4 ms·

Do you consider your PC "less useful" because there isn't a single app store for all your software, a single browser engine, a 30% surcharge for all your spendi

• nerdjon 3y ago
  My PC is a single purpose device, and that is for gaming. Which considering I use Steam for many of my games (not all) that 30% commission is already there. The reality is many people use their PC's far differently than they use their phones. When my PC was my primary computing device many of the things I use and pay for on my phone either simply didn't exist, or I would never dream to pay for them. Also you are missing the point, my phone becomes less useful because I flat out refuse to hand over access to my phone to a company which wishes to abuse that privilege of an alternative store. If they were going to act the way I want them to act, they would have no reason to use an alternative store.
  • deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  • Hamuko 3y ago
    Did your PC ship with Steam installed?
    • nerdjon 3y ago
      No, which in reality emphasizes the point I am trying to make. As a gamer I basically have zero choice but to install Steam, Epic Game Store, EA Store, or any other stupid launcher that a publisher decides to force on me when there is a perfectly fine game store built into Windows and Mac.
      • madeofpalk 3y ago
        The "or" in your sentence indicates the choice in the market.
        • riversflow 3y ago
          There isn't user choice, only developer choice. For example, if I want to play Fortnite with my IRL friends I must download Epic Launcher. If I want to play WoW with my friends I must download BattleNet, if I want to play Counter Strike I must download Steam. I don't get much choice in what my already existing community of friends decides to play. This is likely to be mirrored in phone app stores. Need whatsapp/facebook/instagram on your phone? download the Meta Store! Don't like their T&C? Pound sand.
          • shaan7 3y ago
            Don't like their T&C, don't use them. As simple as that. I do not like Trucaller's T&C, so I do not use it. If some day I don't like WhatsApp's T&C, I won't use it. My friends and family will be asked to contact me via Signal (as an example). To your examples with games, there are lots of games that I do not install simply because I don't like those launchers. Whats wrong with that? It is _my choice_. I am not forced to use only Windows Store, for example. The argument that "because third party app stores can be shitty, they shouldn't be possible" is strange.
            • riversflow 3y ago
              Exile yourself from your social group to own the corporations. Got it.
        • nerdjon 3y ago
          Maybe "And" would have been better, but I assume you are not a gamer if you think that. The reality is no, if I want to play Fortnite I have to install the Epic Game store. If I want to play GTA, even if I buy the game through steam I have to use the Rockstar Launcher. There are multiple instances of this situation in gaming and it is the exact thing I don't want to happen here.
          • madeofpalk 3y ago
            > but I assume you are not a gamer if you think that. Why would you assume that? I play video games on my PC. I'm not forced to install any software. I can make informed decisions and understand the trade offs with what software I want to use. Chosing to install Epic Launcher and playing Fortnite is you sending a signal into the market. Competition exists, users can express their opinion and act on it.
      • SkyBelow 3y ago
        >when there is a perfectly fine game store built into Windows I am surprised to see this sentiment, given how much trouble I've had with the Windows store the few times I've been forced to use it. The way it puts files into locations I have limited rights to even while operating in admin mode... game files... made it a nightmare. Especially when it stopped working and the installer couldn't even identify those files as existing for the sake of removing them. It was to the point now I'd rather skip playing a new game than use Window's store if it was my only option, even if the game was offered for free.
      • lttlrck 3y ago
        Thanks for clarifying. I thought you were coming from a different angle and couldn't quite reconcile it. This is a very good point.
      • post_break 3y ago
        No choice, proceeds to list off multiple app stores. Apply that same logic to the iPhone. Why not just take the abstinence road when it comes to any other store than steam? What's the safest way to Skii? Don't ski. Don't want to download any apps from a different app store than Apple's? Don't do it then.
        • nerdjon 3y ago
          I am listing off those stores because I am making a point that as a gamer, I do not have a choice in using certain stores and launchers if I want to play the games I want to play. That is the exact situation I want to avoid on my phone. What is so hard about that to understand. This is removing a choice from a user.
          • post_break 3y ago
            You have a choice. Don't use the other store. If there was only one AppStore for games on PC you'd have no choice. That's the point. If it was only Steam, and Steam said they won't allow any games that depict war, what choice would you have? But that's the magic of having multiple App Stores, they have to compete. They can't be the world police of software. What's so hard to understand that having a choice means you can choose to do something, or not. If you want to use your phone with only Apple's Appstore, continue to do so, if an app you really want is not on the app store, then DONT BUY IT, except now, someone besides you has the CHOICE to download it.
            • nerdjon 3y ago
              You are advocating for an indirect choice, I have no benefit to installing Epic Game store, rockstar, or any other launcher. None, it just isn't there. Where as my direct choice is, I want to play this game. If I want to play a specific game, the choice of launcher is being made for me. That is not competition. I should not have to make that choice, and until this roles out I have not had to make this choice with my phone. I have been able to confidently install anything I want from a single source and it's great. That choice will be removed from me, that DIRECT choice. Not indirect which is what the App Store change will be.
      • Hamuko 3y ago
        The "perfectly fine game store built into Mac" wouldn't even accept many of the games currently available on Steam. Anything with the "Adult Only" rating would just be outright rejected. Obviously you also wouldn't be able to install the games you bought on there on any device that didn't have an Apple logo. Sharing the same game library between Windows, macOS and Linux? Nope, buy them again. You might also have to kiss goodbye to cloud saves. The macOS App Store version of Resident Evil 4 doesn't support cloud saves between macOS and iOS devices whereas the Steam version has cloud saves. And this is the state of Apple's game store when they are facing competition.
    • deleted 3y ago
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  • TylerE 3y ago
    The reality is most users don't have a PC, period. Even laptops are increasingly dinosaur-like, except for work-provided ones. It seems many home users are more than happy with some combination of phones, tablets, smart TVs, and consoles.
    • nerdjon 3y ago
      If I wasn't a gamer I wouldn't have a PC. I mean technically I would still have a Mac but much of what I use on my Mac is through the Mac App Store. The vast majority of my general computing happens on my phone or tablet. My PC and Mac while technically general computing devices, are not in practice anymore and I would wager that is true for most people. Not counting my Work computer for obvious reasons.
• spullara 3y ago
  For sure. I agree with their whole post. There isn't any advantage whatsoever as a user to have Steam, Microsoft App Store, Epic Store, etc. All those stores take their pound of flesh and it is up to me to manage them all. It sucks.
  • smoldesu 3y ago
    F-Droid gets this right out of the box. A one-stop-shop for Free, Open Source applications has annihilated my desire to purchase apps at all. I don't buy PDF readers or file browsers or launchers or basic system utilities any other user would expect for free. I install it, because I have that choice. Without F-Droid or the ability to install Open Source software, I wouldn't use Android. It's that much of a game-changer, and I suspect Apple wants to avoid a similar disruption at all costs.
  • nerdjon 3y ago
    Wasn't the Epic Game store also found to be a privacy nightmare? I could be wrong but I felt like that was a major reason the Heroic Game Launcher got so much traction (which is fantastic btw)
  • hn_throwaway_99 3y ago
    This attitude is completely baffling to me. I certainly understand if you don't want to use those other stores and loading options, but I feel like everyone has Stockholm Syndrome thinking it's a good thing that alternative ways to run software on a device you own should be forbidden by our tech overloads. On a site called Hacker News no less! Seriously, WTF???
    • Agingcoder 3y ago
      As a user of said stores, I understand the frustration : because of exclusivity deals, some games are available on shop x but not shop y, and you end up with a fragmented view of your games, different rules etc. Now as you pointed out forbidding alternative ways is not necessarily the one true solution !
    • spullara 3y ago
• droopyEyelids 3y ago
  "useful" is too coarse a metric. It includes the concept of what you can build or create with a device. A personal computer wins that by a long shot. It includes accessibility- pre-literate and illiterate people can use an iOS device. It includes the risk. How many iOS users have suffered viruses/malware vs laptop users?
• s3p 3y ago
  Why do we keep pretending PCs are comparable with phones? They compute, that's the end of their similarities. They have completely different use cases and are needed for different reasons. Things that are good on a PC might not be good on a phone.
• kehrin 3y ago
  None, except for the fact that the 30% fee will be reduced (not eliminated), has been achieved by the EU ruling. - Alternative browser engines are useless if the rest of the world doesn't test for them (which they won't because they don't have access) - You cannot start another marketplace without showing Apple you have the ability to financially support it - And thanks for the need to support it, 30% surcharge will only be the ceiling
• Bud 3y ago
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