5 ms·

This site makes no sense to me. I looked up "plain hummus" and it has a score of 70? https://www.truefood.tech/product/wf_cedars-mediterranean-foods-cedars-ori

This site makes no sense to me. I looked up "plain hummus" and it has a score of 70? https://www.truefood.tech/product/wf_cedars-mediterranean-foods-cedars-original-hummus-8-oz-b00032e15u?store=all https://www.truefood.tech/product/wf_cedars-mediterranean-fo... But the ingredient list shows almost zero additives. The same goes for a lot of other hummuses, but then some of them have a score of 1 despite having ingredient lists that are not discernably different. https://www.truefood.tech/product/wf_just-hummus-original-hummus-75-oz-b089x1wfph?store=all https://www.truefood.tech/product/wf_just-hummus-original-hu... Idk. Maybe I'm missing something here. The website goes on to say: > In this example the Organic Plain Yogurt is at the 4th percentile among all yogurts, meaning if we have 100 different yogurts on a shelf then 95 of them are more processed than the Organic Plain Yogurt. So, the 70 just means only 30% of all hummus are more processed than this one? But, does that really tell me anything about how processed the hummus is objectively? What if all hummus is extremely highly processed, how would this site indicate that? A 1 could still be highly processed in a category that is generally ultra-processed. :/

walterbell 3y ago
> I looked up "plain hummus" and it has a score of 70? But the ingredient list shows almost zero additives. Almost zero != zero. Your cited hummus with a score of 70 includes the additive "guar gum". Other hummus vendors with a score of 1 do not include that additive, so the simple numerical score succeeds in flagging the product for manual human review. Washington Post (2022) article lists guar gum as an ultra-processed additive, https://archive.is/LG1V1 https://archive.is/LG1V1 Many ultra-processed foods are made in industrial machines that subject grains, corn and other raw ingredients to extremely high pressures and temperatures. This can destroy micronutrients and create new compounds that can be harmful, including carcinogens, said Carlos A. Monteiro, an expert on ultra-processed foods and a professor of nutrition and public health at the School of Public Health at the University of Sao Paulo in Brazil. “These foods contain many chemical compounds that are not nutrients,” he added. Ultra-processed foods often contain an array of additives whose effects on our health we don’t yet fully understand, said Mozaffarian. “It’s not just the salt and sugar, which are the obvious ones, but the artificial sweeteners, artificial colors, emulsifiers, stabilizers, guar gum and xanthan gum,” he said. “We don’t know that they’re innocuous.”
- vel0city 3y ago
  So why should I be so concerned about my hummus having a little bit of guar gum in it?
  - itishappy 3y ago
    It's an ultra-processed chemical with little to no nutritional value that's not listed as an ingredient in hummus recipes or included in competing products. Maybe it's fine! Your personal level of concern may vary, but if it's anything but zero, then surely it's more worthy of concern than hummus without guar gum.
    - vel0city 3y ago
      Ultra processed chemical. It's a bean that's roasted, crushed, and sieved. Coffee is also an ultra processed chemical under your definition. Once again really showing this idea that "ultra processed" seems to carry no real meaning, as once again pretty much any cooked food can be called "ultra processed". Cooking routinely adds things for no nutritional benefit but because it changes the texture or taste to something better. Adding some cinnamon to oatmeal or a red pepper flakes to a pasta sauce isn't going to change the nutritional benefits by any large margin, but I do it because it helps me enjoy the food more. You don't necessarily add egg to cake mix for the nutritional benefit the egg provides you do it so its springier and has a better texture. One might add a little guar gum to hummus to make it thicker and have a slightly different mouth feel which some might prefer. What exactly about guar gum is bad?
      - itishappy 3y ago
        It's not my definition. I doubt coffee counts though. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28322183/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28322183/ Also, I never meant to imply there were conclusive negative effects of guar gum. I don't know! I do know it's an entirely unnecessary ingredient in hummus, so why would you want something that unneeded? Glass beads are probably more inert, but I still wouldn't eat them if I had a choice.
InSteady 3y ago
The hummus with score of 1 has only 28 calories per 100g vs 214 calories per 100g for the "ultra processed." Almost no fat (0.9g) in a food comprised mostly of chickpeas and tahini, both of which are high fat foods. There has to be an error here. Guar gum is definitely an ultra-processed ingredient from what I can tell. It goes through multiple stages of industrial processing, and is used in everything from food products to cosmetics to hydraulic fracking. It is also associated with esophageal and gastro-intestinal swelling, including to the point of causing obstruction. It is high in galactose and mannose, and subtly alters composition of the microbiome. People with GI disorders are very often advised to avoid it (note that although partially hydrolyzed guar gum was previously recommended for IBS to increase motility, in more recent years experts are increasingly saying to avoid it). It is categorized as "generally recognize safe" food additive in the US and EU.
- vel0city 3y ago
  Water is also used in fracking and other industrial processes. If that's the yard stick of if something should be avoided I guess we should stop drinking dihydrogen monoxide.

walterbell 3y ago

> I looked up "plain hummus" and it has a score of 70? But the ingredient list shows almost zero additives. Almost zero != zero. Your cited hummus with a score of 70 includes the additive "guar gum". Other hummus vendors with a score of 1 do not include that additive, so the simple numerical score succeeds in flagging the product for manual human review. Washington Post (2022) article lists guar gum as an ultra-processed additive, https://archive.is/LG1V1 https://archive.is/LG1V1 Many ultra-processed foods are made in industrial machines that subject grains, corn and other raw ingredients to extremely high pressures and temperatures. This can destroy micronutrients and create new compounds that can be harmful, including carcinogens, said Carlos A. Monteiro, an expert on ultra-processed foods and a professor of nutrition and public health at the School of Public Health at the University of Sao Paulo in Brazil. “These foods contain many chemical compounds that are not nutrients,” he added. Ultra-processed foods often contain an array of additives whose effects on our health we don’t yet fully understand, said Mozaffarian. “It’s not just the salt and sugar, which are the obvious ones, but the artificial sweeteners, artificial colors, emulsifiers, stabilizers, guar gum and xanthan gum,” he said. “We don’t know that they’re innocuous.”

vel0city 3y ago
So why should I be so concerned about my hummus having a little bit of guar gum in it?
- itishappy 3y ago
  It's an ultra-processed chemical with little to no nutritional value that's not listed as an ingredient in hummus recipes or included in competing products. Maybe it's fine! Your personal level of concern may vary, but if it's anything but zero, then surely it's more worthy of concern than hummus without guar gum.
  - vel0city 3y ago
    Ultra processed chemical. It's a bean that's roasted, crushed, and sieved. Coffee is also an ultra processed chemical under your definition. Once again really showing this idea that "ultra processed" seems to carry no real meaning, as once again pretty much any cooked food can be called "ultra processed". Cooking routinely adds things for no nutritional benefit but because it changes the texture or taste to something better. Adding some cinnamon to oatmeal or a red pepper flakes to a pasta sauce isn't going to change the nutritional benefits by any large margin, but I do it because it helps me enjoy the food more. You don't necessarily add egg to cake mix for the nutritional benefit the egg provides you do it so its springier and has a better texture. One might add a little guar gum to hummus to make it thicker and have a slightly different mouth feel which some might prefer. What exactly about guar gum is bad?
    - itishappy 3y ago
      It's not my definition. I doubt coffee counts though. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28322183/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28322183/ Also, I never meant to imply there were conclusive negative effects of guar gum. I don't know! I do know it's an entirely unnecessary ingredient in hummus, so why would you want something that unneeded? Glass beads are probably more inert, but I still wouldn't eat them if I had a choice.

InSteady 3y ago

The hummus with score of 1 has only 28 calories per 100g vs 214 calories per 100g for the "ultra processed." Almost no fat (0.9g) in a food comprised mostly of chickpeas and tahini, both of which are high fat foods. There has to be an error here. Guar gum is definitely an ultra-processed ingredient from what I can tell. It goes through multiple stages of industrial processing, and is used in everything from food products to cosmetics to hydraulic fracking. It is also associated with esophageal and gastro-intestinal swelling, including to the point of causing obstruction. It is high in galactose and mannose, and subtly alters composition of the microbiome. People with GI disorders are very often advised to avoid it (note that although partially hydrolyzed guar gum was previously recommended for IBS to increase motility, in more recent years experts are increasingly saying to avoid it). It is categorized as "generally recognize safe" food additive in the US and EU.

vel0city 3y ago
Water is also used in fracking and other industrial processes. If that's the yard stick of if something should be avoided I guess we should stop drinking dihydrogen monoxide.