4 ms·

These particular numbers do not include suicide, but those numbers are very bad too. This Time article was written about our county a couple of years ago. I kno

These particular numbers do not include suicide, but those numbers are very bad too. This Time article was written about our county a couple of years ago. I know a few of the people quoted. https://time.com/6218385/suicide-rate-new-mexico/ https://time.com/6218385/suicide-rate-new-mexico/ White men in particular are checking out at an alarming rate. So while this is an "external" cause not counted in the stats of the article, I can't help but assume common causes. The kind of depression that makes you want to die also makes you not want to take care of yourself. It isn't difficult to get state paid medical care here, except for the distance. Appointments at the two small clinics are not far in the future and the medical staff is competent. I doubt doubling or tripling spending there would have much if any effect. I think it's more about people who have chosen to live a more traditional lifestyle and discovering that it's an increasingly poor fit for the modern world. A plague of psychiatrists could descend on our county like locusts and bury every depressed person in talk therapy, and I doubt it would help.

onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
There's only ~3500 people that live in the county. Due to random noise, there's bound to be some small county with shockingly high suicide rates. This would be a better, less alarmist, way to look at suicide rates: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/hestat/suicide/rates_1999_2017.htm https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/hestat/suicide/rates_1999_2017... Men used to commit suicide at about ~4x the rate of women, now it's closer to ~3.6x. White people commit suicide at high rates - and have for a long time (compared to other races) - and the growth in suicide in white people is outpacing other groups - but the growth rate is actually higher for white women (~68% vs ~41%).
- jibe 3y ago
  Not because the male suicide rate is declining, but because the female suicide rate is rising faster than the male suicide rate is rising.
- giantg2 3y ago
  "There's only ~3500 people that live in the county." The trend follows even when evaluated nationally for the urban vs rural rate. https://www.cdc.gov/ruralhealth/Suicide.html https://www.cdc.gov/ruralhealth/Suicide.html
  - onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
    Yeah, but it's 22 per 100,000 nationally, not 63.2 per 100,000 like in the small outlier county. That's about 1/3rd the rate in the time article - that seems alarmist and cherry-picking a small county to make a big story out of a smaller story.
    - giantg2 3y ago
      Eh, the article acknowledges that it's the highest rate nationally and provides the national rate (better disclosure than most articles). Their intent was to interview people affected by it. It's not a study but a news story. It makes sense they'd go to a more afflicted area to make their job easier and get some better ratings. It doesn't make the stories any less insightful to some of the issues faced by similar people. It's just like how the vast majority of gun crime doesn't involve schools, but school shootings get the bulk of the air time while the day to day problems aren't covered in detail, if they're covered at all. They're looking for the most impactful and easy story.
- ToValueFunfetti 3y ago
  I don't understand the focus on relative growth rates of very differently-sized groups. If the country had only these two groups and we had seen 100 additional deaths, that would mean ~70 additional male deaths and ~30 additional female deaths. While it is significant on its own that women made up an even smaller portion historically, it doesn't seem to me that that is a better description of the problem at large. Not that I think this is a gendered issue; suicide attempt rates are about equal between men and women, and the fact that men more often succeed doesn't really have any bearing on their relative mental health.
KittenInABox 3y ago
> It isn't difficult to get state paid medical care here, except for the distance. The distance can matter a ton, especially if you're already sick.
- delichon 3y ago
  Free rides are available on request. The clinics are in the only places with any population density, and it wouldn't be practical to add more, which would be in the middle of nowhere. It does contribute to the problem, but there's not much to be done about it.
  - KittenInABox 3y ago
    I'm only pointing out that I think you're minimizing the effects lack of close accessibility to healthcare is on, well, healthcare.
    - delichon 3y ago
      I'd guess it has less effect than the difficulty in getting fresh food. Most of the population here has to drive for long distances to get to a mini market filled with ultra processed food-like substances. If we could deliver a doctor or groceries to their front door the later would probably do more good.
      - paulryanrogers 3y ago
        Why?
        delichon 3y ago
        I think that the bulk of medical care goes to chronic diseases that have, in my case, been treated more effectively by a better diet. My diabetes, etc. got worse while I was taking medication, and better when I stopped the meds and switched to a better diet.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
wolverine876 3y ago
I'd say the primary problem is the attitude that there's nothing you or anyone can do about it.
- giantg2 3y ago
  I'm not sure they're saying that nothing can be done, just that increased healthcare and therapy is unlikely to make a large impact. Addressing the actual problems driving them to suicide could reduce the numbers. They have some programs about USDA aid, lawyers, accountants, etc that farmers can use to address some of the issues. https://www.opb.org/article/2021/08/03/farmers-are-at-risk-of-dying-by-suicide-resources-available/ https://www.opb.org/article/2021/08/03/farmers-are-at-risk-o...
  - wolverine876 3y ago
    > increased healthcare and therapy is unlikely to make a large impact In places where there is a lack of healthcare and therapy, increasing it seems very likely to make a significant impact. If they are against increasing it, then don't complain about the lack of healthcare.
    - giantg2 3y ago
      "increasing it seems very likely to make a significant impact." Have you been reading the same information here? There are other factors specific to rural areas that would need to be overcome for healthcare and therapy to have an impact on suicide.

onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago

There's only ~3500 people that live in the county. Due to random noise, there's bound to be some small county with shockingly high suicide rates. This would be a better, less alarmist, way to look at suicide rates: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/hestat/suicide/rates_1999_2017.htm https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/hestat/suicide/rates_1999_2017... Men used to commit suicide at about ~4x the rate of women, now it's closer to ~3.6x. White people commit suicide at high rates - and have for a long time (compared to other races) - and the growth in suicide in white people is outpacing other groups - but the growth rate is actually higher for white women (~68% vs ~41%).

jibe 3y ago
Not because the male suicide rate is declining, but because the female suicide rate is rising faster than the male suicide rate is rising.
giantg2 3y ago
"There's only ~3500 people that live in the county." The trend follows even when evaluated nationally for the urban vs rural rate. https://www.cdc.gov/ruralhealth/Suicide.html https://www.cdc.gov/ruralhealth/Suicide.html
- onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
  Yeah, but it's 22 per 100,000 nationally, not 63.2 per 100,000 like in the small outlier county. That's about 1/3rd the rate in the time article - that seems alarmist and cherry-picking a small county to make a big story out of a smaller story.
  - giantg2 3y ago
    Eh, the article acknowledges that it's the highest rate nationally and provides the national rate (better disclosure than most articles). Their intent was to interview people affected by it. It's not a study but a news story. It makes sense they'd go to a more afflicted area to make their job easier and get some better ratings. It doesn't make the stories any less insightful to some of the issues faced by similar people. It's just like how the vast majority of gun crime doesn't involve schools, but school shootings get the bulk of the air time while the day to day problems aren't covered in detail, if they're covered at all. They're looking for the most impactful and easy story.
ToValueFunfetti 3y ago
I don't understand the focus on relative growth rates of very differently-sized groups. If the country had only these two groups and we had seen 100 additional deaths, that would mean ~70 additional male deaths and ~30 additional female deaths. While it is significant on its own that women made up an even smaller portion historically, it doesn't seem to me that that is a better description of the problem at large. Not that I think this is a gendered issue; suicide attempt rates are about equal between men and women, and the fact that men more often succeed doesn't really have any bearing on their relative mental health.

KittenInABox 3y ago

> It isn't difficult to get state paid medical care here, except for the distance. The distance can matter a ton, especially if you're already sick.

delichon 3y ago
Free rides are available on request. The clinics are in the only places with any population density, and it wouldn't be practical to add more, which would be in the middle of nowhere. It does contribute to the problem, but there's not much to be done about it.
- KittenInABox 3y ago
  I'm only pointing out that I think you're minimizing the effects lack of close accessibility to healthcare is on, well, healthcare.
  - delichon 3y ago
    I'd guess it has less effect than the difficulty in getting fresh food. Most of the population here has to drive for long distances to get to a mini market filled with ultra processed food-like substances. If we could deliver a doctor or groceries to their front door the later would probably do more good.
    - paulryanrogers 3y ago
      Why?
      - delichon 3y ago
        I think that the bulk of medical care goes to chronic diseases that have, in my case, been treated more effectively by a better diet. My diabetes, etc. got worse while I was taking medication, and better when I stopped the meds and switched to a better diet.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

wolverine876 3y ago

I'd say the primary problem is the attitude that there's nothing you or anyone can do about it.

giantg2 3y ago
I'm not sure they're saying that nothing can be done, just that increased healthcare and therapy is unlikely to make a large impact. Addressing the actual problems driving them to suicide could reduce the numbers. They have some programs about USDA aid, lawyers, accountants, etc that farmers can use to address some of the issues. https://www.opb.org/article/2021/08/03/farmers-are-at-risk-of-dying-by-suicide-resources-available/ https://www.opb.org/article/2021/08/03/farmers-are-at-risk-o...
- wolverine876 3y ago
  > increased healthcare and therapy is unlikely to make a large impact In places where there is a lack of healthcare and therapy, increasing it seems very likely to make a significant impact. If they are against increasing it, then don't complain about the lack of healthcare.
  - giantg2 3y ago
    "increasing it seems very likely to make a significant impact." Have you been reading the same information here? There are other factors specific to rural areas that would need to be overcome for healthcare and therapy to have an impact on suicide.