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Kick.com is banned in Greece as of June. It has some betting streams, not sure if someone bets on the platform, but it got banned anyway for illegal gambling. I

Kick.com is banned in Greece as of June. It has some betting streams, not sure if someone bets on the platform, but it got banned anyway for illegal gambling. I don't care personally, just to put it out there. P2P download of files did fall a lot in the last decade, i think a second wave is coming.

jasonwatkinspdx 3y ago
Kick isn't really a streaming site, it's a front started by the Stake bitcoin casino after Twitch changed policy to ban streaming bitcoin slots. Stake had been handing out huge contracts to major streamers to show themselves having fun gambling on Stake, particularly xQc and TrainwreksTV. These streamers would act as if they were betting with their own money, including getting into six figure bets, without being clear they were on a contract that basically made it all upside to them even if they lost millions. The audience for these streamers slants young, and that didn't sit well with Twitch advertisers, hence the change in policy. Train et all didn't want their golden goose to end, so they worked with Stake to create Kick, with Train as one of the cofounders, and xQc and others pulling their audience over. One of Kick's selling points to streamers has been to be a wild west as far as copyright and content goes. They quickly took in all the streamers too toxic for other platforms, including people who'd done things like film themselves committing sexual assaults on Twitch. They've encouraged people to restream copyright content like marvel movies, and even porn. I don't know what the laws are like in Greece, but considering this free for all approach it's not surprising they'd run afowl of regulations somehow. Frankly it's amazing Kick hasn't gotten nailed by some sort of major anti piracy action, but I suppose being based out of the Seychelles complicates that for copyright holders. In any case, the point is Kick is an aberration. It's way too toxic for mainstream advertisers, so the only thing sustaining it financially is Stake paying people to stream gambling on Stake.
- emporas 3y ago
  I didn't know any of that stuff, thanks for sharing. Casinos and betting literally disgust me, but given that in a handful of years, every person on the planet will have his own personal stock and bond market, i wonder how one can differentiate betting from investing. A saying i usually repeat to people, is that in the future, i.e. in a handful of years, everyone will be a billionaire for fifteen minutes.
  - Dylan16807 3y ago
    > every person on the planet will have his own personal stock and bond market I have no idea what you're talking about. > i wonder how one can differentiate betting from investing The biggest clue is how long you're going to hold ownership. If it's years, then it's almost certainly investing. > A saying i usually repeat to people, is that in the future, i.e. in a handful of years, everyone will be a billionaire for fifteen minutes. Wha? Wouldn't most people cash out? Then most people are billionaires permanently? How does this work?
    - emporas 3y ago
      Well, think about it that way: What's the purpose of copyright? It gives ownership of information, to the people who produced it, some years for a song or a movie. The presupposition is that said information, will be valuable in a year or 10 years. Along the same lines what's the purpose of investing? It captures ownership of a company, for some time, or indefinitely. The presupposition is that said company, will be valuable in a year or 10 years. Well as technology advances, everything becomes easier to produce, including movies, songs even car companies. The saying means that everyone will be able to produce something, which will gain big traction for a small amount of time. At that point he will be a billionaire, but someone else will produce something very similar, in fifteen minutes, and his ownership will go to nothing very quickly.
      - Dylan16807 3y ago
        If by "billionaire" you mean "making a hundred dollars a minute" then I think I see what you're saying, but I would word it very differently. If you were even a paper billionaire you could sell a big chunk for something that wouldn't immediately crash. But if everyone knows you're about to crash back down, then that will be priced in to your "stock" and you won't even be a paper millionaire.
        emporas 3y ago
        Yes, i meant it more like: "Unrealized gains billionaire". The phrase is not meant to be absolutely serious of course, but it passes a point across which i think it's important. Not only better and better technology gives us more opportunities to compete with one another, but we become better at competing with one another regardless of technology. The edge one holds in anything such as making movies, making cars or what have you, gets smaller and smaller in duration. The timeline of the first mover advantage to capitalize on any gains gets shorter and shorter. In such a situation, copyrights, patents, IP, end up almost irrelevant.
- internet101010 3y ago
  This is correct. Kick is just a front for bringing lifetime gamblers into Stake. That's only reason they were willing to pay xQc $100M for a two-year non-exclusive contract.

jasonwatkinspdx 3y ago

Kick isn't really a streaming site, it's a front started by the Stake bitcoin casino after Twitch changed policy to ban streaming bitcoin slots. Stake had been handing out huge contracts to major streamers to show themselves having fun gambling on Stake, particularly xQc and TrainwreksTV. These streamers would act as if they were betting with their own money, including getting into six figure bets, without being clear they were on a contract that basically made it all upside to them even if they lost millions. The audience for these streamers slants young, and that didn't sit well with Twitch advertisers, hence the change in policy. Train et all didn't want their golden goose to end, so they worked with Stake to create Kick, with Train as one of the cofounders, and xQc and others pulling their audience over. One of Kick's selling points to streamers has been to be a wild west as far as copyright and content goes. They quickly took in all the streamers too toxic for other platforms, including people who'd done things like film themselves committing sexual assaults on Twitch. They've encouraged people to restream copyright content like marvel movies, and even porn. I don't know what the laws are like in Greece, but considering this free for all approach it's not surprising they'd run afowl of regulations somehow. Frankly it's amazing Kick hasn't gotten nailed by some sort of major anti piracy action, but I suppose being based out of the Seychelles complicates that for copyright holders. In any case, the point is Kick is an aberration. It's way too toxic for mainstream advertisers, so the only thing sustaining it financially is Stake paying people to stream gambling on Stake.

emporas 3y ago
I didn't know any of that stuff, thanks for sharing. Casinos and betting literally disgust me, but given that in a handful of years, every person on the planet will have his own personal stock and bond market, i wonder how one can differentiate betting from investing. A saying i usually repeat to people, is that in the future, i.e. in a handful of years, everyone will be a billionaire for fifteen minutes.
- Dylan16807 3y ago
  > every person on the planet will have his own personal stock and bond market I have no idea what you're talking about. > i wonder how one can differentiate betting from investing The biggest clue is how long you're going to hold ownership. If it's years, then it's almost certainly investing. > A saying i usually repeat to people, is that in the future, i.e. in a handful of years, everyone will be a billionaire for fifteen minutes. Wha? Wouldn't most people cash out? Then most people are billionaires permanently? How does this work?
  - emporas 3y ago
    Well, think about it that way: What's the purpose of copyright? It gives ownership of information, to the people who produced it, some years for a song or a movie. The presupposition is that said information, will be valuable in a year or 10 years. Along the same lines what's the purpose of investing? It captures ownership of a company, for some time, or indefinitely. The presupposition is that said company, will be valuable in a year or 10 years. Well as technology advances, everything becomes easier to produce, including movies, songs even car companies. The saying means that everyone will be able to produce something, which will gain big traction for a small amount of time. At that point he will be a billionaire, but someone else will produce something very similar, in fifteen minutes, and his ownership will go to nothing very quickly.
    - Dylan16807 3y ago
      If by "billionaire" you mean "making a hundred dollars a minute" then I think I see what you're saying, but I would word it very differently. If you were even a paper billionaire you could sell a big chunk for something that wouldn't immediately crash. But if everyone knows you're about to crash back down, then that will be priced in to your "stock" and you won't even be a paper millionaire.
      - emporas 3y ago
        Yes, i meant it more like: "Unrealized gains billionaire". The phrase is not meant to be absolutely serious of course, but it passes a point across which i think it's important. Not only better and better technology gives us more opportunities to compete with one another, but we become better at competing with one another regardless of technology. The edge one holds in anything such as making movies, making cars or what have you, gets smaller and smaller in duration. The timeline of the first mover advantage to capitalize on any gains gets shorter and shorter. In such a situation, copyrights, patents, IP, end up almost irrelevant.
internet101010 3y ago
This is correct. Kick is just a front for bringing lifetime gamblers into Stake. That's only reason they were willing to pay xQc $100M for a two-year non-exclusive contract.