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Yeah see, where I don't see eye-to-eye on here is the idea that Windows is bad because it lets you download and run whatever you want. I don't agree at all. I t
by jchw 3y ago
Yeah see, where I don't see eye-to-eye on here is the idea that Windows is bad because it lets you download and run whatever you want. I don't agree at all. I think Windows is just bad, and in fact, it gets worse as they try to push for an Apple-esque App Store model and slowly add roadblocks to """side-loading""" (or as we called it in my youth, "installing software".)
Likewise, I don't think that's what makes iOS good, either. I don't think it ever was. I think that it's understandable that Apple's approach to this would in fact be to make a "walled garden", especially given that it is wildly profitable, but Apple already had beloved computers long before they started doing stuff like this. Yes, to be sure, the Macintosh had and has plenty of flaws, but I do not think that anyone's goal is to turn iOS into Windows, and Apple would retain a visegrip on the iOS experience just due to how locked down modern operating systems are. Immutable image based operating systems with heavy restrictions on what usermode apps can do are going to be inherently much more stable, even when faced with untrusted usermode apps.
The thing is, while I get why I and others get categorized as part of the "anti-Apple" crowd, it's not because I simply hate Apple for no reason whatsoever. Like many others, I desperately wanted to like Apple, and then they just crapped all over what I consider to be my demographic of users. Please understand: to me, I am not THAT loyal to ANY vendor. I am a user of computers first and foremost.
But what's worse is, I have to deal with the knock-on effects of this. My biggest pet issue is absolutely their tirade against patent-unencumbered formats like Opus, which impacts people I know who prefer iPhone because it's all they've ever known. "How can I get WebMs to play in Discord/My web browser/etc?" You own a computer where the manufacturer decided that you're not allowed to install codecs or alternate browser engines, so you can basically go fuck yourself.
"Bicycles of the mind" my ass.
In any case, I think there is no slippery slope here. Apple is not going to volunteer control of their ecosystem away, so god knows they're going to do the minimum necessary to comply with any of this. So I think the impact on the overall iOS ecosystem will probably not be that substantial once all is said and done.
Even on Android, app stores outside of the Play Store are relatively rare, and attempts to circumvent the Play Store for the purposes of making more money haven't done very well. Even on Windows, it's hard to compete with or avoid selling on Steam, because it's got so much momentum and users generally like it as a platform for buying games on. Apple has more than a level playing field, they have a decade head start, total control over the platform, and so much more; They are far from at risk of control slipping.
If they're worried about anything, it is probably quarterly financial reports not being as good as they possibly could be.
- seanmcdirmid 3y agoI can go out and buy a windows machine if I want. Or a windows mobile phone back in the day, or an android phone today. There are so many alternatives to Apple products that if I wanted that kind of platform, it already exists and can be chosen! For Android…in China the play store basically doesn’t even exist, so phones with non-play stores aren’t rare at all. So you basically want to force your preferences on me, and that really just annoys me. You don’t have to buy an iPhone or an iPad for yourself, you have other choices that better suit your needs, so leave my preferences alone please. I don’t like being told what I have to buy.
- CamperBob2 3y agoI'm missing the part where someone is forcing you to install non-sanctioned apps. If Apple is adding all the value you say they are, what do they (and you) have to lose?
- jchw 3y agoI just want to know: What choice do you think I'm trying to force on you? This argument only works if you force this into an us-vs-them dichotomy, but I'm an Apple customer that owns multiple Apple products, so this thing where some outgroup is trying to piss on Apple's parade is a delusion. But even ignoring that, do you think I'm trying to force Apple to force you to install Firefox? Because I'm not, and I'd love to hear what it is you think anyone wants to force you personally to install.
- pbh101 3y agoHow long until ‘this app only works on browser X’ on mobile that is only available via a third party store? Not impossible. We’ve been spared that so far but happens frequently on desktop Safari even today.
- jchw 3y agoI have an iPad and there's plenty of stuff I literally can't do with Safari on it right now. However, it's not everyone else's fault. Yes, some websites are stupid and do UA checking and intentionally block people on some browsers, but none of those websites are the problem, as all of those sites are not going to give up a vast quantity of iPad users even after Chrome and Firefox become available. It's not like macOS because iOS is not a minority in the world of smartphones, and iPadOS is definitely not a minority in the world of tablets. It's not like Internet Explorer or Edge because it doesn't suck shit through a straw. The websites that are actually a problem? The ones that don't care. The ones that really could not give a shit less if it runs on your stupid iPad or not. Those are the websites that you can't use on iPadOS. And while the top 500 most popular websites are never going to act this way, this mentality is more widespread than you think. They do not care, and will not care, that Apple doesn't let you run an alternative browser on your tablet. Therefore, you simply miss out. In addition, some web apps will just not be able to have good support on Safari because Safari just generally takes longer on standards. So instead, you will just not see support for Apple mobile browsers at all. Again, you come upon it a lot. It's not out of malice for iOS users, its that Safari just isn't as good at keeping up with web standards as Firefox and Chrome are. And yes, a lot of web standards suck, but a lot of them also don't and are made to resolve real problems with the web app platform, and look, if Apple's argument that you don't need sideloading is "just make webapps", then I think it's only fair to say that it's not a very good option when they have such inferior support for the standards that people are making to make better and faster webapps. Apple's influence on web standards has always felt petty. They're the only company that has the specific kind of influence that they do because users can't simply opt to use an alternate browser; they compete in a totally different way than almost every other browser. They should have to compete on a level playing field. I reckon that suddenly, WebMs will start playing on iOS and iPadOS.