4 ms·

I think Glassdoor has the issue in that its not a growth business, but needs to be. You can't have a website like Glassdoor that is VC funded, owned by PE or pu

I think Glassdoor has the issue in that its not a growth business, but needs to be. You can't have a website like Glassdoor that is VC funded, owned by PE or publicly traded and not have it go to shit. The organic usage is people looking for new jobs, or posting about jobs they hate, or companies responding. A website that has <20 employees and is fine with being a $10M a year business living off of ad revenue could absolutely do this and be successful. A business seeking to double revenue can't.

tadfisher 3y ago
This is the essential problem with any platform whose value consists of user-generated content. For example, Reddit doesn't have to hold an IPO to continue being Reddit, they don't have to paywall their API, and they don't have to make their website a global dark pattern to force engagement; they chose to sell stakes and play the growth game. Medium is another example, as is Quora, LinkedIn, and a hundred other tech companies that are essentially specialized takes on PhpBB forums.
- rurp 3y ago
  Yep, it's so disappointing how many web projects provide solid value for many people, have a reasonable business model, but go to absolute shit and eventually fade to nothing chasing unsustainable returns. It's staggering how much better the web could be if the demand for exponential returns hadn't become so dominant on the business side.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
duxup 3y ago
It does sometimes feel like we're missing out on these "reasonable company with reasonable expectations" type businesses and funding and crashing a ton of companies that would otherwise maybe live on reasonably?
- ecshafer 3y ago
  What is the line from The Social Network? "Its not cool to be a millionaire, its cool to be a billionaire" or something along those lines. I think a lot of people aren't happy with being just very wealthy I suppose.
  - supportengineer 3y ago
    There's even a stigma to being a "single digit millionaire"
    - the_sleaze9 3y ago
      Greg: I'm good, anyway, cuz, uh, my, so, I was just talkin' to my mom, and she said, apparently, he'll leave me five million anyway, so I'm golden, baby. Connor: You can't do anything with five, Greg. Five's a nightmare. Greg: Is it? Connor: Oh, yeah. Can't retire. Not worth it to work. Oh, yes, five will drive you un poco loco, my fine feathered friend. Tom: The poorest rich person in America. The world's tallest dwarf. Connor: The weakest strong man at the circus. -- Succession
      - Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
        Can't retire on $5M? At a 5%/year withdrawal rate, that's $250K/year. That's absolutely livable. You won't live like a king, but that's a solid middle-class living in most suburbs outside the Bay area.
  - aftbit 3y ago
    I dunno, I think it's pretty cool to be either a millionaire or a billionaire. That's probably why I'm not either.
  - tivert 3y ago
    > What is the line from The Social Network? "Its not cool to be a millionaire, its cool to be a billionaire" or something along those lines. I think a lot of people aren't happy with being just very wealthy I suppose. I think the founders of those companies would be fine with the millionaire outcome, as it beats crashing and burning in pursuit of billions. The problem is the VC mindset.
Uehreka 3y ago
Yeah, and the problem is that if you try to start a bootstrapped company to compete with Glassdoor without ever taking funding, you’ll be outspent on marketing by the companies that did take funding and you’ll go under. There’s a reason so many of these sites are VC funded even when it feels like they shouldn’t be. And VCs are often willing to fund things with a 1% chance of success, so even if multiple VC-backed companies in a market have failed, it won’t dissuade them from investing.
- Solvency 3y ago
  Why is it impossible for communities to emerge organically in 2024? Why must you raise and spend $20m on marketing alone? I found Reddit literally through organic word-of-mouth when Digg went under. Never saw an ad for it in my life. Why does a Glassdoor alternative inherently need marketing?
  - johnnyanmac 3y ago
    >Why is it impossible for communities to emerge organically in 2024? levels and blind sort of feels that way, but that's part of the issue: 1. these kinds of sites are a paradox in that you want employees to be anonymous but also verified. So you can't just spin up a site in a week and have valuable data 2. despite the comparisons, I'm sure both levels and blind were in fact vc funded. The models feels indie but it probably isn't. But they did their part for SEO and marketing and yadda yadda. So it got the eyeballs it needed before word of mouth set in >Why does a Glassdoor alternative inherently need marketing? to be frank, because most people don't try very hard to find the grassroots. They are lazy and will take the first thing that looks good on Google.
  - cchance 3y ago
    The thing is you did find reddit via marketing, its just the marketing hit the people before it hit you, that guy that told you about it or the one that told him was the one that marketing got into reddit, which got them to a critical mass that word of mouth can take over.
    - 3y ago
karaterobot 3y ago
Fully agree with that. But you've just stated one of the major problems the software industry has in general. There's almost an inevitable flow that leads businesses that feed on VC funding to develop like this. They will turn shitty because they are as big as they should get, but not as big as they must get.
FredPret 3y ago
Like a web mittelstand [0] [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mittelstand https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mittelstand

tadfisher 3y ago

This is the essential problem with any platform whose value consists of user-generated content. For example, Reddit doesn't have to hold an IPO to continue being Reddit, they don't have to paywall their API, and they don't have to make their website a global dark pattern to force engagement; they chose to sell stakes and play the growth game. Medium is another example, as is Quora, LinkedIn, and a hundred other tech companies that are essentially specialized takes on PhpBB forums.

rurp 3y ago
Yep, it's so disappointing how many web projects provide solid value for many people, have a reasonable business model, but go to absolute shit and eventually fade to nothing chasing unsustainable returns. It's staggering how much better the web could be if the demand for exponential returns hadn't become so dominant on the business side.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]

duxup 3y ago

It does sometimes feel like we're missing out on these "reasonable company with reasonable expectations" type businesses and funding and crashing a ton of companies that would otherwise maybe live on reasonably?

ecshafer 3y ago
What is the line from The Social Network? "Its not cool to be a millionaire, its cool to be a billionaire" or something along those lines. I think a lot of people aren't happy with being just very wealthy I suppose.
- supportengineer 3y ago
  There's even a stigma to being a "single digit millionaire"
  - the_sleaze9 3y ago
    Greg: I'm good, anyway, cuz, uh, my, so, I was just talkin' to my mom, and she said, apparently, he'll leave me five million anyway, so I'm golden, baby. Connor: You can't do anything with five, Greg. Five's a nightmare. Greg: Is it? Connor: Oh, yeah. Can't retire. Not worth it to work. Oh, yes, five will drive you un poco loco, my fine feathered friend. Tom: The poorest rich person in America. The world's tallest dwarf. Connor: The weakest strong man at the circus. -- Succession
    - Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
      Can't retire on $5M? At a 5%/year withdrawal rate, that's $250K/year. That's absolutely livable. You won't live like a king, but that's a solid middle-class living in most suburbs outside the Bay area.
- aftbit 3y ago
  I dunno, I think it's pretty cool to be either a millionaire or a billionaire. That's probably why I'm not either.
- tivert 3y ago
  > What is the line from The Social Network? "Its not cool to be a millionaire, its cool to be a billionaire" or something along those lines. I think a lot of people aren't happy with being just very wealthy I suppose. I think the founders of those companies would be fine with the millionaire outcome, as it beats crashing and burning in pursuit of billions. The problem is the VC mindset.

Uehreka 3y ago

Yeah, and the problem is that if you try to start a bootstrapped company to compete with Glassdoor without ever taking funding, you’ll be outspent on marketing by the companies that did take funding and you’ll go under. There’s a reason so many of these sites are VC funded even when it feels like they shouldn’t be. And VCs are often willing to fund things with a 1% chance of success, so even if multiple VC-backed companies in a market have failed, it won’t dissuade them from investing.

Solvency 3y ago
Why is it impossible for communities to emerge organically in 2024? Why must you raise and spend $20m on marketing alone? I found Reddit literally through organic word-of-mouth when Digg went under. Never saw an ad for it in my life. Why does a Glassdoor alternative inherently need marketing?
- johnnyanmac 3y ago
  >Why is it impossible for communities to emerge organically in 2024? levels and blind sort of feels that way, but that's part of the issue: 1. these kinds of sites are a paradox in that you want employees to be anonymous but also verified. So you can't just spin up a site in a week and have valuable data 2. despite the comparisons, I'm sure both levels and blind were in fact vc funded. The models feels indie but it probably isn't. But they did their part for SEO and marketing and yadda yadda. So it got the eyeballs it needed before word of mouth set in >Why does a Glassdoor alternative inherently need marketing? to be frank, because most people don't try very hard to find the grassroots. They are lazy and will take the first thing that looks good on Google.
- cchance 3y ago
  The thing is you did find reddit via marketing, its just the marketing hit the people before it hit you, that guy that told you about it or the one that told him was the one that marketing got into reddit, which got them to a critical mass that word of mouth can take over.
  - 3y ago

karaterobot 3y ago

Fully agree with that. But you've just stated one of the major problems the software industry has in general. There's almost an inevitable flow that leads businesses that feed on VC funding to develop like this. They will turn shitty because they are as big as they should get, but not as big as they must get.

FredPret 3y ago

Like a web mittelstand [0] [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mittelstand https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mittelstand