5 ms·

To be fair, there is one element missing from history, 90% market share in tablets. Microsoft doesn't have a monopoly position on tablets which is essentially w

by fleitz 14y ago

To be fair, there is one element missing from history, 90% market share in tablets. Microsoft doesn't have a monopoly position on tablets which is essentially what Windows on ARM means. It's interesting to note that on iOS there's no way to really replace Safari. Any links still open in Safari, no matter what else you've installed. Of course Apple does have a monopoly position on tablets. I'm not trying to say that there shouldn't be browser choice, just that danger is more Apple than Microsoft at this point. If Microsoft changed their policy today it would benefit almost no one, but if Apple changed their policy today it would benefit millions.

diminish 14y ago
Long time firefox user,and critic of Microsoft practices I agree with fleitz. Apple's extremely closed ecosystem unfortunately worked against openness and choice in all aspects. Now that Apple is ruling the tablets, and most of the profits of smartphones, they must be targeted by Mozilla too to allow them to use the Firefox renderer.
- ekianjo 14y ago
  What Power has Firefox over Apple, though ? Once the public has no issue with using locked-up devices, there is not much you can do to leverage the benefits of openness.
  - diminish 14y ago
    I agree, ff doesn't have much power, but we users have the power to help, and it was shown again and again how users may affect policies even government policies.
revorad 14y ago
It hurts and annoys me to no end that web developers don't take a stronger stand against Apple for its ridiculous policies against allowing browsers. To me, the browser is the single most important piece of software on any computer. People love to talk about how iOS native apps totally win over web apps. But do they stop to think why that is the case? Because, the one native app - a better browser - that could change the situation is not allowed on iOS. Firefox and Chrome pushed the boundaries a lot when they first appeared on the desktop scene. But now they've become too caught up in standards compliance to actually do radically innovative things (except B2G, I'll admit). I'm betting on a new kickass browser on Android to either force Apple and Microsoft to open up, or make them irrelevant.
- DrJokepu 14y ago
  But browsers are are allowed in the App Store. Indeed, you can download Opera for the iPhone or the iPad from the App Store for free. There used to be a ban on apps in the App Store that share the functionality of the inbuilt apps but this hasn't been the case for quite a while now.
  - rys 14y ago
    However you can't supplant Safari as the default app you, and as such the app in which other apps without any knowledge of the rest of the system, can send links to. Granted it's possible with custom URL schemes, but that means apps wishing to open URLs in external browsers need to know about those external browsers up front. You can't ask the system for a list of apps that handle URLs, and choose one.
    - pooriaazimi 14y ago
      You are aware that Mobile Safari (on iPad, I mean) is possibly the best mobile browser by far? All other browsers (I've tried tons) are much much worse. I'm not saying I like how my iPad doesn't provide a way to change default browser or email client (I'd use Sparrow on my iPhone if that was the case). I think it's a huge downside. I'm just saying that at least in the case of Mobile Safari, the un-changeable default is much much better than the alternatives and no harm has been done yet. I really wish they change this policy in iOS 6, though.
      - sebbi 14y ago
        Aren't "all other browsers" on Ipads just apps that use a webview e.g. just a wrapper for Safari? Except Opera maybe.
      - sirclueless 14y ago
        You realize that none of the alternatives are processing JavaScript? Of course the browser that runs JavaScript natively on the device is significantly better than all the gimpy alternatives, that's no surprise.
Nelson69 14y ago
There is choice though, Opera and Dolphin both work on iPad and iPhone. Not as tightly integrated, I'll give that, but they are there. There doesn't seem to be the notion of changing the "Default" browser but you certainly can load them up, put them in the doc, etc.

by fleitz 14y ago

diminish 14y ago

Long time firefox user,and critic of Microsoft practices I agree with fleitz. Apple's extremely closed ecosystem unfortunately worked against openness and choice in all aspects. Now that Apple is ruling the tablets, and most of the profits of smartphones, they must be targeted by Mozilla too to allow them to use the Firefox renderer.

ekianjo 14y ago
What Power has Firefox over Apple, though ? Once the public has no issue with using locked-up devices, there is not much you can do to leverage the benefits of openness.
- diminish 14y ago
  I agree, ff doesn't have much power, but we users have the power to help, and it was shown again and again how users may affect policies even government policies.

revorad 14y ago

It hurts and annoys me to no end that web developers don't take a stronger stand against Apple for its ridiculous policies against allowing browsers. To me, the browser is the single most important piece of software on any computer. People love to talk about how iOS native apps totally win over web apps. But do they stop to think why that is the case? Because, the one native app - a better browser - that could change the situation is not allowed on iOS. Firefox and Chrome pushed the boundaries a lot when they first appeared on the desktop scene. But now they've become too caught up in standards compliance to actually do radically innovative things (except B2G, I'll admit). I'm betting on a new kickass browser on Android to either force Apple and Microsoft to open up, or make them irrelevant.

DrJokepu 14y ago
But browsers are are allowed in the App Store. Indeed, you can download Opera for the iPhone or the iPad from the App Store for free. There used to be a ban on apps in the App Store that share the functionality of the inbuilt apps but this hasn't been the case for quite a while now.
- rys 14y ago
  However you can't supplant Safari as the default app you, and as such the app in which other apps without any knowledge of the rest of the system, can send links to. Granted it's possible with custom URL schemes, but that means apps wishing to open URLs in external browsers need to know about those external browsers up front. You can't ask the system for a list of apps that handle URLs, and choose one.
  - pooriaazimi 14y ago
    You are aware that Mobile Safari (on iPad, I mean) is possibly the best mobile browser by far? All other browsers (I've tried tons) are much much worse. I'm not saying I like how my iPad doesn't provide a way to change default browser or email client (I'd use Sparrow on my iPhone if that was the case). I think it's a huge downside. I'm just saying that at least in the case of Mobile Safari, the un-changeable default is much much better than the alternatives and no harm has been done yet. I really wish they change this policy in iOS 6, though.
    - sebbi 14y ago
      Aren't "all other browsers" on Ipads just apps that use a webview e.g. just a wrapper for Safari? Except Opera maybe.
    - sirclueless 14y ago
      You realize that none of the alternatives are processing JavaScript? Of course the browser that runs JavaScript natively on the device is significantly better than all the gimpy alternatives, that's no surprise.

Nelson69 14y ago

There is choice though, Opera and Dolphin both work on iPad and iPhone. Not as tightly integrated, I'll give that, but they are there. There doesn't seem to be the notion of changing the "Default" browser but you certainly can load them up, put them in the doc, etc.