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Apple Turned on 'Discoverable by Others'. You Might Want It Off

52 points by fortran77 3y ago

dieselgate 3y ago
This is literally my biggest irritation with tech - when chit changes and the User isn’t explicitly made aware.
- amelius 3y ago
  Even if the user is aware, it can be very annoying when stuff changes. It's like someone comes into your house and changes the furniture.
  - dieselgate 3y ago
    Makes me think of “terms of service can change at any time” type stuff. At least we get some email about it and have a paper trail but who can keep up
- Kluggy 3y ago
  In this case, this is a new feature for a new app. They didn't change anything. The setting didn't exist before, nor did the app
  - gmd63 3y ago
    Installing a new app onto a phone absolutely changes the phone. This app was packaged in an OS update.
  - chatmasta 3y ago
    They auto-installed the app on everyone's phone, and auto-enabled this feature on everyone's phone. The feature sends my location to someone else when they are nearby and using the app. So even though I deleted the app, other people nearby could still receive information about me because I haven't disabled the default toggle I never opted into in the first place. It's almost suspiciously malicious that they auto-enabled this feature and auto-installed the app for everyone at the same time.
ValentineC 3y ago
https://archive.li/VL5t7 https://archive.li/VL5t7
- chatmasta 3y ago
  These links never work for me because I use Cloudflare VPN (and even just Cloudflare DNS is enough to cause the problem). They don't work because Cloudflare preserves the user's privacy by not sending the originating subnet in eDNS requests to the upstream resolver. [0] This archive network is also run by an unknown actor with unknown motives but a demonstrated willingness to pay the high infrastructure costs. And this actor refuses to resolve DNS requests unless they include the subnet of the originating IP. I'm not against posting them, but I wish there were a better option. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EDNS_Client_Subnet#Controversy_over_lack_of_support https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EDNS_Client_Subnet#Controversy...
pulvinar 3y ago
It's in Settings > Privacy & Security > Journaling Suggestions. I guess it could be useful to keep enabled for your friends. That is, if they're too lazy to enter "I met with Joe and Mary today" in their journal app.
- chatmasta 3y ago
  Wow, that's pretty egregious, especially considering I have lockdown mode enabled, which already disables similar functionality from Messages.app (e.g. it won't share my "focus" status with people who message me). Also, I deleted the "journal" app as soon as I saw it appear on my homescreen, so it's especially annoying to find this hidden toggle enabled and willfully broadcasting my information to anyone nearby with the journal app installed (which is everyone with an iPhone, since Apple force installed the app for everyone).
deleted 3y ago
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deleted 3y ago
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kencausey 3y ago
Context is Journalling app.
- Brian_K_White 3y ago
  If we're supplying context, then it seems funny to omit the context that, * it's a journalling app the user did not seek out and choose to install, * was not brought to their attention that it was installed, * with a data-broadcasting setting pre-configured to disregard the users explicitly indicated intentions via the OS lockdown mode setting. The fact that it's a journalling app seems not to matter at all as far as I can see. The remarkable issue was never that a journalling app wants to record your life.
anotherhue 3y ago
Seems it also turned off 24 hour clock. How trust inducing.
jrmg 3y ago
The article doesn’t actually explain why ‘You Might Want It Off’ beyond: If you don’t want your device to be included in that tally of nearby contacts for others, you can toggle it off. Just remember that leaving it on won’t tell your friends—or Apple—anything about you personally.
- andy_xor_andrew 3y ago
  > If you don’t want your device to be included in that tally of nearby contacts for others, you can toggle it off. Just remember that leaving it on won’t tell your friends—or Apple—anything about you personally. That sentence seems like a self-contradiction? If it didn't tell my friends--or Apple--anything about me, how can it result in my friends getting journaling suggestions that are different based on whether the feature is enabled or not? Unless the author thinks "knowing who you were with and when" does not count as "knowing anything about you," which I would strongly disagree with, and I'm not even generally a paranoid person like some on HN are (no offense to them, glad they're paying attention)
  - shuckles 3y ago
    You can know how many of your friends are nearby without knowing who they are.
    - chatmasta 3y ago
      The text beneath the toggle is "Allows others to detect you are nearby to help prioritize their suggestions." This implies it's broadcasting some beacons containing my phone number to nearby devices, which can listen for those beacons and compare them with their contacts list.
      - shuckles 3y ago
        Yeah, appears that way: https://www.apple.com/legal/privacy/data/en/journaling-suggestions/ https://www.apple.com/legal/privacy/data/en/journaling-sugge.... The caveat is that devices store counts not identities, but it does seem like some notion of identity is broadcasted.
HumblyTossed 3y ago
Doesn’t Microsoft get slammed for this crap every other month here? I’m eager to see how this goes over with the Apple loyalists. At any rate, this should never happen. This is not good at all.
- c420 3y ago
  It's flagged and buried; there's your answer.
alphabettsy 3y ago
This works similar to Covid contact tracing except limited to known contacts. Seems harmless, though it shouldn’t be on by default.
slowmovintarget 3y ago
Journaling is something I do with a fountain pen and suitable notebook. It's in large part about the sitting down, deliberately taking time to move the nib across the page, seeing the ink go on wet. Why would I want a phone app to log my life as an afterthought?
fortran77 3y ago
[flagged]

52 points by fortran77 3y ago

dieselgate 3y ago

This is literally my biggest irritation with tech - when chit changes and the User isn’t explicitly made aware.

amelius 3y ago
Even if the user is aware, it can be very annoying when stuff changes. It's like someone comes into your house and changes the furniture.
- dieselgate 3y ago
  Makes me think of “terms of service can change at any time” type stuff. At least we get some email about it and have a paper trail but who can keep up
Kluggy 3y ago
In this case, this is a new feature for a new app. They didn't change anything. The setting didn't exist before, nor did the app
- gmd63 3y ago
  Installing a new app onto a phone absolutely changes the phone. This app was packaged in an OS update.
- chatmasta 3y ago
  They auto-installed the app on everyone's phone, and auto-enabled this feature on everyone's phone. The feature sends my location to someone else when they are nearby and using the app. So even though I deleted the app, other people nearby could still receive information about me because I haven't disabled the default toggle I never opted into in the first place. It's almost suspiciously malicious that they auto-enabled this feature and auto-installed the app for everyone at the same time.

ValentineC 3y ago

https://archive.li/VL5t7 https://archive.li/VL5t7

chatmasta 3y ago
These links never work for me because I use Cloudflare VPN (and even just Cloudflare DNS is enough to cause the problem). They don't work because Cloudflare preserves the user's privacy by not sending the originating subnet in eDNS requests to the upstream resolver. [0] This archive network is also run by an unknown actor with unknown motives but a demonstrated willingness to pay the high infrastructure costs. And this actor refuses to resolve DNS requests unless they include the subnet of the originating IP. I'm not against posting them, but I wish there were a better option. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EDNS_Client_Subnet#Controversy_over_lack_of_support https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EDNS_Client_Subnet#Controversy...

pulvinar 3y ago

It's in Settings > Privacy & Security > Journaling Suggestions. I guess it could be useful to keep enabled for your friends. That is, if they're too lazy to enter "I met with Joe and Mary today" in their journal app.

chatmasta 3y ago
Wow, that's pretty egregious, especially considering I have lockdown mode enabled, which already disables similar functionality from Messages.app (e.g. it won't share my "focus" status with people who message me). Also, I deleted the "journal" app as soon as I saw it appear on my homescreen, so it's especially annoying to find this hidden toggle enabled and willfully broadcasting my information to anyone nearby with the journal app installed (which is everyone with an iPhone, since Apple force installed the app for everyone).

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

kencausey 3y ago

Context is Journalling app.

Brian_K_White 3y ago
If we're supplying context, then it seems funny to omit the context that, * it's a journalling app the user did not seek out and choose to install, * was not brought to their attention that it was installed, * with a data-broadcasting setting pre-configured to disregard the users explicitly indicated intentions via the OS lockdown mode setting. The fact that it's a journalling app seems not to matter at all as far as I can see. The remarkable issue was never that a journalling app wants to record your life.

anotherhue 3y ago

Seems it also turned off 24 hour clock. How trust inducing.

jrmg 3y ago

The article doesn’t actually explain why ‘You Might Want It Off’ beyond: If you don’t want your device to be included in that tally of nearby contacts for others, you can toggle it off. Just remember that leaving it on won’t tell your friends—or Apple—anything about you personally.

andy_xor_andrew 3y ago
> If you don’t want your device to be included in that tally of nearby contacts for others, you can toggle it off. Just remember that leaving it on won’t tell your friends—or Apple—anything about you personally. That sentence seems like a self-contradiction? If it didn't tell my friends--or Apple--anything about me, how can it result in my friends getting journaling suggestions that are different based on whether the feature is enabled or not? Unless the author thinks "knowing who you were with and when" does not count as "knowing anything about you," which I would strongly disagree with, and I'm not even generally a paranoid person like some on HN are (no offense to them, glad they're paying attention)
- shuckles 3y ago
  You can know how many of your friends are nearby without knowing who they are.
  - chatmasta 3y ago
    The text beneath the toggle is "Allows others to detect you are nearby to help prioritize their suggestions." This implies it's broadcasting some beacons containing my phone number to nearby devices, which can listen for those beacons and compare them with their contacts list.
    - shuckles 3y ago
      Yeah, appears that way: https://www.apple.com/legal/privacy/data/en/journaling-suggestions/ https://www.apple.com/legal/privacy/data/en/journaling-sugge.... The caveat is that devices store counts not identities, but it does seem like some notion of identity is broadcasted.

HumblyTossed 3y ago

Doesn’t Microsoft get slammed for this crap every other month here? I’m eager to see how this goes over with the Apple loyalists. At any rate, this should never happen. This is not good at all.

c420 3y ago
It's flagged and buried; there's your answer.

alphabettsy 3y ago

This works similar to Covid contact tracing except limited to known contacts. Seems harmless, though it shouldn’t be on by default.

slowmovintarget 3y ago

Journaling is something I do with a fountain pen and suitable notebook. It's in large part about the sitting down, deliberately taking time to move the nib across the page, seeing the ink go on wet. Why would I want a phone app to log my life as an afterthought?

fortran77 3y ago

[flagged]