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These prices seem very consistent with BMW's pricing practices in general for all its vehicles. They get very cheap secondhand around the 6 year / 100000km mark

These prices seem very consistent with BMW's pricing practices in general for all its vehicles. They get very cheap secondhand around the 6 year / 100000km mark in my country, as that's when bits start breaking and you may as well just buy a new one.

consumer451 3y ago
Used German automobiles are weapons of economic mass destruction. I say this only half jokingly.
- htatche 3y ago
  Crazy to think there was a time where they used to represent the complete opposite.
- EdwardDiego 3y ago
  The urban folk knowledge I was told is that a) Germans love leasing cars, not buying them and b) if you salt the roads in winter, cars will rust sooner rather than later, and that's only something you can delay, not prevent. Ergo (so the folk knowledge goes), their cars are engineered for a short-term market. Amazingly reliable and fun in the designed for lifetime, after that, it's in God's hands. I have no idea how true that is, but it feels kinda truth adjacent, from my compassionate listening to owners of secondhand BMWs. Oh, and apparently, there's a bit of a European car part cartel in my country, so spares are even more expensive than they already are. I've never had to deal in urban folklore when owning Toyotas though.
  - zhdc1 3y ago
    Doesn’t track with me. Live in Central Europe. Most of the people we know either own their cars outright or take public transportation. Many companies north of the border (Germany) offer company cars as an incentive, which iirc are leased, but these eventually hit the resale market as one year or CPO vehicles. Most cars also have a fairly long anti-corrosion warranty. That said, reliability issues were more a matter of 1. US style cost cutting (remember Daimler Chrysler?) 2. getting caught by surprise by the horse power wars of the naughts and early teens. Engines and associated parts were rushed to market without proper testing. These issues have largely been reversed. Modern BMWs are almost/as reliable as Japanese manufacturers while MB is starting to close the gap.
    - sokoloff 3y ago
      > remember Daimler Chrysler? Sadly, yes. “In the phrase ‘Daimler-Chrysler’, the Daimler is silent.”
      - zhdc1 3y ago
        It was the opposite, to be honest. Chrysler knew they were toast. They either had to be bought out, mortgage everything for massive capital investment (which is what Ford did), or eventually go under. Meanwhile, Daimler executives wanted a way to get American compensation. A ‘merger’ that would turn them into an ‘American’ company was their preferred option. Of course, the Chrysler executive team was eventually shown the exit, the company was run from Germany, and it turned out that Daimler’s leadership was making a number of other major mistakes (this is around the time when reliability went down hill, and it had nothing to do with Chrysler).
  - imtringued 3y ago
    Since when are corrosion problems still a thing? Unless your car gets it's paint coat damaged in an accident, it's not going to rust at all these days.
    - somehnguy 3y ago
      Corrosion is still a problem anywhere they salt the roads (i.e places it snows). Much less of a problem than in the past, but still an expected thing at a certain vehicle age. Normal driving results in tiny rock chips over enough miles and all it takes is the tiniest chip for the corrosion to take hold. Super common above the rear wheel wells, at least in my area. Under body corrosion is pretty inevitable as well because it isn't painted, and even if it were it still takes a lot of abuse from road debris. Coating can help significantly (Fluid Film, Woolwax, etc) but you can't coat everything 100% so it still happens.
    - 83 3y ago
      Here in Wisconsin the frames usually rust apart and become unsafe to drive well before the drivetrain fails. My last car made it just shy of 200k before the strut mount rusted through the unibody. Now that I coat everything underneath with Woolwax I'm seeing much less rust, but still something you have to stay on top of.
  - jacobgorm 3y ago
    The BMW i3 cannot rust, which I guess is why they stopped making them.

consumer451 3y ago

Used German automobiles are weapons of economic mass destruction. I say this only half jokingly.

htatche 3y ago
Crazy to think there was a time where they used to represent the complete opposite.
EdwardDiego 3y ago
The urban folk knowledge I was told is that a) Germans love leasing cars, not buying them and b) if you salt the roads in winter, cars will rust sooner rather than later, and that's only something you can delay, not prevent. Ergo (so the folk knowledge goes), their cars are engineered for a short-term market. Amazingly reliable and fun in the designed for lifetime, after that, it's in God's hands. I have no idea how true that is, but it feels kinda truth adjacent, from my compassionate listening to owners of secondhand BMWs. Oh, and apparently, there's a bit of a European car part cartel in my country, so spares are even more expensive than they already are. I've never had to deal in urban folklore when owning Toyotas though.
- zhdc1 3y ago
  Doesn’t track with me. Live in Central Europe. Most of the people we know either own their cars outright or take public transportation. Many companies north of the border (Germany) offer company cars as an incentive, which iirc are leased, but these eventually hit the resale market as one year or CPO vehicles. Most cars also have a fairly long anti-corrosion warranty. That said, reliability issues were more a matter of 1. US style cost cutting (remember Daimler Chrysler?) 2. getting caught by surprise by the horse power wars of the naughts and early teens. Engines and associated parts were rushed to market without proper testing. These issues have largely been reversed. Modern BMWs are almost/as reliable as Japanese manufacturers while MB is starting to close the gap.
  - sokoloff 3y ago
    > remember Daimler Chrysler? Sadly, yes. “In the phrase ‘Daimler-Chrysler’, the Daimler is silent.”
    - zhdc1 3y ago
      It was the opposite, to be honest. Chrysler knew they were toast. They either had to be bought out, mortgage everything for massive capital investment (which is what Ford did), or eventually go under. Meanwhile, Daimler executives wanted a way to get American compensation. A ‘merger’ that would turn them into an ‘American’ company was their preferred option. Of course, the Chrysler executive team was eventually shown the exit, the company was run from Germany, and it turned out that Daimler’s leadership was making a number of other major mistakes (this is around the time when reliability went down hill, and it had nothing to do with Chrysler).
- imtringued 3y ago
  Since when are corrosion problems still a thing? Unless your car gets it's paint coat damaged in an accident, it's not going to rust at all these days.
  - somehnguy 3y ago
    Corrosion is still a problem anywhere they salt the roads (i.e places it snows). Much less of a problem than in the past, but still an expected thing at a certain vehicle age. Normal driving results in tiny rock chips over enough miles and all it takes is the tiniest chip for the corrosion to take hold. Super common above the rear wheel wells, at least in my area. Under body corrosion is pretty inevitable as well because it isn't painted, and even if it were it still takes a lot of abuse from road debris. Coating can help significantly (Fluid Film, Woolwax, etc) but you can't coat everything 100% so it still happens.
  - 83 3y ago
    Here in Wisconsin the frames usually rust apart and become unsafe to drive well before the drivetrain fails. My last car made it just shy of 200k before the strut mount rusted through the unibody. Now that I coat everything underneath with Woolwax I'm seeing much less rust, but still something you have to stay on top of.
- jacobgorm 3y ago
  The BMW i3 cannot rust, which I guess is why they stopped making them.