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Modder re-creates Game Boy Advance games using the audio from crash sounds
- 2024throwaway 3y agoThis is insanely impressive. I'm sure many of the techniques used like the "majority vote" algorithm cited are underutilized across many industries.
- epcoa 3y agoIf one is interested there is nearly 100 years now of sophisticated noisy signal recovery techniques. Magnetic storage media operates on the principal of this hack at baseline! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partial-response_maximum-likelihood https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partial-response_maximum-likel... The same idea can apply here as GBA ROM material would be highly biased. Majority vote wastes a lot of information.
- rob74 3y agoThe problem with this signal is that it was never designed to be recovered in the first place (it only came about by chance), that's why it has the issue with long sequences of 0 bytes described in the article.
- mikepurvis 3y agoI wondered about it for film scanning, specifically with a fan project like 4K77 where they're dealing with potentially damaged theatre prints rather than pristine masters— having multiple of them and being able to use that to eliminate scratches and so on would potentially save a ton of time on manual fixing in post.
- guyomes 3y agoOne interesting application of taking the value appearing in majority, or more generally taking the median, is to remove noise or people from a sequence of several photos taken from the same point of view. This idea is to superimpose all the photos, and for each pixel, you simply keep the median [1]. [1]: https://patdavid.net/2013/05/noise-removal-in-photos-with-median_6/ https://patdavid.net/2013/05/noise-removal-in-photos-with-me...
- astrange 3y agoThis will have the effect of smoothing the image even if you didn't want to do that, which is part of the reason people are convinced phone cameras "overprocess" images or try to beautify you even when they aren't. You have to counteract this by actually putting the noise back when you're done.
- jacquesm 3y agoIt's fairly common in data recovery though, just keep on reading disk images and running quora until something passes the checksum and see if it works out. Better still if there are higher level checksums (for instance across a file that has a signature) for further verification. Also used in some aerospace applications.
- brokensegue 3y agoZzazz (the subject of the article) runs a yearly April fools competition/event that usually involves some amount of retro hacking/reverse engineering. I recommend participating. Previous years competitions are on their GitHub
- reactordev 3y agoIt’s stories like these that remind me I’m stupid and have a lot still to learn. My goodness this is amazing. Up there with audio key logging and things I read about but could never dream would be a real thing. I tip my hat sir. Reminded that I’m a mere mortal in the presence of greatness. The absurdity of recreating a game based on audio crashes sounds like something a mental patient would say but no, here we are in 2024.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- sunnybeetroot 3y agoYou’re not stupid because you don’t know how to reverse engineer a GBA game, unless you work for Nintendo and it’s part of your job description.
- reactordev 3y agoStupid in the sense of dazed and unable to think clearly not lack of intelligence. Like, stunned stupid. You can have moments of stupidity and still be vastly intelligent. No one will call you stupid. Calling someone stupid is the first definition. I’m not a fan of that one. Claiming stupid on self is valid. When my girlfriend says “oh I’m stupid”, it’s not a remark about intelligence - it’s about clarity.
- sunnybeetroot 3y agoThat makes a lot of sense, I appreciate the follow up.
- da768 3y agoI imagine the 0xFF might be converted to 0x00 due to DC blocking capacitors/high-pass filtering, audio circuits aren't really suited for non-audible content. He might get better capture accuracy with a digital oscilloscope hooked directly at the chip's audio outputs if he's lucky, but it's still pretty impressive he got a bootable image out of that.
- Frenchgeek 3y agoFrom what I remember reading in the comments of his youtube video, the point of the exercise was to do it with as basic equipment as possible.Hence the hours of multiples passes to average the error out instead of a proper data-logging oscilloscope.
- arcticbull 3y ago> I imagine the 0xFF might be converted to 0x00 due to DC blocking capacitors/high-pass filtering, audio circuits aren't really suited for non-audible content. Yeah, you want to generate a signal with no DC bias, something as simple as Manchester encoding will go a long way. If that's not good enough, there's NRZ or even a convolutional encoding. You also want to make sure you either send a sin wave, or if you can't do that, at least make sure your square wave frequency is high enough that it doesn't get eaten by the AC coupling capacitors.
- freeqaz 3y agoWould it be possible to get a higher quality read from using something like an Arduino's I/O pins and some bit-banged C code? I'd be curious to see what would be possible using cheap, off-the-shelf tools since a lot of people don't necessarily have an oscilloscope laying around. :P
- fodkodrasz 3y agoWithout looking up datasheets, just form the top of my head: the Arduino DAC most likely has 12 bits resolution (as common for cheap uCs), and maybe even slower sampling than a soundcard. A sound card was probably better than that even in the 1990s (say a Sound Blaster).
- skeaker 3y agoGlad to see this getting more attention here, it was posted a few days ago but drowned (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39037104 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39037104). The original video has a lot not mentioned in this brief article, including a custom adapter that the hacker had to cut together manually to get the right audio quality out of the DS.
- taftster 3y agoLink to "original video": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-7PSmYYHF0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-7PSmYYHF0
- hifikuno 3y agoThe video was great. I think my favourite part is where he dumps the Chinese knock off version and finds the random ARM code and reverse engineers it. So much cool stuff in there.
- taftster 3y agoRight? This kind of stuff just makes me look silly in what I'm able to achieve. I can only accomplish watching a video of some guy doing bad ass stuff and maybe holding onto a few notional details. People are just super smart sometimes.
- runnr_az 3y agoIt’s especially fun watching super smart people work on somewhat ridiculous projects.
- thewakalix 3y agoThe issue with long runs of 0x00 is related to "clock recovery". > Some digital data streams, especially high-speed serial data streams (such as the raw stream of data from the magnetic head of a disk drive and serial communication networks such as Ethernet) are sent without an accompanying clock signal. The receiver generates a clock from an approximate frequency reference, and then phase-aligns the clock to the transitions in the data stream with a phase-locked loop (PLL). > In order for this scheme to work, a data stream must transition frequently enough to correct for any drift in the PLL's oscillator. The limit for how long a clock-recovery unit can operate without a transition is known as its maximum consecutive identical digits (CID) specification. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clock_recovery https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clock_recovery
- akira2501 3y agoI love how we used to use a bunch of very clever "code book" systems like 8b/10b which did a lot of careful work with small runs of bits to ensure the clock was recoverable and to avoid line capacitance issues. Then we just moved to things like 64/66b which takes a giant chunk of bits, adds a short header to guarantee a clock transition, then runs everything through a pseudorandom scrambler.
- userbinator 3y agoAgainst adversaries, scrambling schemes can produce some very perplexing behaviour. See the "weak sectors" used for CD copy protection for one infamous example.
- dwattttt 3y agoA sprinkle of entropy improves everything
- jacquesm 3y agoThey do a similar thing for GPS data recovery. It is so far below the noise floor that normally speaking the signal is not recoverable. But then you inject some (known) noise and suddenly the noise modulated by the (unknown) signal starts to drown out the noise in the rest of the system and that in turn allows you to recover bits from the signal.
- peddling-brink 3y agoWhy would this happen in the first place? Is it common for these games to dump state to audio? Is it a deliberate debugging tool for the game devs?
- 0xC0ncord 3y agoThe author's previous video[1] explains the technical details regarding this behavior. Basically the way GBA sound works is there is a buffer in RAM that the audio is streamed from, and an interrupt is supposed to signal the hardware to begin reading data from the beginning of the buffer again. However, if the interrupt is never fired (such as when the game crashes), the audio stream will go beyond the buffer and read other parts of memory. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSWNkpqjtQY&t=361s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSWNkpqjtQY&t=361s
- jboy55 3y agoWould this be dependent on the audio file that was being played during the crash to start at address 0 of the ROM? It seems like it'd be highly unlikely you'd be able to get 100% of the ROM. Now if this was a hack where the thought was, "What if we dumped the whole ROM to the audio buffer, could we recover the complete ROM through audio analysis?"
- ordu 3y agoI think hardware starts from 0 after reaching 0xfff..ffff address. The article mentions that you need to wait before starting to record, I assume it is a pause needed for hardware to overflow address.
- lelandbatey 3y agoThat video seems to imply that the audio hardware automatically wraps back to address 0 when it reaches the end of RAM. That may not be true, but it's implied by the animation in that video. And since they were apparently able to dump the entire ROM via audio, I suppose there's some way to get the entire memory contents.
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- Y_Y 3y agoThis reminds me of the original iPodLinux hack almost twenty years ago where the fourth-gen firmware was dumped via the piezo speaker - https://web.archive.org/web/20140810083116/http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn7085 https://web.archive.org/web/20140810083116/http://www.newsci... Coincidentally one of the things this facilitated was playing GBA games on the iPod, though I was happy enough just to play Doom a with the click wheel and watch monochrome videos.
- nathancahill 3y agoGood memories. I still have my iPod Classic, I upgraded the battery and added 4 256GB MicroSD cards. I saw a mod recently for adding Bluetooth but it involves swapping the rear case and I don't think I'll go that far. There's something timeless about the design (and about owning copies of music files).
- KennyBlanken 3y agoEvery music file I have in iTunes and on my iPhone is a DRM-less MP3 or AAC file.
- xyzzy_plugh 3y agoFunny to see this mentioned. I was recently out skiing and was using my phone to listen to music, as I used to do with my 3rd generation iPod. Moments ago I was lamenting to my colleague that while my phone's battery rapidly plummeted in the cold despite being insulated and close to my body (no way even remotely approaching freezing temperatures) my iPod never struggled to play tunes all day. In fact I never recall any noticeable difference in battery performance in cold temperatures despite daily use for years. And yet my phone gets a bit chilly and gives up the ghost. I use Bluetooth otherwise I'd have dug out the 3rd gen for the next ski day.
- wegfawefgawefg 3y agoWas it a difference in battery chemistry?
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- Solvency 3y ago[flagged]
- jacquesm 3y agoI got it just fine, what exactly bothers you?
- seabass-labrax 3y agoDoes anyone know what's going on when the TheZZAZZGlitch's emulator reports that the game tries to jump to an invalid address? I'm not so familiar with the ARM7 processor used in the GameBoy Advance, but I can't imagine how it would be possible to construct a jump call with an invalid value. Additionally, what would happen if one of TheZZAZZGlitch's incorrectly reconstructed ROMs was run on a real GameBoy?
- cosarara 3y ago> I can't imagine how it would be possible to construct a jump call with an invalid value You can use the bx instruction to jump to any address stored in a register. > Additionally, what would happen if one of TheZZAZZGlitch's incorrectly reconstructed ROMs was run on a real GameBoy? It would crash, and eventually start playing the ROM on the speaker, the whole point of the video :)
- seabass-labrax 3y agoThanks for the explanation! So it sounds like the emulator is detecting the error 'out of band' with the emulated execution flow, and choosing to throw an error message rather than letting the execution continue. If it didn't catch the error, it sounds like it would glitch out in much the same way as the real GameBoy would. Is that right?
- immibis 3y agoThat's right. This sort of thing is more likely to indicate a discrepancy between the emulator and the real hardware, than actual game behaviour, so emulator developers choose to treat it like a crash. Some emulators have "continue anyway" buttons and some don't.
- ehaliewicz2 3y agoIt is likely that the emulator only emulates accessing valid parts of the GBA's memory map, and throws that error if invalid parts are accessed. As to what happens on real hardware.. who knows? :)
- Trekker666 3y agoI've done this using GoldWave opening game files to extract their audio because I like the menu song or something, but nothing this sophisticated and cool.
- jacquesm 3y agoThat is extremely clever. The persistence alone is impressive but to get it to the point where it works well enough that you can actually extract the ROM contents with high fidelity is next level.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- maxlin 3y agoThe diffing of the real-world cartridge was the most interesting part. Requires a goofy amount of unnecessary knowledge to just jump in to reversing that and figuring out what its meaning is lol
- DerCommodore 3y agoCrazy
- scarecrw 3y agoThis reminds me of an attempt made by RGMechEx to retrieve game code for an Atari game where the code itself was used to generate a visual effect similar to TV static on the screen [1]. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HSjJU562e8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HSjJU562e8
- Rapzid 3y agoThe most impressive part of all this is, IMHO, how the code was modified by the bootleggers to run the game off writable flash vs ROM plus volatile save memory haha.
- mmaniac 3y agoThis is a very common technique on bootleg Game Boy and Game Boy Advance games which bootleggers use to save a few cents on batteries. And in truth, it's not too difficult to make such a patch. Bootleggers will write per-game patches which flush the save contents to writeable flash depending on a small amount of reverse engineering work to discover where in the code the game saves. However, since all official GBA games always save data using functions from the Nintendo SDK, it's fairly straightforward to hook those functions and make a generic patch for any GBA game to save on a batteryless bootleg cartridge. I have written a patcher to do this which you can find here. https://github.com/metroid-maniac/gba-auto-batteryless-patcher https://github.com/metroid-maniac/gba-auto-batteryless-patch...
- goodboyjojo 3y agothis is a good article. very interesting stuff
- shadowgovt 3y agoI've always found Nintendo's audio architectures to be fascinating. The original NES had a sample generator that could do arbitrary waveforms and could be driven in two modes: one mode is you gave it a memory address and it'd start reading the bits in and treat them as an incredibly simple waveform (1 means 'go up one value', 0 means 'go down one value'... So to do a flat wave you'd do a run of 10101010etc.). But you could also direct-drive the chip by continuously feeding it an "initial value" directly from the CPU, which was actually faster than the audio driver would read the bits from RAM itself... Problem is that doing so ate up all your CPU cycles, so you could only do it if you weren't doing anything else. There were some games that took advantage of that: Battletoads had higher-fidelity drum-hits that they could play when action was paused, and they used it for the title screen, the extra-"crunchy" final hits on enemies (where all the action paused for a moment for dramatic effect), and the memorable pause music. Here's a demo of the game switching between direct-drive and let-chip-read-samples mode to demonstrate (credit to Retro Game Audio for uploading the emulator-doctored video to show when the game is in the direct-drive subroutine). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGT0FM3yh-w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGT0FM3yh-w
- Hichit 3y ago[flagged]
- emi2k01 3y agoWow! I just realized I trust HN comments way too much because I had to read the whole comment to realize it's spam.