5 ms·

Micronics Announces Desktop SLS 3D Printer, Starting at $2,999 [video]

45 points by Ninjinka 3y ago

jascination 3y ago
I started this video knowing absolutely nothing about 3D printing, and now I feel like I know a lot + could see a lot of use-cases for their printer. What a great demo video!
foobarian 3y ago
If I'm understanding this correctly, there won't be a way to print hollow parts, right?
- Opossum 3y ago
  No. The sintering happens layer by layer. So you can print hollow parts.
  - greesil 3y ago
    I think the parent comment was concerned about having a closed chamber full of powder when the print is done
  - javawizard 3y ago
    You can print them, but the "hollow" chamber you print will be full of powder with no way to remove said powder. That's a well-established limitation of both SLS and SLA printing. The classic way of getting around that is to leave a small hole in the chamber that's open to the outside - then you drain the powder out of that hole and, if needed, plug it up after you're done.
- twelfthnight 3y ago
  Not directly like FDM, but my understanding is you can design the part with "escape holes", so it's possible in certain circumstances.
- FeistySkink 3y ago
  Why not? Or do you mean infill?
greesil 3y ago
Ah cool. I've always wanted one of these but didn't want to either have a teensy print volume or pay $10K. Oh this is fun: https://www.reddit.com/r/3Dprinting/comments/15eq050/is_it_possible_to_get_a_cheap_sls_printer_6k_for/ https://www.reddit.com/r/3Dprinting/comments/15eq050/is_it_p... Apparently the plastic print powder is an explosion hazard. I hope they didn't skimp on safety.
- colechristensen 3y ago
  Basically every fine powder is an explosion hazard, the flour you have in your pantry included. (If you don’t believe me i have an old still standing but exploded flour mill in downtown Minneapolis to show you)
- javawizard 3y ago
  Yeah I wonder about that. They mention the whole glass build unit enclosure thing - that seems like that gives them a massive advantage over other SLA printers already. Wonder what else they've done? (And for that matter, how big is the risk anyway? As another commenter pointed out, flour is explosive too, but we don't have to do anything special with our flour bins at home to deal with it.)
sdhu333 3y ago
[dead]
javawizard 3y ago
Holy shit, this is mind blowing. I really hope they're able to pull it off. FDM printing is great but not when it comes to arbitrary geometries. I needed to print a 3-way ducting tee the other day that would have been incredibly time consuming to do on my Bambu X1 with all the support filament switching that would have been needed - whereas this printer would have been able to knock it out in no time flat. Really looking forward to when this releases.
thereisnospork 3y ago
Pretty slick. Bet with a higher power laser and some inert gas this could be modded to print from metal powder. Would make for a fun (if dangerous) project.
- pureheartlover 3y ago
  That would be so neat. I was imagining a small expendable nitrous-like canister that simply screws in to flood the chamber with argon or something.
niccl 3y ago
I love that they're using analog control for the galvos. I'm just struggling with a totally simple digital control loop for motors and I'm really regretting I didn't go with my first inclination and use op-amps
floating-io 3y ago
I'm assuming this is from micronics3d[1]? I'm not in a position to watch the video at the moment, but I don't see where the price was announced other than in the description of said video... [1] https://www.micronics3d.com https://www.micronics3d.com
labster 3y ago
I assume the refill cartridges will cost $1000 and have DRM?
- Euphorbium 3y ago
  And ads inbuilt.
- hennnnnnryyyy 3y ago
  It's open materials. You are allowed to use any materials and change any print parameters. 1 build chamber can be filled up with 1 bottle of material which is $220 and most of the un-used powder can be reused.
abetusk 3y ago
I would love for this to exist and, in my opinion, there's absolutely no theoretical reason why this shouldn't exist, but this sends off scam vibes to me. They've come out of left field, with, as of this writing, little to no online presence (low views and followers on Twitter and Youtube) and are promising a machine that's literally 10x cheaper than it's nearest competitor, with promises of having worked out all the reliability details of bed leveling, heating, sintering, cleaning and small feature size (0.15mm). In addition, they talk about abandoning digital controllers because of cost and going for analog only, which makes my bullshit detector go off. They also talk about recreating slicer software (using the Unreal engine). In other words, they've claimed to recreate the whole hardware, electronic and software toolchain for the industry to offer a high quality and affordable device. Again, its not like any of this theoretically can't be done, it's that the details are hard and tend to be underestimated by people. When someone promises to breeze past the tripping points of hardware, electronics and software that have been present for the last 20 years, I start to become suspicious. If this were a company in China (Shenzen, say) I would be much more open to the possibility, because of embedded domain knowledge and easy access to high end manufacturing. Note that fiber lasers have dropped 10x in cost to under $2k from $15k+ from what the were 10 years ago, so its not the price of high end technological devices isn't dropping at an exponential rate. Maybe someone else can comment on whether this is or looks more legitimate than I'm giving it credit for?
- krasin 3y ago
  > In addition, they talk about abandoning digital controllers because of cost and going for analog only, which makes my bullshit detector go off. This is only for driving galvo motors. And analog makes a lot of sense for that. Complexity is moderate too. > They also talk about recreating slicer software (using the Unreal engine) Back in 2017, I implemented my own (very basic - it was not generating any supports) slicer for resin printers, which would be a similar deal for SLS. It's not too hard, and the Unreal Engine actually has a lot of geometry bits implemented. So, I believe the guy on that. I share concerns about the rest of the system. Manufacturing is hard and it's doubly so when making machines, like 3d printers. We'll see, I guess. At the very least, it would be interesting to follow this development. I subscribed to their Youtube channel.
mvkel 3y ago
Compared to current consumer 3D printers, this seems like a massive step change. Curious what he meant about not needing support structures, being able to "print in mid air." How exactly do you pull that off? Surely gravity would protest.
- bb88 3y ago
  Each 100 micron layer is a layer of powder applied on top of what was already fused. The density of this powder is roughly the same as the fused material. So as the layers build up, the powder will "pack" in underneath the fused material, and support it.

45 points by Ninjinka 3y ago

I started this video knowing absolutely nothing about 3D printing, and now I feel like I know a lot + could see a lot of use-cases for their printer. What a great demo video!

foobarian 3y ago

If I'm understanding this correctly, there won't be a way to print hollow parts, right?

Opossum 3y ago
No. The sintering happens layer by layer. So you can print hollow parts.
- greesil 3y ago
  I think the parent comment was concerned about having a closed chamber full of powder when the print is done
- javawizard 3y ago
  You can print them, but the "hollow" chamber you print will be full of powder with no way to remove said powder. That's a well-established limitation of both SLS and SLA printing. The classic way of getting around that is to leave a small hole in the chamber that's open to the outside - then you drain the powder out of that hole and, if needed, plug it up after you're done.
twelfthnight 3y ago
Not directly like FDM, but my understanding is you can design the part with "escape holes", so it's possible in certain circumstances.
FeistySkink 3y ago
Why not? Or do you mean infill?

greesil 3y ago

Ah cool. I've always wanted one of these but didn't want to either have a teensy print volume or pay $10K. Oh this is fun: https://www.reddit.com/r/3Dprinting/comments/15eq050/is_it_possible_to_get_a_cheap_sls_printer_6k_for/ https://www.reddit.com/r/3Dprinting/comments/15eq050/is_it_p... Apparently the plastic print powder is an explosion hazard. I hope they didn't skimp on safety.

colechristensen 3y ago
Basically every fine powder is an explosion hazard, the flour you have in your pantry included. (If you don’t believe me i have an old still standing but exploded flour mill in downtown Minneapolis to show you)
javawizard 3y ago
Yeah I wonder about that. They mention the whole glass build unit enclosure thing - that seems like that gives them a massive advantage over other SLA printers already. Wonder what else they've done? (And for that matter, how big is the risk anyway? As another commenter pointed out, flour is explosive too, but we don't have to do anything special with our flour bins at home to deal with it.)

sdhu333 3y ago

[dead]

javawizard 3y ago

Holy shit, this is mind blowing. I really hope they're able to pull it off. FDM printing is great but not when it comes to arbitrary geometries. I needed to print a 3-way ducting tee the other day that would have been incredibly time consuming to do on my Bambu X1 with all the support filament switching that would have been needed - whereas this printer would have been able to knock it out in no time flat. Really looking forward to when this releases.

thereisnospork 3y ago

Pretty slick. Bet with a higher power laser and some inert gas this could be modded to print from metal powder. Would make for a fun (if dangerous) project.

pureheartlover 3y ago
That would be so neat. I was imagining a small expendable nitrous-like canister that simply screws in to flood the chamber with argon or something.

niccl 3y ago

I love that they're using analog control for the galvos. I'm just struggling with a totally simple digital control loop for motors and I'm really regretting I didn't go with my first inclination and use op-amps

floating-io 3y ago

I'm assuming this is from micronics3d[1]? I'm not in a position to watch the video at the moment, but I don't see where the price was announced other than in the description of said video... [1] https://www.micronics3d.com https://www.micronics3d.com

labster 3y ago

I assume the refill cartridges will cost $1000 and have DRM?

Euphorbium 3y ago
And ads inbuilt.
hennnnnnryyyy 3y ago
It's open materials. You are allowed to use any materials and change any print parameters. 1 build chamber can be filled up with 1 bottle of material which is $220 and most of the un-used powder can be reused.

abetusk 3y ago

I would love for this to exist and, in my opinion, there's absolutely no theoretical reason why this shouldn't exist, but this sends off scam vibes to me. They've come out of left field, with, as of this writing, little to no online presence (low views and followers on Twitter and Youtube) and are promising a machine that's literally 10x cheaper than it's nearest competitor, with promises of having worked out all the reliability details of bed leveling, heating, sintering, cleaning and small feature size (0.15mm). In addition, they talk about abandoning digital controllers because of cost and going for analog only, which makes my bullshit detector go off. They also talk about recreating slicer software (using the Unreal engine). In other words, they've claimed to recreate the whole hardware, electronic and software toolchain for the industry to offer a high quality and affordable device. Again, its not like any of this theoretically can't be done, it's that the details are hard and tend to be underestimated by people. When someone promises to breeze past the tripping points of hardware, electronics and software that have been present for the last 20 years, I start to become suspicious. If this were a company in China (Shenzen, say) I would be much more open to the possibility, because of embedded domain knowledge and easy access to high end manufacturing. Note that fiber lasers have dropped 10x in cost to under $2k from $15k+ from what the were 10 years ago, so its not the price of high end technological devices isn't dropping at an exponential rate. Maybe someone else can comment on whether this is or looks more legitimate than I'm giving it credit for?

krasin 3y ago
> In addition, they talk about abandoning digital controllers because of cost and going for analog only, which makes my bullshit detector go off. This is only for driving galvo motors. And analog makes a lot of sense for that. Complexity is moderate too. > They also talk about recreating slicer software (using the Unreal engine) Back in 2017, I implemented my own (very basic - it was not generating any supports) slicer for resin printers, which would be a similar deal for SLS. It's not too hard, and the Unreal Engine actually has a lot of geometry bits implemented. So, I believe the guy on that. I share concerns about the rest of the system. Manufacturing is hard and it's doubly so when making machines, like 3d printers. We'll see, I guess. At the very least, it would be interesting to follow this development. I subscribed to their Youtube channel.

mvkel 3y ago

Compared to current consumer 3D printers, this seems like a massive step change. Curious what he meant about not needing support structures, being able to "print in mid air." How exactly do you pull that off? Surely gravity would protest.

bb88 3y ago
Each 100 micron layer is a layer of powder applied on top of what was already fused. The density of this powder is roughly the same as the fused material. So as the layers build up, the powder will "pack" in underneath the fused material, and support it.