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A childcare worker has a cap on the number of kids they can competently handle at a single time, both legally and due to very human limits. It's interesting tha

A childcare worker has a cap on the number of kids they can competently handle at a single time, both legally and due to very human limits. It's interesting that we haven't seen that much embrace of new technologies that might raise this limit, increasing the aggregate supply of childcare and hence lowering prices across society, when childcare is so expensive in so many places.

uniqueuid 3y ago
How exactly would you use technology to raise that limit? From my experience, direct 1:1 attention is the single most important thing for children. I would (and am) actively paying for childcare not to use technology to increase that attention.
- Terr_ 3y ago
  One way to look at it is that socializing the children requires a particular amount of raw time from the humans being their interactive role-models. This means prices will tend to rise alongside the wages of those parental figures. I say "socializing" because I want to distinguish it from either imparting academic knowledge or providing for material needs/safety. I think those three categories are very different in terms of how easily--or wisely--they might be handled by automation. For example, a robot that changes diapers and stops your child from falling over cliffs: Awesome. An endlessly patient software tutor for teaching algebra: Cool. An AI that serves as virtual aunt/uncle/best-friend? Uh oh.
  - codr7 3y ago
    Replacing teachers with software doesn't sound like a recipe for success to me. Simply adding distractions like tablets and laptops is already doing plenty of damage.
    - Terr_ 3y ago
      I agree, but that's because (good) teaching is also being a interactive model for those hungry little brains, and are needed when something occurs outside the specialization of the software. The "distractions" are harmful because suddenly kids are getting their world views and expectations from too-ficticious characters or "influencers" with perverse incentives.
- hiAndrewQuinn 3y ago
  If I knew that, I'd be making a lot of money by now. It's good that you have the option and disposable income to pay a premium for a private nanny or however else you're maximizing that direct 1:1 attention, instead of an ordinary daycare. For the rest of us, we mostly need someone to watch the kids while we're at work, and paying that much would probably make it cheaper overall to just watch them ourselves.
  - foobarian 3y ago
    I've been puzzled at the economics of it. If it is cheaper for us to watch just 1 kid, where the heck is the money going in the daycare with N kids? Rent?
    - falseprofit 3y ago
      What do you mean when you say it’s cheaper for you to watch 1 kid? What’s the comparison?
      - foobarian 3y ago
        Comparison is to the wages the caretaker is giving up in order to be at home with the child. Of course there is a spectrum but it is a high bar.
        falseprofit 3y ago
        I don’t think very many people are paying more for daycare than they make while their kids are in it.
        foobarian 3y ago
        Of course, those that make more don't, those that make less are likely to just DIY. And with those who make more, the ratio is still not even close to N, which makes the overhead interesting.
- netsharc 3y ago
  Random brainstorm from a childless man: cameras, cameras everywhere, and some sort of AR tool for the carer, so the kids get tamagochi-esque meters. Beep, camera 4 spotted kid 7 needing interaction. Beep kid 5 is acting cranky, last drink 26 minutes ago, while you're at it refill kid 13's water bottle. Yeah, very dystopian... Bonus if the AR overlay allows eye contact, we don't want the kids staring into the soulless face of an Apple Vision Pro ;)
- seanmcdirmid 3y ago
  This is a huge problem. Childcare is one field where productivity is decreasing due to regulations that keep pushing down child-teacher ratios. They are basically told that they can only grow more expensive (since productivity can’t increase while labor keeps becoming more valuable) as time goes on. Pretty soon only the rich will be able to afford it (and that’s already true in many regions).
  - antanitis 3y ago
    [flagged]
loeg 3y ago
The primary way technology can help reduce the cost of childcare is by providing a good billing solution for rock bottom cost, not by replacing teachers.
- seanmcdirmid 3y ago
  It’s impossible. 80% of their costs is already for teachers, 10% for insurance and 10% for rent. There is literally no way to push costs down, especially since labor costs will continue to increase. If productivity can’t be increased at all, the whole industry is basically doomed by math.
  - loeg 3y ago
    I'd encourage you to listen to this podcast or read the transcript. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39246681 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39246681
tivert 3y ago
> It's interesting that we haven't seen that much embrace of new technologies that might raise this limit, increasing the aggregate supply of childcare and hence lowering prices across society Controlled access pens with an iPad in them? /s

uniqueuid 3y ago

How exactly would you use technology to raise that limit? From my experience, direct 1:1 attention is the single most important thing for children. I would (and am) actively paying for childcare not to use technology to increase that attention.

Terr_ 3y ago
One way to look at it is that socializing the children requires a particular amount of raw time from the humans being their interactive role-models. This means prices will tend to rise alongside the wages of those parental figures. I say "socializing" because I want to distinguish it from either imparting academic knowledge or providing for material needs/safety. I think those three categories are very different in terms of how easily--or wisely--they might be handled by automation. For example, a robot that changes diapers and stops your child from falling over cliffs: Awesome. An endlessly patient software tutor for teaching algebra: Cool. An AI that serves as virtual aunt/uncle/best-friend? Uh oh.
- codr7 3y ago
  Replacing teachers with software doesn't sound like a recipe for success to me. Simply adding distractions like tablets and laptops is already doing plenty of damage.
  - Terr_ 3y ago
    I agree, but that's because (good) teaching is also being a interactive model for those hungry little brains, and are needed when something occurs outside the specialization of the software. The "distractions" are harmful because suddenly kids are getting their world views and expectations from too-ficticious characters or "influencers" with perverse incentives.
hiAndrewQuinn 3y ago
If I knew that, I'd be making a lot of money by now. It's good that you have the option and disposable income to pay a premium for a private nanny or however else you're maximizing that direct 1:1 attention, instead of an ordinary daycare. For the rest of us, we mostly need someone to watch the kids while we're at work, and paying that much would probably make it cheaper overall to just watch them ourselves.
- foobarian 3y ago
  I've been puzzled at the economics of it. If it is cheaper for us to watch just 1 kid, where the heck is the money going in the daycare with N kids? Rent?
  - falseprofit 3y ago
    What do you mean when you say it’s cheaper for you to watch 1 kid? What’s the comparison?
    - foobarian 3y ago
      Comparison is to the wages the caretaker is giving up in order to be at home with the child. Of course there is a spectrum but it is a high bar.
      - falseprofit 3y ago
        I don’t think very many people are paying more for daycare than they make while their kids are in it.
        foobarian 3y ago
        Of course, those that make more don't, those that make less are likely to just DIY. And with those who make more, the ratio is still not even close to N, which makes the overhead interesting.
netsharc 3y ago
Random brainstorm from a childless man: cameras, cameras everywhere, and some sort of AR tool for the carer, so the kids get tamagochi-esque meters. Beep, camera 4 spotted kid 7 needing interaction. Beep kid 5 is acting cranky, last drink 26 minutes ago, while you're at it refill kid 13's water bottle. Yeah, very dystopian... Bonus if the AR overlay allows eye contact, we don't want the kids staring into the soulless face of an Apple Vision Pro ;)
seanmcdirmid 3y ago
This is a huge problem. Childcare is one field where productivity is decreasing due to regulations that keep pushing down child-teacher ratios. They are basically told that they can only grow more expensive (since productivity can’t increase while labor keeps becoming more valuable) as time goes on. Pretty soon only the rich will be able to afford it (and that’s already true in many regions).
- antanitis 3y ago
  [flagged]

loeg 3y ago

The primary way technology can help reduce the cost of childcare is by providing a good billing solution for rock bottom cost, not by replacing teachers.

seanmcdirmid 3y ago
It’s impossible. 80% of their costs is already for teachers, 10% for insurance and 10% for rent. There is literally no way to push costs down, especially since labor costs will continue to increase. If productivity can’t be increased at all, the whole industry is basically doomed by math.
- loeg 3y ago
  I'd encourage you to listen to this podcast or read the transcript. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39246681 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39246681

tivert 3y ago

> It's interesting that we haven't seen that much embrace of new technologies that might raise this limit, increasing the aggregate supply of childcare and hence lowering prices across society Controlled access pens with an iPad in them? /s