8 ms·

Stable Diffusion 3 API Now Available

246 points by roborovskis 2y ago

MyFirstSass 2y ago
- Models will be released - Free to use for non commercial projects - 20$/m subscription needed if project has less than $1m annual revenue or <1m users - Undisclosed "Enterprise" subscription needed for projects larger than above To me the $240/y sounds pretty awesome for a smaller commercial project, and i like they've set the threshold pretty high up. But still don't like "undisclosed" black box enterprise pricing though when they're running their own API, because it basically means they can tax you to death if you build a service that competes with their API right - so in effect only viable to create small companies with this tech?
- theolivenbaum 2y ago
  *under $1m annual revenue and <1m users
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
- Lacerda69 2y ago
  What SaaS company discloses their Enterprise prices?
  - MyFirstSass 2y ago
    A tangent but i believe all pricing should public information by law above some threshold to battle corruption, nepotism, cartel making and monopolies. I've seen too many governments and even medium sized companies paying absurd amounts to some shitty locked in cloud platform with lots of better alternatives, because someone got kickbacks, gifts, vacations or a seat on some board, and everyone should be more enraged. The EU has tried to battle this with various public procurement processes but it's a big clown show of course so i don't know what the solution is.
    - Turing_Machine 2y ago
      Unless there's absolutely no alternative, and it's something I desperately need, I basically won't buy anything that says "call for pricing" or some such, because I interpret that as "call so one of our trained liars (i.e., salesmen) can figure out how hard we can screw you". In many cases I'd even pay a premium to avoid talking to one of those people.
      - satvikpendem 2y ago
        You're not the target market, the CTO, CIO, or business development representatives are. So many developers say they won't ever buy "call for pricing" software, like, yeah, they know you won't, in fact that's what they bank on.
        Sharlin 2y ago
        And the execs won’t really worry about "how hard the salesmen can screw them", they know the rules of the game and understand that negotiations are negotiations. It’s a negotiator’s job to try to get a good deal, and that works both ways.
        satvikpendem 2y ago
        Yes. Devs who don't know sales are obviously not their demographic, they'll be speaking to layers of other biz dev people before they even get to the execs, and each one knows exactly how to extract concessions and discounts, and the opposing salesperson knows exactly how much of a discount they can give. In this way, it is much more of an efficient market than most devs think. Devs' reaction to all this is honestly the same as when a non-technical exec tells a dev why they "can't just get it done in a day, it shouldn't be that hard right?" People have their own competencies and are usually blind to others'.
        pid-1 2y ago
        CTO in a financial institution here. I don't talk to sales.
- CharlesW 2y ago
  > …they can tax you to death if you build a service that competes with their API right… I'm curious why that'd be a concern, since building a service that effectively just resells an API isn't a viable business model.
- ranit 2y ago
  > But still don't like "undisclosed" black box enterprise pricing though when they're running their own API, because it basically means they can tax you to death if you build a service that competes with their API right - so in effect only viable to create small companies with this tech? "undisclosed" doesn't imply changing the price after it was negotiated with you. It just mean they will negotiate the contracts for large projects, without disclosing the terms to the public ... in my view.
  - black3r 2y ago
    The "undisclosed" also mean they can just straight up give you different prices than they give to your competition which can affect fair competition in your field. Imagine that you compete with them in some different field..., or an easier one - if you compete with their investors' other investments..., or you're in a country with politicians donation/spending limits (which are common outside USA) and they give their software for $1 to "that one annoying politician" and it won't count as a discount towards their donation limit, because the "original price" is unknown.
    - chmod775 2y ago
      > The "undisclosed" also mean they can just straight up give you different prices than they give to your competition which can affect fair competition in your field. They could do that anyways. This changes nothing. Negotiating custom contracts is standard practice at the high end anyways. If your company is spending hundreds of thousands of dollars each month on something at list price, chances are you either got too much money or the company is run by suckers.
- wongarsu 2y ago
  > so in effect only viable to create small companies with this tech I assume stability wants to be in the role of building AI models not applications, so if you provide a clear and nontrivial value add beyond their API you should be fine. If you build a tool that allows architects to make their building renderings more lifelike by adding realistic crowds, vegetation, storefronts etc right from the comfort of their existing tooling it's in Stability's interest that you are successful. If you only resell their API but in green they might not be as invested in your success.
  - alexvitkov 2y ago
    "Should be fine" doesn't cut it if you want to base your business on it and have no alternatives.
    - wongarsu 2y ago
      Every Android or iOS App is a "should be fine" type of deal. So are lots of other things. If you are really worried I'm sure there's a sales person willing to take your call right now. It's not ideal, but honestly not that exceptional. And if push comes to shove you do have alternatives, you just need to sacrifice a bit of quality, maybe deployment complexity, and tune your prompts differently for one of the other models.
      - daveguy 2y ago
        Do android and iOS stores have undisclosed fee structures for high revenue or high usage apps? I was under the impression that the fees were at least transparent, even if they do represent monopolistic rent seeking.
        ethbr1 2y ago
        There were several instances that came out in recent court cases of the app stores negotiating custom deals with strategically-important apps. E.g. Spotify: https://www.theverge.com/2023/11/20/23969690/google-spotify-android-billing-commission-secret-deal https://www.theverge.com/2023/11/20/23969690/google-spotify-... So typical "above this negotiating power, let's talk terms", and everybody smaller has to pay list price.
- etaioinshrdlu 2y ago
  The enterprise subscription costs $120k/year. You might be able to haggle it down.
- BaculumMeumEst 2y ago
  I'm still goofing around with stable diffusion 1.5 based models. It has such a vibrant open source scene and it's free for commercial usage forever so.. I'm not really interested in V3. I guess corporations might be or whatever?
- dheera 2y ago
  Seems ripe for a "project sharding" platform that splits your project into multiple identical backend projects that each have <1M annual revenue and <1M of your users. Would save you from the unnecessary calls and coffee chats, you just pay N * subscription fee and get on with your life. You could probably also use part of the revenue to buy treasury bonds and automagically pay the subscription fees, and it would be a closed intervention-free system.
apetresc 2y ago
> In keeping with our commitment to open generative AI, we aim to make the model weights available for self-hosting with a Stability AI Membership in the near future. This is new, right? All previous releases as far as I can tell were just released on HuggingFace. Does this statement just imply something about licensing for commercial usage, or are they pretending that by gating the download behind a paywall that will somehow require people to buy memberships to get the weights?
poniko 2y ago
Big jump in price per generation and now is in line with dall3. So is the model 20-30 times more gpu intense or did they decide to finally make money?
- jsheard 2y ago
  After that report a few weeks ago saying they literally can't afford to pay their AWS bills I would guess it's the latter. https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrickcai/2024/03/29/how-stability-ais-founder-tanked-his-billion-dollar-startup https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrickcai/2024/03/29/how-stabi... > By October 2023, Stability would have less than $4 million left in the bank [...] Stability was "underpaying AWS bills for July (by $1M)" and "not planning to pay AWS at the end of October for August usage ($7M)." Then there were the September and October bills, plus $1 million owed to Google Cloud and $600,000 to GPU cloud data center CoreWeave [...] Stability was on track to lose more money per month than it made in an entire year.
  - emadm 2y ago
    Made that 4m last a long time eh ^_^
the_duke 2y ago
This Reddit thread from someone with early access has some sample images: https://old.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1c2je28/i_got_access_to_sd3_on_stable_assistant_platform/ https://old.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1c2je28/i_... Maybe the early access beta was limiting the available resources, or they used bad settings, bud juding by that thread it looks like the model got worse during training or the earlier examples were quite cherry-picked.
- airstrike 2y ago
  I didn't think those were bad at all
  - the_duke 2y ago
    Not bad, but also not the big jump over fine-tuned SD1.5/SDXL checkpoints that some expected.
    - Aeolun 2y ago
      Fine tuned 1.5 checkpoints are amazing. If only the models could comprehend instructions like SDXL or better.
  - Turing_Machine 2y ago
    That woman at the top (at least I assume it's supposed to be a woman) should be wearing a beauty pageant sash reading "Ms Uncanny Valley of 2024". Creepy AF, IMO. Agreed that some of the others aren't so bad, however the bar for a convincing swamp creature is a lot lower than for a convincing human being. If breasts come out looking like that, I'd be taking a hard look at my training data.
    - Hoasi 2y ago
      The whole picture reeks of bad taste. The hands are particularly terrible. Total fail! But then again, maybe it's due to a poor prompt.
- 2y ago
panki27 2y ago
"In keeping with our commitment to open generative AI, we aim to make the model weights available for self-hosting with a Stability AI Membership in the near future." Does this mean that SD3 will not be available from Huggingface etc.?
- glass-z13 2y ago
  Looks like it
- accrual 2y ago
  I've noticed some models on Hugging Face require an extra layer of terms acceptance, like a EULA. Maybe it'll be like that? Otherwise I'm guessing they want one to make a dedicated Stability AI account, accept some terms, and then enable the download.
- astrange 2y ago
  Emad said it will be the same as before on reddit. https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1c6awnl/comment/kzzzf3z/ https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1c6awnl/co...
zone411 2y ago
I ran the same quick prompt adherence and composition test on which ImageFX by Google surpasses DALL-E 3 by a bit (https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/open-thread-315/comment/49364729 https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/open-thread-315/comment/493...): 1. "A stained glass picture of a woman in a library with a raven on her shoulder with a key in its mouth" 2 out of 20 tries 2. "An oil painting of a man in a factory looking at a cat wearing a top hat" First try 3. "A digital art picture of a child riding a llama with a bell on its tail through a desert" 0 out of 20 tries 4. "A 3D render of an astronaut in space holding a fox wearing lipstick" 2 out of 20 tries 5. "Pixel art of a farmer in a cathedral holding a red basketball" First try So about even with these models and much better than previous versions of SD. Better than Midjourney v6.
- Kerbonut 2y ago
  You're essentially mixing units. "2 out of 20" does not match with "first try". I would have liked to see you run all of them for 20 and added comments in addition like "this got it right on the first try", which could also have been luck. I mean if it got 1 out of 20 but happened to get it right the first try, is that better or worse than 2 out of 20?
  - zone411 2y ago
    Like I said, it's a quick test, not a benchmark. The original question was about getting at least one of out 10 right (https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/a-guide-to-asking-robots-to-design/comment/6945486 https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/a-guide-to-asking-robots-to...). Feel free to run them yourself, takes 5 minutes.
- rsynnott 2y ago
  > "A 3D render of an astronaut in space holding a fox wearing lipstick" ... Who's supposed to be wearing the lipstick, the fox or the astronaut?
zone411 2y ago
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perstablintome 2y ago
I stumbled upon a thread debating whether SD3 will fully replace SD 1.5 and SDXL, or if it will still have trade-offs for different uses. Context: Stability is cutting out thousands of artists for "safety" reason, which means billions of images won't make the cut. I wondered how much the model will be nerfed in terms of nudity, artist names, and the like, and whether these issues can be resolved with some fine-tuning. Since I still don't have access to SD3, I'm compiling a list of all the Stable Diffusion 3 generations out there. I managed to scrape this info from Twitter using their premium API (which cost me a Benjamin!). I manually curated the images to ensure they are indeed SD3 generations and made it searchable. In case someone finds it useful, it's available here https://sd3.art/ https://sd3.art/
- spywaregorilla 2y ago
  Doesn't really matter. If the model is generally more capable and released, then it's trivial to teach it a few more things.
__loam 2y ago
I thought stability was disintegrating after burning through most of their capital.

246 points by roborovskis 2y ago

- Models will be released - Free to use for non commercial projects - 20$/m subscription needed if project has less than $1m annual revenue or <1m users - Undisclosed "Enterprise" subscription needed for projects larger than above To me the $240/y sounds pretty awesome for a smaller commercial project, and i like they've set the threshold pretty high up. But still don't like "undisclosed" black box enterprise pricing though when they're running their own API, because it basically means they can tax you to death if you build a service that competes with their API right - so in effect only viable to create small companies with this tech?

theolivenbaum 2y ago
*under $1m annual revenue and <1m users
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
Lacerda69 2y ago
What SaaS company discloses their Enterprise prices?
- MyFirstSass 2y ago
  A tangent but i believe all pricing should public information by law above some threshold to battle corruption, nepotism, cartel making and monopolies. I've seen too many governments and even medium sized companies paying absurd amounts to some shitty locked in cloud platform with lots of better alternatives, because someone got kickbacks, gifts, vacations or a seat on some board, and everyone should be more enraged. The EU has tried to battle this with various public procurement processes but it's a big clown show of course so i don't know what the solution is.
  - Turing_Machine 2y ago
    Unless there's absolutely no alternative, and it's something I desperately need, I basically won't buy anything that says "call for pricing" or some such, because I interpret that as "call so one of our trained liars (i.e., salesmen) can figure out how hard we can screw you". In many cases I'd even pay a premium to avoid talking to one of those people.
    - satvikpendem 2y ago
      You're not the target market, the CTO, CIO, or business development representatives are. So many developers say they won't ever buy "call for pricing" software, like, yeah, they know you won't, in fact that's what they bank on.
      - Sharlin 2y ago
        And the execs won’t really worry about "how hard the salesmen can screw them", they know the rules of the game and understand that negotiations are negotiations. It’s a negotiator’s job to try to get a good deal, and that works both ways.
        satvikpendem 2y ago
        Yes. Devs who don't know sales are obviously not their demographic, they'll be speaking to layers of other biz dev people before they even get to the execs, and each one knows exactly how to extract concessions and discounts, and the opposing salesperson knows exactly how much of a discount they can give. In this way, it is much more of an efficient market than most devs think. Devs' reaction to all this is honestly the same as when a non-technical exec tells a dev why they "can't just get it done in a day, it shouldn't be that hard right?" People have their own competencies and are usually blind to others'.
      - pid-1 2y ago
        CTO in a financial institution here. I don't talk to sales.
CharlesW 2y ago
> …they can tax you to death if you build a service that competes with their API right… I'm curious why that'd be a concern, since building a service that effectively just resells an API isn't a viable business model.
ranit 2y ago
> But still don't like "undisclosed" black box enterprise pricing though when they're running their own API, because it basically means they can tax you to death if you build a service that competes with their API right - so in effect only viable to create small companies with this tech? "undisclosed" doesn't imply changing the price after it was negotiated with you. It just mean they will negotiate the contracts for large projects, without disclosing the terms to the public ... in my view.
- black3r 2y ago
  The "undisclosed" also mean they can just straight up give you different prices than they give to your competition which can affect fair competition in your field. Imagine that you compete with them in some different field..., or an easier one - if you compete with their investors' other investments..., or you're in a country with politicians donation/spending limits (which are common outside USA) and they give their software for $1 to "that one annoying politician" and it won't count as a discount towards their donation limit, because the "original price" is unknown.
  - chmod775 2y ago
    > The "undisclosed" also mean they can just straight up give you different prices than they give to your competition which can affect fair competition in your field. They could do that anyways. This changes nothing. Negotiating custom contracts is standard practice at the high end anyways. If your company is spending hundreds of thousands of dollars each month on something at list price, chances are you either got too much money or the company is run by suckers.
wongarsu 2y ago
> so in effect only viable to create small companies with this tech I assume stability wants to be in the role of building AI models not applications, so if you provide a clear and nontrivial value add beyond their API you should be fine. If you build a tool that allows architects to make their building renderings more lifelike by adding realistic crowds, vegetation, storefronts etc right from the comfort of their existing tooling it's in Stability's interest that you are successful. If you only resell their API but in green they might not be as invested in your success.
- alexvitkov 2y ago
  "Should be fine" doesn't cut it if you want to base your business on it and have no alternatives.
  - wongarsu 2y ago
    Every Android or iOS App is a "should be fine" type of deal. So are lots of other things. If you are really worried I'm sure there's a sales person willing to take your call right now. It's not ideal, but honestly not that exceptional. And if push comes to shove you do have alternatives, you just need to sacrifice a bit of quality, maybe deployment complexity, and tune your prompts differently for one of the other models.
    - daveguy 2y ago
      Do android and iOS stores have undisclosed fee structures for high revenue or high usage apps? I was under the impression that the fees were at least transparent, even if they do represent monopolistic rent seeking.
      - ethbr1 2y ago
        There were several instances that came out in recent court cases of the app stores negotiating custom deals with strategically-important apps. E.g. Spotify: https://www.theverge.com/2023/11/20/23969690/google-spotify-android-billing-commission-secret-deal https://www.theverge.com/2023/11/20/23969690/google-spotify-... So typical "above this negotiating power, let's talk terms", and everybody smaller has to pay list price.
etaioinshrdlu 2y ago
The enterprise subscription costs $120k/year. You might be able to haggle it down.
BaculumMeumEst 2y ago
I'm still goofing around with stable diffusion 1.5 based models. It has such a vibrant open source scene and it's free for commercial usage forever so.. I'm not really interested in V3. I guess corporations might be or whatever?
dheera 2y ago
Seems ripe for a "project sharding" platform that splits your project into multiple identical backend projects that each have <1M annual revenue and <1M of your users. Would save you from the unnecessary calls and coffee chats, you just pay N * subscription fee and get on with your life. You could probably also use part of the revenue to buy treasury bonds and automagically pay the subscription fees, and it would be a closed intervention-free system.

apetresc 2y ago

> In keeping with our commitment to open generative AI, we aim to make the model weights available for self-hosting with a Stability AI Membership in the near future. This is new, right? All previous releases as far as I can tell were just released on HuggingFace. Does this statement just imply something about licensing for commercial usage, or are they pretending that by gating the download behind a paywall that will somehow require people to buy memberships to get the weights?

poniko 2y ago

Big jump in price per generation and now is in line with dall3. So is the model 20-30 times more gpu intense or did they decide to finally make money?

jsheard 2y ago
After that report a few weeks ago saying they literally can't afford to pay their AWS bills I would guess it's the latter. https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrickcai/2024/03/29/how-stability-ais-founder-tanked-his-billion-dollar-startup https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrickcai/2024/03/29/how-stabi... > By October 2023, Stability would have less than $4 million left in the bank [...] Stability was "underpaying AWS bills for July (by $1M)" and "not planning to pay AWS at the end of October for August usage ($7M)." Then there were the September and October bills, plus $1 million owed to Google Cloud and $600,000 to GPU cloud data center CoreWeave [...] Stability was on track to lose more money per month than it made in an entire year.
- emadm 2y ago
  Made that 4m last a long time eh ^_^

the_duke 2y ago

This Reddit thread from someone with early access has some sample images: https://old.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1c2je28/i_got_access_to_sd3_on_stable_assistant_platform/ https://old.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1c2je28/i_... Maybe the early access beta was limiting the available resources, or they used bad settings, bud juding by that thread it looks like the model got worse during training or the earlier examples were quite cherry-picked.

airstrike 2y ago
I didn't think those were bad at all
- the_duke 2y ago
  Not bad, but also not the big jump over fine-tuned SD1.5/SDXL checkpoints that some expected.
  - Aeolun 2y ago
    Fine tuned 1.5 checkpoints are amazing. If only the models could comprehend instructions like SDXL or better.
- Turing_Machine 2y ago
  That woman at the top (at least I assume it's supposed to be a woman) should be wearing a beauty pageant sash reading "Ms Uncanny Valley of 2024". Creepy AF, IMO. Agreed that some of the others aren't so bad, however the bar for a convincing swamp creature is a lot lower than for a convincing human being. If breasts come out looking like that, I'd be taking a hard look at my training data.
  - Hoasi 2y ago
    The whole picture reeks of bad taste. The hands are particularly terrible. Total fail! But then again, maybe it's due to a poor prompt.
2y ago

panki27 2y ago

"In keeping with our commitment to open generative AI, we aim to make the model weights available for self-hosting with a Stability AI Membership in the near future." Does this mean that SD3 will not be available from Huggingface etc.?

glass-z13 2y ago
Looks like it
accrual 2y ago
I've noticed some models on Hugging Face require an extra layer of terms acceptance, like a EULA. Maybe it'll be like that? Otherwise I'm guessing they want one to make a dedicated Stability AI account, accept some terms, and then enable the download.
astrange 2y ago
Emad said it will be the same as before on reddit. https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1c6awnl/comment/kzzzf3z/ https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1c6awnl/co...

zone411 2y ago

I ran the same quick prompt adherence and composition test on which ImageFX by Google surpasses DALL-E 3 by a bit (https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/open-thread-315/comment/49364729 https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/open-thread-315/comment/493...): 1. "A stained glass picture of a woman in a library with a raven on her shoulder with a key in its mouth" 2 out of 20 tries 2. "An oil painting of a man in a factory looking at a cat wearing a top hat" First try 3. "A digital art picture of a child riding a llama with a bell on its tail through a desert" 0 out of 20 tries 4. "A 3D render of an astronaut in space holding a fox wearing lipstick" 2 out of 20 tries 5. "Pixel art of a farmer in a cathedral holding a red basketball" First try So about even with these models and much better than previous versions of SD. Better than Midjourney v6.

Kerbonut 2y ago
You're essentially mixing units. "2 out of 20" does not match with "first try". I would have liked to see you run all of them for 20 and added comments in addition like "this got it right on the first try", which could also have been luck. I mean if it got 1 out of 20 but happened to get it right the first try, is that better or worse than 2 out of 20?
- zone411 2y ago
  Like I said, it's a quick test, not a benchmark. The original question was about getting at least one of out 10 right (https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/a-guide-to-asking-robots-to-design/comment/6945486 https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/a-guide-to-asking-robots-to...). Feel free to run them yourself, takes 5 minutes.
rsynnott 2y ago
> "A 3D render of an astronaut in space holding a fox wearing lipstick" ... Who's supposed to be wearing the lipstick, the fox or the astronaut?

zone411 2y ago

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deleted 2y ago
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perstablintome 2y ago

I stumbled upon a thread debating whether SD3 will fully replace SD 1.5 and SDXL, or if it will still have trade-offs for different uses. Context: Stability is cutting out thousands of artists for "safety" reason, which means billions of images won't make the cut. I wondered how much the model will be nerfed in terms of nudity, artist names, and the like, and whether these issues can be resolved with some fine-tuning. Since I still don't have access to SD3, I'm compiling a list of all the Stable Diffusion 3 generations out there. I managed to scrape this info from Twitter using their premium API (which cost me a Benjamin!). I manually curated the images to ensure they are indeed SD3 generations and made it searchable. In case someone finds it useful, it's available here https://sd3.art/ https://sd3.art/

spywaregorilla 2y ago
Doesn't really matter. If the model is generally more capable and released, then it's trivial to teach it a few more things.

__loam 2y ago

I thought stability was disintegrating after burning through most of their capital.