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Writing for the web of today is merely changing one walled garden for another. We don't live in a state of "free and open web" - it's dominated by two ad compan

by isodev 3y ago

Writing for the web of today is merely changing one walled garden for another. We don't live in a state of "free and open web" - it's dominated by two ad companies controlling the browser and social aspects of it. Some would argue that we should keep pumping browsers with native-like APIs to escape the "big bad App Store" while in reality this merely increases the foothold of Big G and their cousin Meta. The issue is not how much Apple cares about developers (they do, because developers make Apple's ecosystem but this is a business relationship, not a friendship). In my view, the root cause is that the "happy path" of creating an app mandates choosing an ecosystem. For everything from tools to where you'd store your data and how you'd send push notifications - you have to choose which one of the MFAANGs you will support or else.

hu3 3y ago
I don't understand this rationale. Web apps can be used by many devices, mobile or desktop, iOS, macOS, iPadOS, Android, Windows, and Linux. If web dominance changes I'm still left with an application that works everywhere. How is that comparable to native applications that only work in the latest versions of a single OS? The only reason web apps didn't dominate yet is because Apple can't force them to pay 30% of their revenue plus $100/year per developer license so Apple goes out of their way to nerf web app functionality. Safari is historically lagging behind in implementing functionality to enable web apps.
- isodev 3y ago
  > If web dominance changes I'm still left with an application that works everywhere. That's the faulty assumption in my view. It doesn't work everywhere - even on the web, you're bound to whatever the dominant browser thinks is right for you. Some random examples from recent months - 3rd party cookies (putting aside the fact that they were enschitified for ads), Google suddenly decides to turn them off and they're gone. Ad blockers don't make it as an extension (so extensions are not, in fact, a solid substitute for apps). See AMP - you don't even get the choice if your website will be transformed into whatever Big G thought was an "optimised experience". What's to stop them from forcing you to enable "privacy-focused topics" or Web Bluetooth to sign into your Gmail account? Let's not even begin to discuss Search - all from your browser company. You see, browsers have become much more than simply web agents. Your app's documents and hypermedia are technically downloadable "everywhere". However, just like on an App Store device, if and how users can discover your web content and how they experience it is entirely locked inside the walled garden of your Chrome-like browser vendor. PS: Since before the browser Interop initiatives (now more than 3 years ago), Safari has been leading the race when it comes to accepted standards.

by isodev 3y ago

hu3 3y ago

I don't understand this rationale. Web apps can be used by many devices, mobile or desktop, iOS, macOS, iPadOS, Android, Windows, and Linux. If web dominance changes I'm still left with an application that works everywhere. How is that comparable to native applications that only work in the latest versions of a single OS? The only reason web apps didn't dominate yet is because Apple can't force them to pay 30% of their revenue plus $100/year per developer license so Apple goes out of their way to nerf web app functionality. Safari is historically lagging behind in implementing functionality to enable web apps.

isodev 3y ago
> If web dominance changes I'm still left with an application that works everywhere. That's the faulty assumption in my view. It doesn't work everywhere - even on the web, you're bound to whatever the dominant browser thinks is right for you. Some random examples from recent months - 3rd party cookies (putting aside the fact that they were enschitified for ads), Google suddenly decides to turn them off and they're gone. Ad blockers don't make it as an extension (so extensions are not, in fact, a solid substitute for apps). See AMP - you don't even get the choice if your website will be transformed into whatever Big G thought was an "optimised experience". What's to stop them from forcing you to enable "privacy-focused topics" or Web Bluetooth to sign into your Gmail account? Let's not even begin to discuss Search - all from your browser company. You see, browsers have become much more than simply web agents. Your app's documents and hypermedia are technically downloadable "everywhere". However, just like on an App Store device, if and how users can discover your web content and how they experience it is entirely locked inside the walled garden of your Chrome-like browser vendor. PS: Since before the browser Interop initiatives (now more than 3 years ago), Safari has been leading the race when it comes to accepted standards.