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Yeah, bro, very funny that the money I worked so hard to earn now buys 30% less in just 3 years. Absolutely hilarious.

by ein0p 3y ago

Dylan16807 3y ago
I think I misread something before I made that comment. Ignore the laughter. But even with that mistake, I don't know why you think I was calling inflation itself funny. - Though, you say the "money you worked so hard to earn"... I could interpret that as either wages or savings. If it means your wages buy 30% less, and inflation is 30%, then your nominal income hasn't increased. If so, something has gone very wrong, and it sounds like your employer is screwing you over. So I think you mean the savings you had a few years ago. Is that right? But if you had a meaningful amount of savings, were none of the savings in stocks? Stocks have gone up tremendously since the peak in early 2020. And if you had a mortgage, it would have effectively shrunk by whatever amount your nominal income increased.
- wakawaka28 3y ago
  >If it means your wages buy 30% less, and inflation is 30%, then your nominal income hasn't increased. If so, something has gone very wrong, and it sounds like your employer is screwing you over. Employers use the fake numbers to determine adjustments. It's not like they are necessarily screwing you over if they don't give you a 30% raise due to inflation either lol. They have to come up with extra cash because of inflation too. >But if you had a meaningful amount of savings, were none of the savings in stocks? Stocks have gone up tremendously since the peak in early 2020. That's not a profit dude. It's the simple phenomenon of everything costing more. Since most businesses are hurt by inflation, stocks do not keep up with rapid inflation. >And if you had a mortgage, it would have effectively shrunk by whatever amount your nominal income increased. It is true that inflation makes debts easier to pay, up to a point. But that means the lender gets screwed. It is a dysfunctional situation.
  - Dylan16807 3y ago
    > It's not like they are necessarily screwing you over if they don't give you a 30% raise Yes, but I wasn't asking about whether the raise is 30%. If you have a 12% raise during 30% inflation then you can buy 18% less, for example. > That's not a profit dude. It's the simple phenomenon of everything costing more. Since most businesses are hurt by inflation, stocks do not keep up with rapid inflation. It wouldn't have to be a profit for my point to work. But have you looked at stocks? The S&P 500 went up not just more than 30%, it went up more than 50%. Stocks did profit. And that's versus the relative peak. Any other baseline in the range of 4 years ago and the increase is even higher, and from 5 years ago it's up 75%. > But that means the lender gets screwed. It is a dysfunctional situation. You can't make everyone happy, but I was focusing on the experience of a relatively average person.
    - wakawaka28 3y ago
      >Yes, but I wasn't asking about whether the raise is 30%. If you have a 12% raise during 30% inflation then you can buy 18% less, for example. If you're supposed to be getting raises anyway, how much of your raise is due to inflation and how much is due to advancement? I am making more money than I did before the pandemic but that was almost 4 years of grinding to reach that point. All indications I've seen point to people's wages not keeping up with inflation. Wages always lag behind other prices, and usually by a lot. >It wouldn't have to be a profit for my point to work. Your point was precisely that "gains" in the stock market make up for other downsides of inflation. This just doesn't work out. Our economy relies on the value of money remaining stable. >But have you looked at stocks? The S&P 500 went up not just more than 30%, it went up more than 50%. Stocks did profit. And that's versus the relative peak. Any other baseline in the range of 4 years ago and the increase is even higher, and from 5 years ago it's up 75%. Sorry but stocks are supposed to profit. In real terms there is probably a slight profit. The rest of the increases are pure devaluation of the dollar. At some point, businesses will likely struggle to remain profitable as everyone tries to cut costs. >You can't make everyone happy, but I was focusing on the experience of a relatively average person. I think stable money would actually be the best-case scenario and would make people happier than high inflation. You have a very distorted idea of what is a "relatively average person"... Most people don't have money in the stock market (which I've already argued is not making up for inflation anyway). Most people don't own houses either. As much as I hate banks, lenders getting screwed due to inflation is terrible for the economy.

Yeah, bro, very funny that the money I worked so hard to earn now buys 30% less in just 3 years. Absolutely hilarious.

by ein0p 3y ago

Yeah, bro, very funny that the money I worked so hard to earn now buys 30% less in just 3 years. Absolutely hilarious.

I think I misread something before I made that comment. Ignore the laughter. But even with that mistake, I don't know why you think I was calling inflation itself funny. - Though, you say the "money you worked so hard to earn"... I could interpret that as either wages or savings. If it means your wages buy 30% less, and inflation is 30%, then your nominal income hasn't increased. If so, something has gone very wrong, and it sounds like your employer is screwing you over. So I think you mean the savings you had a few years ago. Is that right? But if you had a meaningful amount of savings, were none of the savings in stocks? Stocks have gone up tremendously since the peak in early 2020. And if you had a mortgage, it would have effectively shrunk by whatever amount your nominal income increased.

wakawaka28 3y ago
>If it means your wages buy 30% less, and inflation is 30%, then your nominal income hasn't increased. If so, something has gone very wrong, and it sounds like your employer is screwing you over. Employers use the fake numbers to determine adjustments. It's not like they are necessarily screwing you over if they don't give you a 30% raise due to inflation either lol. They have to come up with extra cash because of inflation too. >But if you had a meaningful amount of savings, were none of the savings in stocks? Stocks have gone up tremendously since the peak in early 2020. That's not a profit dude. It's the simple phenomenon of everything costing more. Since most businesses are hurt by inflation, stocks do not keep up with rapid inflation. >And if you had a mortgage, it would have effectively shrunk by whatever amount your nominal income increased. It is true that inflation makes debts easier to pay, up to a point. But that means the lender gets screwed. It is a dysfunctional situation.
- Dylan16807 3y ago
  > It's not like they are necessarily screwing you over if they don't give you a 30% raise Yes, but I wasn't asking about whether the raise is 30%. If you have a 12% raise during 30% inflation then you can buy 18% less, for example. > That's not a profit dude. It's the simple phenomenon of everything costing more. Since most businesses are hurt by inflation, stocks do not keep up with rapid inflation. It wouldn't have to be a profit for my point to work. But have you looked at stocks? The S&P 500 went up not just more than 30%, it went up more than 50%. Stocks did profit. And that's versus the relative peak. Any other baseline in the range of 4 years ago and the increase is even higher, and from 5 years ago it's up 75%. > But that means the lender gets screwed. It is a dysfunctional situation. You can't make everyone happy, but I was focusing on the experience of a relatively average person.
  - wakawaka28 3y ago
    >Yes, but I wasn't asking about whether the raise is 30%. If you have a 12% raise during 30% inflation then you can buy 18% less, for example. If you're supposed to be getting raises anyway, how much of your raise is due to inflation and how much is due to advancement? I am making more money than I did before the pandemic but that was almost 4 years of grinding to reach that point. All indications I've seen point to people's wages not keeping up with inflation. Wages always lag behind other prices, and usually by a lot. >It wouldn't have to be a profit for my point to work. Your point was precisely that "gains" in the stock market make up for other downsides of inflation. This just doesn't work out. Our economy relies on the value of money remaining stable. >But have you looked at stocks? The S&P 500 went up not just more than 30%, it went up more than 50%. Stocks did profit. And that's versus the relative peak. Any other baseline in the range of 4 years ago and the increase is even higher, and from 5 years ago it's up 75%. Sorry but stocks are supposed to profit. In real terms there is probably a slight profit. The rest of the increases are pure devaluation of the dollar. At some point, businesses will likely struggle to remain profitable as everyone tries to cut costs. >You can't make everyone happy, but I was focusing on the experience of a relatively average person. I think stable money would actually be the best-case scenario and would make people happier than high inflation. You have a very distorted idea of what is a "relatively average person"... Most people don't have money in the stock market (which I've already argued is not making up for inflation anyway). Most people don't own houses either. As much as I hate banks, lenders getting screwed due to inflation is terrible for the economy.