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>What is the point of referring to other cases, which may or may not be unreasonable, and using them to throw out the court's authority? Without even reading th

>What is the point of referring to other cases, which may or may not be unreasonable, and using them to throw out the court's authority? Without even reading their ruling, for that matter. Or worse, for no reason other than you don't like their ruling? Because the discussion was about the quality of the Court's opinions in general. I'm not sure what is so difficult about that for you to grasp. >The answer is there is no point, at least not any that is productive. We are just people sharing opinions on HN, I'm not sure where you got the impression that your posts were productive, or any of the posts here are productive, nor by what means you seem to have used to come to such a conclusion. >Read the ruling and make your case. Otherwise there can't be any useful conversations. Once again, you are being unreasonable. It's completely valid to talk about the general quality of decisions made by a circuit court. I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion that such a thing cannot be discussed "productively" And it seems you are basing your opinion here on the fact that wait for it others disagree with you! >The answer is there is no point, at least not any that is productive. All you achieve is the spreading of doubt and uncertainty about the judiciary and thus the laws governing the land. The legitimacy of any court is based on, in part, how it is received by the public. That's the nature of government and law. I'm really not sure how you came to the conclusion that courts cannot be criticized, but it's flat-out asinine. The 5th Circuit has done its own work to spread doubt and uncertainty regarding the quality of its rulings, and that is absolutely not the fault of anyone pointing out the deficient quality of a number of its recent rulings. To suggest otherwise seems more than stifling.

Dalewyn 3y ago
>Because the discussion was about the quality of the Court's opinions in general. I'm not sure what is so difficult about that for you to grasp. Because the discussion is about the ruling on this case by the court. Discrediting the court because of dogma is utterly pointless. >Once again, you are being unreasonable. It's completely valid to talk about the general quality of decisions made by a circuit court. I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion that such a thing cannot be discussed "productively" And it seems you are basing your opinion here on the fact that wait for it others disagree with you! It's one thing to read the ruling and poignantly point out flaws so they can be criticized in ways that are useful. Constructive criticism, as it's often called. Criticizing the judiciary in itself is fine and certainly encouraged. In fact, this is fundamental to the concept of appealing to higher courts. What's not fine is criticizing the courts solely because you don't like how they ruled. You didn't even read their ruling. You're just trying to discredit an entire foundational institution because they didn't act in your favor. That is nonsense and an affront to rule of law and a functioning society. >The legitimacy of any court is based on, in part, how it is received by the public. That's the nature of government and law. I'm really not sure how you came to the conclusion that courts cannot be criticized, but it's flat-out asinine. See prior point. >The 5th Circuit has done its own work to spread doubt and uncertainty regarding the quality of its rulings, and that is absolutely not the fault of anyone pointing out the deficient quality of a number of its recent rulings. To suggest otherwise seems more than stifling. If we're going to discuss the ruling of a court, it is a requirement that we read the ruling and consider the points made. That is not happening here, and I am going to call that bullshit out.
- freejazz 3y ago
  >Because the discussion is about the ruling on this case by the court. Discrediting the court because of dogma is utterly pointless. No, the post you replied to was about the 5th Circuit in general. >What's not fine is criticizing the courts solely because you don't like how they ruled. You didn't even read their ruling. You're just trying to discredit an entire foundational institution because they didn't act in your favor. That is nonsense and an affront to rule of law and a functioning society. Once again, not what anyone was doing. It is what you are doing about other people's criticism. >If we're going to discuss the ruling of a court, it is a requirement that we read the ruling and consider the points made. That is not happening here, and I am going to call that bullshit out. We were discussing the 5th Circuit's rulings in general. I'm not going to belabor this, you can make up whatever you want to justify your posts, that's your choice.
  - Dalewyn 3y ago
    >No, the post you replied to was about the 5th Circuit in general. Which was in reply to another post about the 5th circuit, which was in reply to my post about the ruling on this case, which was in reply to a post about the need for regulations to ban chemicals, which was in reply to the linked article about the 5th circuit's ruling on this case. This whole thread is about the ruling on this case. >Once again, not what anyone was doing. It is what you are doing about other people's criticism. Literally what the post I replied to was doing, calling the court "wild" and "twisted". Incidentally, nobody including you has mentioned what about this ruling is "wild" and "twisted" yet despite numerous requests to do so. Are you aware how discussions on a subject matter are conducted? >We were discussing the 5th Circuit's rulings in general. I'm not going to belabor this, you can make up whatever you want to justify your posts, that's your choice. See first point. If you want to talk about the 5th circuit in general, make your own thread. This thread is about the 5th circuit's ruling on the case between EPA and Inhance.
    - freejazz 3y ago
      >This whole thread is about the ruling on this case. So you are saying no one can discuss the 5th circuit in general in response to one of its rulings? One might even say "this ruling is reasonable, but that court sure hasn't been lately" and you'd still say the same. Get a grip! >Incidentally, nobody including you has mentioned what about this ruling is "wild" and "twisted" yet despite numerous requests to do so. Are you aware how discussions on a subject matter are conducted? I never said any of those things. You are really picking the wrong bone with me.

Dalewyn 3y ago

>Because the discussion was about the quality of the Court's opinions in general. I'm not sure what is so difficult about that for you to grasp. Because the discussion is about the ruling on this case by the court. Discrediting the court because of dogma is utterly pointless. >Once again, you are being unreasonable. It's completely valid to talk about the general quality of decisions made by a circuit court. I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion that such a thing cannot be discussed "productively" And it seems you are basing your opinion here on the fact that wait for it others disagree with you! It's one thing to read the ruling and poignantly point out flaws so they can be criticized in ways that are useful. Constructive criticism, as it's often called. Criticizing the judiciary in itself is fine and certainly encouraged. In fact, this is fundamental to the concept of appealing to higher courts. What's not fine is criticizing the courts solely because you don't like how they ruled. You didn't even read their ruling. You're just trying to discredit an entire foundational institution because they didn't act in your favor. That is nonsense and an affront to rule of law and a functioning society. >The legitimacy of any court is based on, in part, how it is received by the public. That's the nature of government and law. I'm really not sure how you came to the conclusion that courts cannot be criticized, but it's flat-out asinine. See prior point. >The 5th Circuit has done its own work to spread doubt and uncertainty regarding the quality of its rulings, and that is absolutely not the fault of anyone pointing out the deficient quality of a number of its recent rulings. To suggest otherwise seems more than stifling. If we're going to discuss the ruling of a court, it is a requirement that we read the ruling and consider the points made. That is not happening here, and I am going to call that bullshit out.

freejazz 3y ago
>Because the discussion is about the ruling on this case by the court. Discrediting the court because of dogma is utterly pointless. No, the post you replied to was about the 5th Circuit in general. >What's not fine is criticizing the courts solely because you don't like how they ruled. You didn't even read their ruling. You're just trying to discredit an entire foundational institution because they didn't act in your favor. That is nonsense and an affront to rule of law and a functioning society. Once again, not what anyone was doing. It is what you are doing about other people's criticism. >If we're going to discuss the ruling of a court, it is a requirement that we read the ruling and consider the points made. That is not happening here, and I am going to call that bullshit out. We were discussing the 5th Circuit's rulings in general. I'm not going to belabor this, you can make up whatever you want to justify your posts, that's your choice.
- Dalewyn 3y ago
  >No, the post you replied to was about the 5th Circuit in general. Which was in reply to another post about the 5th circuit, which was in reply to my post about the ruling on this case, which was in reply to a post about the need for regulations to ban chemicals, which was in reply to the linked article about the 5th circuit's ruling on this case. This whole thread is about the ruling on this case. >Once again, not what anyone was doing. It is what you are doing about other people's criticism. Literally what the post I replied to was doing, calling the court "wild" and "twisted". Incidentally, nobody including you has mentioned what about this ruling is "wild" and "twisted" yet despite numerous requests to do so. Are you aware how discussions on a subject matter are conducted? >We were discussing the 5th Circuit's rulings in general. I'm not going to belabor this, you can make up whatever you want to justify your posts, that's your choice. See first point. If you want to talk about the 5th circuit in general, make your own thread. This thread is about the 5th circuit's ruling on the case between EPA and Inhance.
  - freejazz 3y ago
    >This whole thread is about the ruling on this case. So you are saying no one can discuss the 5th circuit in general in response to one of its rulings? One might even say "this ruling is reasonable, but that court sure hasn't been lately" and you'd still say the same. Get a grip! >Incidentally, nobody including you has mentioned what about this ruling is "wild" and "twisted" yet despite numerous requests to do so. Are you aware how discussions on a subject matter are conducted? I never said any of those things. You are really picking the wrong bone with me.