6 ms·
Serious question: Can we presume he knew he was doing something wrong?
by krona 3y ago
Serious question: Can we presume he knew he was doing something wrong?
- blondie9x 3y agoOf course he did. How could he not know taken documents and giving to a competing company wasn’t a violation? Need more locks on this kind of stuff. Should all uploads and content transmissions out of network require an approval by default? Difficult to say it but it needs to be considered
- imchillyb 3y ago> Should all uploads and content transmissions be locked for employees with foreign ties to an adversarial country? Profiling works. Profiling is abhorrent to most people in 1st world countries, but it works exceedingly well. If the hire is from an adversarial country, they should not only be locked but on a watch list. Our 3 letter organizations should be proactive toward information security. We're in the Information Age now. It's time our society treated that information like the gold it is.
- a_gnostic 3y ago[flagged]
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago> Like the Muslim-ban? No, like the way it wouldn’t be possible for an American national—whether of Chinese descent or not—to get a job at a Chinese missile research laboratory.
- nonethewiser 3y ago"Muslim-ban" is not accurate because it did not ban on the basis of being Muslim or not. It was a ban on travel to the US for 90 days from Iran, Iraq, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, and Yemen. There are many predominately Muslim countries it didn't include and it was specifically about travel from those countries.
- TheCoelacanth 3y ago"Muslim ban" is what the person who initiated it called it, not a description of the actual effects.
- mikeyouse 3y agoRight - he repeatedly said he wanted a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the country and then directed his legal staff to find a legal way to do so… pointing at the hamfisted EO that attempted to toe the line of the clearly unconstitutional order to excuse it is pretty obviously bad faith.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- lupire 3y agoIt's a lot more nuanced than that. Racial profiling only works if it's impossible for an adversary to recruit a member who doesn't match the profile. $ says that won't happen. Information security meanwhile, doesn't need profiling because it applies to everyone.
- jlawson 3y agoNonsense. It works if it's more difficult for the adversary to recruit a member who doesn't match the profile. It doesn't need to be "impossible". Of course it doesn't work perfectly, but no security is ever perfect.
- miohtama 3y agoAfter exfiltrating the data, he was offered a job in Chinese AI startup. Whether or not a real startup, or just s Communist party / military company is an interesting question.
- justaman 3y agoEventually tech leaders will stop hiring Chinese nationals. This keeps happening again and again.
- edgyquant 3y agoThey should already be at that point. I’m surprised it isn’t a violation of sanctions or something to have them working on cutting edge tech.
- xienze 3y agoNo they won’t, they’ll get hit with the dreaded “racist hiring practices” accusations. China knows this, and they exploit it. If tomorrow Google announced a ban on hiring any Russian nationals the HN comments and the media would by and large applaud such a move, by contrast.
- a_gnostic 3y agoAll Chinese startups are Communist Party companies, success dictates just *how* tied-in they are.
- lucidrains 3y agoexactly, this guy understands how business in China works.
- ClumsyPilot 3y agoHow do you imagine this works, western government can’t manage potholes but CCP beurocrats can manage AI, Car production and solar panel production and beat our companies? Are they superhuman?
- ArunRaja 3y agoHe was supposedly moonlighting as well.
- monktastic1 3y agoDo you mean morally or legally? It's hard to imagine a Google engineer not knowing that sharing trade secrets is something their employer would seriously frown upon, no?
- jojobas 3y agoIs your allegiance to your employer above your allegiance to your country?
- monktastic1 3y agoI'm not sure why you're asking me that. I made it clear from my comment that there's a distinction between legal and moral "wrong," and I described the unlikelihood that he didn't know it was the former. That's all.
- jojobas 3y agoWhat's legal is not constant in space and time. I bet the only thing he thought he didn't do right is not get out of the US in time. Then it would have been both legal and moral for him.
- monktastic1 3y agoIf he felt that he had to "get out in time," then he knew he did something "wrong" in the sense that my parent is (presumably) asking about. That's the only question I'm answering. You seem intent on drawing me into a debate about subtleties of moral and legal ethics, but I'm sorry to say I'm not interested right now.
- fkyoureadthedoc 3y agoAnd yet you're the one who brought it up
- 3y ago
- 1234letshaveatw 3y agothat's irrelevant- Snowden thought what he was doing was right
- pid-1 3y agoI've had an intern uploading code to his G Drive and after talking to him I concluded he was not malicious, just dumb. That said you can't claim innocence for not knowing some law, plus any half serious company makes you sign cyber security / IP stuff during the hiring process (ofc one is entitled to sign contracts without reading them).
- ClumsyPilot 3y agoMany crimes require malicious intent, that exactly how most executives never spend time in jail - it’s hard to prove that Boeing executives where hiding the plane’s defects on purpose.
- phillipcarter 3y agoYes? And also it doesn't matter? Ignorance of the law doesn't mean you get a free pass. And by day 1 at any company you've already had to sign stuff saying you won't steal trade secrets (in addition to loads of other things).
- jojobas 3y agoA Chinese national helping his country not fall behind in what's perceived as an existential race? Wrong?
- powerapple 3y agoA Chinese national is trying to make big bucks with stealing technology maybe...
- jojobas 3y agoThe Motherland rewards it's loyal servants, what of it?
- powerapple 3y agoIt is capitalism actually. There are a lot money is looking for opportunities, and the hype generated from the US has a ripple effect on the global market. China has a big venture capital market, and domestic money is looking for these opportunities and quick bucks (maybe quick RMB). Started from social media, then e-commerce, a few years ago autonomous driving and now AI. There will be people taking risks with so much money on the table.
- seneca 3y agoYes, from his perspective it's likely morally right, but he was very likely aware it is illegal in the US. This nicely highlights a difficulty with globalism.