5 ms·

There is a line of research into the "transmissible' phenomena of a lot of these neurodegen dz. Epidemiologically, it's probably not infectious from one pers

by caycep 3y ago

There is a line of research into the "transmissible' phenomena of a lot of these neurodegen dz. Epidemiologically, it's probably not infectious from one person to another bc we don't see spouses getting PD or AD often. But there's interesting phenomena - i.e. one of the Parkinson's stem cell implantation trials got a lot of press after the trial (which failed, didn't show benefit) bc after subjects passed several years later and got autopsied, they found clumps of parkinsonian proteins (lewy bodies) on the histology slides of the implanted stem cells. Similarly, there's some papers w/ mice w/ knockout Parkinsonian genes getting parkinsonian features and lewy bodies when injected w/ abnormal misfolded synuclein from another mouse. What exactly to do w/ this, no one is entirely sure yet.

secondcoming 3y ago
[flagged]
- jurynulifcation 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - ra 3y ago
    makes it hard to read
    - s1artibartfast 3y ago
      read it somewhere else?
foota 3y ago
I guess if your brain proteins are mixing with someone elses you normally have a bigger issue.
- knodi123 3y ago
  I don't know where your neuro-jack is installed, but if it's not in the skull then I don't know how you even connect to the all-mind.
dimask 3y ago
> we don't see spouses getting PD or AD often Actually it may seem so [1], though still there is not any conclusive evidence to support a transmission hypothesis really as all this could be due to increased stress and such factors. Also, brain surgeons' increased risk of AD and more reports of associated risks with regard to contamination from brain operations [2] (similar to the article's ones) provide more indications that such a hypothesis is not completely implausible. Though also far from strongly supporting it or anything, as there is no proper experiment design with control groups etc to make better conclusions. [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2945313/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2945313/ [2] https://www.medicaldesignandoutsourcing.com/report-suggests-brain-surgeons-could-catch-alzheimers-disease/ https://www.medicaldesignandoutsourcing.com/report-suggests-...
- caycep 3y ago
  Yes there may be these individual case reports - but in practice - I would say, most spouses of PD patients don't seem to get it. There's like 2 exceptions out of 1000 patients in our clinic, but not enough that I feel like running to my epidemiologist with my hair on fire.
devmor 3y ago
Can you explain more or give a source on that parkinsons stem cell trial? I’m not sure I understand what happened and I’d like to learn about it.
- caycep 3y ago
  It's been a while since I looked at this stuff so apologies for the rustiness Columbia trial paper: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejm200103083441002 https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejm200103083441002 Tampa trial paper: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12953276/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12953276/ Additionally, it looks like I totally missed at least one European program at Lund University (review paper: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5345652/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5345652/) I've heard rumblings re preclinical prep work w/ the Takashi group at Kyoto University as well, not sure where that's at at the moment. I randomly found this review, but haven't had a chance to plough thru it yet, but I wouldn't be surprised that the stem cell tech these days makes whatever they used 20 years ago ancient and crude by comparison https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9890289/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9890289/
- caycep 3y ago
  Additionally, this was the followup paper that found Lewy bodies developing in the transplanted cells (suggesting some sort of spread/prion-like hypothesis with regards to Lewy bodies/insoluble alpha synuclein) https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18391962/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18391962/ edit: competing group also managed to publish theirs at the same time https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18391963/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18391963/
msla 3y ago
> w/ mice Is this a special kind of mouse?
- elzbardico 3y ago
  Mice are a good animal model for a lot of the human physiology.
- mbo 3y ago
  "w/" is an abbreviation for "with". "w/ mice" should be read as "with mice".
  - pvaldes 3y ago
    The savings of just two characters does not worth the effort and mental pause to decode it
    - RugnirViking 3y ago
      it's an exceptionally common way of writing with and without. similar to "etc." standing for "et cetera." at some point you don't "decode" it, thats just what it means.
    - peterfirefly 3y ago
      It's a great abbreviation for handwriting, though. It also meshes really well with w/o.
    - caycep 3y ago
      not to horrify you but https://gomerblog.com/2014/12/soap-note/ https://gomerblog.com/2014/12/soap-note/
- denysvitali 3y ago
  w/ = with w/o = without This comment is full of abbreviations (PD = Parkinson's Disease, AD = Alzheimer's Disease) that makes it a bit difficult to read (if you don't know / realize what those abbreviations stand for)
parsabg 3y ago
> What exactly to do w/ this, no one is entirely sure yet. Sounds like a sensible next step would be to try and replicate this in animal models (i.e. treat animals with growth hormones extracted from cadavers of same species) to identify the proteins/prions that trigger the pathogenesis of Alzheimer's, which could perhaps be drug targets for at least a subset of AD causes.

by caycep 3y ago

secondcoming 3y ago

[flagged]

jurynulifcation 3y ago
[flagged]
- ra 3y ago
  makes it hard to read
  - s1artibartfast 3y ago
    read it somewhere else?

foota 3y ago

I guess if your brain proteins are mixing with someone elses you normally have a bigger issue.

knodi123 3y ago
I don't know where your neuro-jack is installed, but if it's not in the skull then I don't know how you even connect to the all-mind.

dimask 3y ago

> we don't see spouses getting PD or AD often Actually it may seem so [1], though still there is not any conclusive evidence to support a transmission hypothesis really as all this could be due to increased stress and such factors. Also, brain surgeons' increased risk of AD and more reports of associated risks with regard to contamination from brain operations [2] (similar to the article's ones) provide more indications that such a hypothesis is not completely implausible. Though also far from strongly supporting it or anything, as there is no proper experiment design with control groups etc to make better conclusions. [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2945313/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2945313/ [2] https://www.medicaldesignandoutsourcing.com/report-suggests-brain-surgeons-could-catch-alzheimers-disease/ https://www.medicaldesignandoutsourcing.com/report-suggests-...

caycep 3y ago
Yes there may be these individual case reports - but in practice - I would say, most spouses of PD patients don't seem to get it. There's like 2 exceptions out of 1000 patients in our clinic, but not enough that I feel like running to my epidemiologist with my hair on fire.

devmor 3y ago

Can you explain more or give a source on that parkinsons stem cell trial? I’m not sure I understand what happened and I’d like to learn about it.

caycep 3y ago
It's been a while since I looked at this stuff so apologies for the rustiness Columbia trial paper: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejm200103083441002 https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejm200103083441002 Tampa trial paper: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12953276/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12953276/ Additionally, it looks like I totally missed at least one European program at Lund University (review paper: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5345652/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5345652/) I've heard rumblings re preclinical prep work w/ the Takashi group at Kyoto University as well, not sure where that's at at the moment. I randomly found this review, but haven't had a chance to plough thru it yet, but I wouldn't be surprised that the stem cell tech these days makes whatever they used 20 years ago ancient and crude by comparison https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9890289/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9890289/
caycep 3y ago
Additionally, this was the followup paper that found Lewy bodies developing in the transplanted cells (suggesting some sort of spread/prion-like hypothesis with regards to Lewy bodies/insoluble alpha synuclein) https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18391962/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18391962/ edit: competing group also managed to publish theirs at the same time https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18391963/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18391963/

msla 3y ago

> w/ mice Is this a special kind of mouse?

elzbardico 3y ago
Mice are a good animal model for a lot of the human physiology.
mbo 3y ago
"w/" is an abbreviation for "with". "w/ mice" should be read as "with mice".
- pvaldes 3y ago
  The savings of just two characters does not worth the effort and mental pause to decode it
  - RugnirViking 3y ago
    it's an exceptionally common way of writing with and without. similar to "etc." standing for "et cetera." at some point you don't "decode" it, thats just what it means.
  - peterfirefly 3y ago
    It's a great abbreviation for handwriting, though. It also meshes really well with w/o.
  - caycep 3y ago
    not to horrify you but https://gomerblog.com/2014/12/soap-note/ https://gomerblog.com/2014/12/soap-note/
denysvitali 3y ago
w/ = with w/o = without This comment is full of abbreviations (PD = Parkinson's Disease, AD = Alzheimer's Disease) that makes it a bit difficult to read (if you don't know / realize what those abbreviations stand for)

parsabg 3y ago

> What exactly to do w/ this, no one is entirely sure yet. Sounds like a sensible next step would be to try and replicate this in animal models (i.e. treat animals with growth hormones extracted from cadavers of same species) to identify the proteins/prions that trigger the pathogenesis of Alzheimer's, which could perhaps be drug targets for at least a subset of AD causes.