5 ms·

Creating I-5 was really contentious at the time. It destroyed neighborhoods. My family has lived in the area for several generations and my parents can attest t

Creating I-5 was really contentious at the time. It destroyed neighborhoods. My family has lived in the area for several generations and my parents can attest to this. Lidding it would be great, but removing it would be better. There are loads of people who live in the suburbs north and south of Seattle and expect to be able to drive 20-30 miles each way day-in-day-out to commute. If the city continues to grow, this simply isn't tenable in the long run, because you can't grow highway capacity forever; they would no longer be able to do this, which would be good. Just rip the band-aid off.

seanmcdirmid 3y ago
The only thing worse than having I5 is not having I5. There really isn't enough north-south corridors to replace it (15th, 99, east/west lake...really that's it), given that I5 is close to the water and a huge hill as it comes in across from UW. It is already non-viable to expect a 20-30 minute commute into the city. We saw what happened when the Palestine supporters blocked off I5 a few weeks ago...on a weekend without a rush hour, people were stuck in traffic for hours.
- uoaei 3y ago
  Can you articulate a cogent reason why people need to cross the city on such a thoroughfare just to live their lives?
  - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
    You are located in the north of the city and need to get somewhere south of the city, or vice versa. You only have a few roads to do that east or west of Lake Washington. In most cases, people aren't going to downtown Seattle, downtown Seattle is just in the way.
    - uoaei 3y ago
      Why are those services not available in the north of the city? This is as much a planning issue as traffic is.
      - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
        I think it has to do with the way the city grew out north and south, with the city itself as a chokepoint (since it is surrounded by water otherwise). Common reasons people need to go from north seattle to south seattle: IKEA, Southcenter, Seatac. I'm sure there are reasons for people to go north as well, but I have a harder time thinking of them (other than that they went south and now have to come back north).
        com2kid 3y ago
        There is some really great African food up north just outside the city. :-D Likewise along the northern parts of Aurora you can get some really great Korean food. (Also not strictly in the city limits). Parks, lots of parks. The only decent real "spas" I've found are all up north (Again, Shoreline, just outside of the city) Ballard and Fremont are both big draws. UW, kind of a biggie.
        seanmcdirmid 3y ago
        Federal Way has good Korean food also (well, along with lots of Koreans). Frankly, you'll find Asian communities south, east and north, with the high end in the east, the middle end in the north, and lots of value in the south. Schools are better in the north, which is why we chose Ballard rather than Beacon Hill. The reason I don't think about North Seattle so much is because I live here, I guess (and getting places isn't so hard if I'm not crossing Seattle).
        sfpotter 3y ago
        It sounds like you are already set up for I-5 getting obliterated. If you only go to the south end for Ikea, Southcenter, and Seatac, how often do you really need to do those things? It's not like it becomes impossible to drive there, it just takes a little longer. Frankly, traffic in Seattle just isn't that bad compared to other major cities. I just checked the traffic from Ballard to Ikea, and it's 45 minutes on 99... I-5 isn't even the ideal route right now. Of course I'm playing devil's advocate a little bit here, but you also have to weigh this against just how much additional real estate would come available if I-5 was gone. I don't think people's need for driving convenience actually stacks up that strongly against all the other positive considerations.
  - mitthrowaway2 3y ago
    Because nobody knows how to build a train, it's a mystery.
- sfpotter 3y ago
  There are no major highways through Manhattan. The city is better for it. Drive around the lake if you need to get past the city.
  - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
    I used to commute from westchester county into midtown, and there were definitely parkways in, although I never needed to go all the way down to Manhattan itself. I would usually try to take the train though (often not possible given how westchester county is poorly connected to train stations).
  - aidenn0 3y ago
    How do you get from the GW bridge to the Cross-Bronx Expressway if there are no major highways through Manhattan?
    - mathgeek 3y ago
      278 also runs through Manhattan. I assume the previous poster really means something that excludes Randalls Island and the Heights.
  - Tagbert 3y ago
    Because 405 is already a a crowded route that becomes bogged down during rush hour(s). Your choices are pretty much sound, city, lake, city, or mountains if you are looking for a route through Seattle.
- resonantjacket5 3y ago
  It's actually a bit interesting to see WSDOT's plan for i-5. For capacity they aren't expanding I-5 directly, but expanding i-405 and sr167 instead for people trying to go past Seattle. For i-5 within Seattle area, there are some 2030s plans to convert the hov lanes to toll lanes and reconfiguring the reversible express lane system. * I-5 Managed Lanes: SR 16 to Pierce/ King County Line * I-5 Managed Lanes: Pierce/ King County Line to I-405 * I-5 Managed Lanes: I-405 to US 2 https://www.psrc.org/media/4840 https://www.psrc.org/media/4840
  - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
    I don't see that working out. I405 is often worse than I5, it is just as bottlenecked as I5 is, and there isn't much room to expand it especially when it runs right up next to the water. I feel sorry for anyone who has to actually do that commute. It was horrible when I was living in Bothell and attending UW 30 years ago.
    - resonantjacket5 3y ago
      They are constructing it right now the expansion between bellevue to renton. https://wsdot.wa.gov/construction-planning/search-projects/i-405renton-bellevue-widening-and-express-toll-lanes-project https://wsdot.wa.gov/construction-planning/search-projects/i... The bellevue to lynnwood section was already 'expanded' a decade ago though as one can tell, it still has traffic. They're opting to increase the tolls now.
- mc32 3y ago
  I think Boeing threatened to pull out of Seattle if WSDOT did not improve freeways, some years ago -getting stuff in and out of Everett is really important to them. If I-5 was torn down and only left with surface streets, what's left of Boeing would pull out and go to Kansas or some place.

seanmcdirmid 3y ago

The only thing worse than having I5 is not having I5. There really isn't enough north-south corridors to replace it (15th, 99, east/west lake...really that's it), given that I5 is close to the water and a huge hill as it comes in across from UW. It is already non-viable to expect a 20-30 minute commute into the city. We saw what happened when the Palestine supporters blocked off I5 a few weeks ago...on a weekend without a rush hour, people were stuck in traffic for hours.

uoaei 3y ago
Can you articulate a cogent reason why people need to cross the city on such a thoroughfare just to live their lives?
- seanmcdirmid 3y ago
  You are located in the north of the city and need to get somewhere south of the city, or vice versa. You only have a few roads to do that east or west of Lake Washington. In most cases, people aren't going to downtown Seattle, downtown Seattle is just in the way.
  - uoaei 3y ago
    Why are those services not available in the north of the city? This is as much a planning issue as traffic is.
    - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
      I think it has to do with the way the city grew out north and south, with the city itself as a chokepoint (since it is surrounded by water otherwise). Common reasons people need to go from north seattle to south seattle: IKEA, Southcenter, Seatac. I'm sure there are reasons for people to go north as well, but I have a harder time thinking of them (other than that they went south and now have to come back north).
      - com2kid 3y ago
        There is some really great African food up north just outside the city. :-D Likewise along the northern parts of Aurora you can get some really great Korean food. (Also not strictly in the city limits). Parks, lots of parks. The only decent real "spas" I've found are all up north (Again, Shoreline, just outside of the city) Ballard and Fremont are both big draws. UW, kind of a biggie.
        seanmcdirmid 3y ago
        Federal Way has good Korean food also (well, along with lots of Koreans). Frankly, you'll find Asian communities south, east and north, with the high end in the east, the middle end in the north, and lots of value in the south. Schools are better in the north, which is why we chose Ballard rather than Beacon Hill. The reason I don't think about North Seattle so much is because I live here, I guess (and getting places isn't so hard if I'm not crossing Seattle).
        sfpotter 3y ago
        It sounds like you are already set up for I-5 getting obliterated. If you only go to the south end for Ikea, Southcenter, and Seatac, how often do you really need to do those things? It's not like it becomes impossible to drive there, it just takes a little longer. Frankly, traffic in Seattle just isn't that bad compared to other major cities. I just checked the traffic from Ballard to Ikea, and it's 45 minutes on 99... I-5 isn't even the ideal route right now. Of course I'm playing devil's advocate a little bit here, but you also have to weigh this against just how much additional real estate would come available if I-5 was gone. I don't think people's need for driving convenience actually stacks up that strongly against all the other positive considerations.
- mitthrowaway2 3y ago
  Because nobody knows how to build a train, it's a mystery.
sfpotter 3y ago
There are no major highways through Manhattan. The city is better for it. Drive around the lake if you need to get past the city.
- seanmcdirmid 3y ago
  I used to commute from westchester county into midtown, and there were definitely parkways in, although I never needed to go all the way down to Manhattan itself. I would usually try to take the train though (often not possible given how westchester county is poorly connected to train stations).
- aidenn0 3y ago
  How do you get from the GW bridge to the Cross-Bronx Expressway if there are no major highways through Manhattan?
  - mathgeek 3y ago
    278 also runs through Manhattan. I assume the previous poster really means something that excludes Randalls Island and the Heights.
- Tagbert 3y ago
  Because 405 is already a a crowded route that becomes bogged down during rush hour(s). Your choices are pretty much sound, city, lake, city, or mountains if you are looking for a route through Seattle.
resonantjacket5 3y ago
It's actually a bit interesting to see WSDOT's plan for i-5. For capacity they aren't expanding I-5 directly, but expanding i-405 and sr167 instead for people trying to go past Seattle. For i-5 within Seattle area, there are some 2030s plans to convert the hov lanes to toll lanes and reconfiguring the reversible express lane system. * I-5 Managed Lanes: SR 16 to Pierce/ King County Line * I-5 Managed Lanes: Pierce/ King County Line to I-405 * I-5 Managed Lanes: I-405 to US 2 https://www.psrc.org/media/4840 https://www.psrc.org/media/4840
- seanmcdirmid 3y ago
  I don't see that working out. I405 is often worse than I5, it is just as bottlenecked as I5 is, and there isn't much room to expand it especially when it runs right up next to the water. I feel sorry for anyone who has to actually do that commute. It was horrible when I was living in Bothell and attending UW 30 years ago.
  - resonantjacket5 3y ago
    They are constructing it right now the expansion between bellevue to renton. https://wsdot.wa.gov/construction-planning/search-projects/i-405renton-bellevue-widening-and-express-toll-lanes-project https://wsdot.wa.gov/construction-planning/search-projects/i... The bellevue to lynnwood section was already 'expanded' a decade ago though as one can tell, it still has traffic. They're opting to increase the tolls now.
mc32 3y ago
I think Boeing threatened to pull out of Seattle if WSDOT did not improve freeways, some years ago -getting stuff in and out of Everett is really important to them. If I-5 was torn down and only left with surface streets, what's left of Boeing would pull out and go to Kansas or some place.