrive. Yet, users or submitters of open-source must be coddled? One of the chief complaints about Linus Torvolds is his blunt communication style in response to poor quality code. So OSS developers must be able to accept very harsh critism or even insults but always be kind to users who offer nothing in return?

jraph 2y ago
Torvalds was unnecessarily unrespectful. He fixed this. Now, he is still to the point and harsh when needed, but in a respectful way. That works and it's still as effective, if not better (because, it turns out, you are more eager to take something in account if it's not insulting you). > So OSS developers must be able to accept very harsh critism or even insults but always be kind to users who offer nothing in return? For one's own sake, yes, it's better to be able to take the messages one receives. And no, this doesn't grant you the permission to be sloppy and not careful when communicating with other human beings. Now of course if someone insulted you, you'd be forgiven to not be overly nice with this person. Though avoiding to lower yourself to this person's level is the better option if you can help it. I personally find that someone who insulted someone else who responded with class looks particularly bad.
- mrlonglong 2y ago
  I remember Alan Cox quitting Linux development for the same reasons. Today he works on miniature railways and 8 bit microprocessors with Fuzix.
  - raverbashing 2y ago
    Wow, I missed this Well good for him!
franciscop 2y ago
> So OSS developers must be able to accept very harsh critism or even insults but always be kind to users who offer nothing in return? I absolutely didn't say that, please don't twist my words. Not only did I not answer about the OSS dev response, but I also didn't make a moral judgement of what must be done, both of which you are attributing to me. They can answer with insults for all I care, but that's a lose-lose situation. The way the OSS is set up today is that you WILL get shit, so you should be able to weather it without it affecting you.

skydhash 2y ago

I was reading “Working in Public” and one of the ideas I agree the most was that the community can use the software, but not direct it. While communication is important, I’d restrict it to the appropriate channel: Using a bug report tools for issue; A feeback/roadmap tool for enhancement request; A forum for user/user support; A wiki for Guides. The actual project management would be read-only.