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Reminds of this PG quote: > If you imagine someone with 100 percent determination and 100 percent intelligence, you can discard a lot of intelligence before th

by nomilk 3y ago

Reminds of this PG quote: > If you imagine someone with 100 percent determination and 100 percent intelligence, you can discard a lot of intelligence before they stop succeeding. But if you start discarding determination, you very quickly get an ineffectual and perpetual grad student. Not the same source, but similar message and very much worth the watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8TwkfxEdJ0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8TwkfxEdJ0

Jensson 3y ago
100 percent determination describes most conspiracy theorists, it isn't a good trait to have that much of. So I'd argue that you need to drop quite a bit of it for the person to even reach average effectiveness, otherwise the person will be stuck trying things that will never work.
- weast 3y ago
  That is a really good point. Determination without direction (or at least a misguided one) produces a lot of wasted energy. i guess the idea here of determination with lack of intelligenxe assumes some sort of intellectually elite group that can steer the determined work to some optimal outcome.
  - Jensson 3y ago
    > i guess the idea here of determination with lack of intelligenxe assumes some sort of intellectually elite group that can steer the determined work to some optimal outcome. I think that idea comes from school where you can do well just by repeating simple patterns, there mindless determination can take you very far. But after school it starts to hurt you if you don't re-evaluate what you do often enough, which is why many who get great grades never achieve much afterwards, they are just too determined on a set path and don't look around enough.
15457345234 3y ago
Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not: nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not: the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. -- Ronald Reagan
- api 3y ago
  This feeds into one of my pet hypotheses about human ability: the most important biological factors determining success lie not in whatever influences IQ or other intelligence or creativity attributes but in the dopamine system. Take 20 IQ points from someone and replace that with the ability to engage focus and flow state at will and see what happens. Our dopamine system is tuned for a world that is far slower than this one and largely unchanging. From the perspective of modernity almost all humans exist in a state of catatonic depression. Few humans are able to sustain the level of focus and activity that would be optimal in today's world. When we do, in short bursts, we see amazing results. Unfortunately drugs like amphetamines have side effects and are addictive. From what I've seen amphetamines and similar focus drugs often lead to a lot of focus and engagement but mis-regulated: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mf3e1F1a0Hg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mf3e1F1a0Hg An AI would not need to be superintelligent to outcompete humans in virtually any endeavor. It would just need to have ordinary human intelligence plus infinite tireless focus. This also implies that a way to boost focus that worked better than amphetamine (and without addiction and other side effects) and similar things would be much more significant for human potential than a way to boost IQ. The other alternative would be to drastically extend life span, allowing us to slow down and be okay with that. The reason we tend to fast forward everything so much is that we don't live very long. The systems of capital and capital allocation that drive society run at a speed that is far in excess of what our dopamine systems are adapted to handle so they can deliver results within an acceptably small fraction of a human life span. Either we are too slow or too short lived. Pick one.
  - 15457345234 3y ago
    Amphetamines are truly an evil drug, they bring out and emphasise the worst qualities of people.

by nomilk 3y ago

Jensson 3y ago

100 percent determination describes most conspiracy theorists, it isn't a good trait to have that much of. So I'd argue that you need to drop quite a bit of it for the person to even reach average effectiveness, otherwise the person will be stuck trying things that will never work.

weast 3y ago
That is a really good point. Determination without direction (or at least a misguided one) produces a lot of wasted energy. i guess the idea here of determination with lack of intelligenxe assumes some sort of intellectually elite group that can steer the determined work to some optimal outcome.
- Jensson 3y ago
  > i guess the idea here of determination with lack of intelligenxe assumes some sort of intellectually elite group that can steer the determined work to some optimal outcome. I think that idea comes from school where you can do well just by repeating simple patterns, there mindless determination can take you very far. But after school it starts to hurt you if you don't re-evaluate what you do often enough, which is why many who get great grades never achieve much afterwards, they are just too determined on a set path and don't look around enough.

15457345234 3y ago

Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not: nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not: the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. -- Ronald Reagan

api 3y ago
This feeds into one of my pet hypotheses about human ability: the most important biological factors determining success lie not in whatever influences IQ or other intelligence or creativity attributes but in the dopamine system. Take 20 IQ points from someone and replace that with the ability to engage focus and flow state at will and see what happens. Our dopamine system is tuned for a world that is far slower than this one and largely unchanging. From the perspective of modernity almost all humans exist in a state of catatonic depression. Few humans are able to sustain the level of focus and activity that would be optimal in today's world. When we do, in short bursts, we see amazing results. Unfortunately drugs like amphetamines have side effects and are addictive. From what I've seen amphetamines and similar focus drugs often lead to a lot of focus and engagement but mis-regulated: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mf3e1F1a0Hg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mf3e1F1a0Hg An AI would not need to be superintelligent to outcompete humans in virtually any endeavor. It would just need to have ordinary human intelligence plus infinite tireless focus. This also implies that a way to boost focus that worked better than amphetamine (and without addiction and other side effects) and similar things would be much more significant for human potential than a way to boost IQ. The other alternative would be to drastically extend life span, allowing us to slow down and be okay with that. The reason we tend to fast forward everything so much is that we don't live very long. The systems of capital and capital allocation that drive society run at a speed that is far in excess of what our dopamine systems are adapted to handle so they can deliver results within an acceptably small fraction of a human life span. Either we are too slow or too short lived. Pick one.
- 15457345234 3y ago
  Amphetamines are truly an evil drug, they bring out and emphasise the worst qualities of people.