4 ms·

It’s like they want regulators to get involved. The arrogance is insane.

by ianlevesque 3y ago

spacebacon 3y ago
It’s fun and games when you have that much cash.
- danielvaughn 3y ago
  Fun and games until a competitor arrives on the market with a solid developer experience. As soon as that happens, I’m dropping Apple like a bad habit. The only thing keeping me on their tech is my hatred for Android’s UX. Heck, if the Windows phone was still around, I’d probably be on that.
  - spacebacon 3y ago
    I’ll be an early adopter right there with you.
  - bmoxb 3y ago
    I'm not advocating in either direction, but I'm curious what elements of iOS's UX you prefer over Android's?
    - jwells89 3y ago
      For me a big part of it is how gestures track, the curves used by animations, inertia, bounciness, etc. Under iOS it all feels refined and naturalistic, whereas Android’s counterparts land somewhere in the uncanny valley and come off as more mechanical (fitting given its name, I suppose). Aside from that, in general you can feel more “seams” between components and rough edges all throughout Android’s UX. It reminds me of how the Linux desktop experience used to be several years ago actually, except Android seems to have gotten stuck for unknown reasons where Linux DEs have continually improved.
      - __MatrixMan__ 3y ago
        > you can feel more “seams” between components That's it. I've been struggling to figure out what I can't stand about iOS and it just clicked. It's the lack of seams. When something breaks I can never figure out what specifically broke, so I can't reason about my mistake (or know who to contact if it's not my mistake). I like seams so much that I'm running google play services in a sandbox (Graphene OS) so google has to grovel for my permission like everybody else whenever they want to do something. It's a little annoying, but it's teaching me where the seams are.
        jwells89 3y ago
        It all depends on what one’s looking for I guess. As an aesthetically inclined technical person, seams can be annoying to the point of distraction if they’re not thoughtfully worked into the design (90% of the time, they’re not).
        __MatrixMan__ 3y ago
        Different strokes for different folks I guess. I don't care about aesthetics at all, I'm just wanting to know where I'd put the crowbar if I wanted to turn it into something else. The ideal technology for me is quietly doing is job somewhere I can't currently see and rarely have to look. Perhaps that counts as aesthetics?
    - danielvaughn 3y ago
      Probably the navigation I guess, though it's not something I've given much detailed thought into. I just know that whenever I pick up a friend's Android, I hate the experience.
      - spacebacon 3y ago
        I hate the experience of a non ergonomic rectangular device in general. It’s uncomfortable to use in most situations. For example I use my pinkie finger to support the weight of my device when I type. The weight of the iPhone 14 combined with a case is enough to leave a permanent impression in my pinkie from heavy use. A contoured case that considers how people actually hold their device would be nice. If we were to rethink all of it from the ground up I’m sure there is a better way. Maybe even a silicone soft phone would be a good start.
        danielvaughn 3y ago
        Oh I definitely agree. I'm waiting for the next SE to come out, I'll be buying it. The large form factor causes real strain in my wrists.
Yoofie 3y ago
The regulators are asleep at the wheel. Thats why Apple feels like they can get away with all of this.
- lxgr 3y ago
  I agree that this has dragged on for at least a few years too long, but I do have some sympathy for wanting to do this right. If a regulator comes up with an overreaching plan to open up the app markets and that law or ruling gets struck down by a court, it could cement the status quo even further.
MBCook 3y ago
They’re sort of trapped between a rock and a hard place. I don’t think what they’re doing is right, don’t take this as defense. On the one hand “services revenue” (their cut from casino/exploitive games) is basically the only thing growing. people who want iPhones have them. People who want iPads have them. The Vision Pro is never going to sell 1 billion units. Wall Street demand growth so they “have to“ keep finding ways to juice services revenue a bunch. Or the stock will get hammered. On the other hand, doing this is absolutely alienating every developer. And that will hurt the brand and their growth and their revenue too. You think there are as many developers who want to develop for the Vision Pro as there would have been if Apple was still as popular with devs as they were 10 years ago? But of course even if developers weren’t getting really mad they’ve gone so far as to get governments to start taking a deep look at them. And you know that’s not gonna go well. Juicing revenue makes developers and the governments more bad. Actions by the government or to be better for developers will make Wall Street mad. They mismanaged it and now they’re screwed. They could’ve been slowly cutting down and opening up this whole time. In small controlled ways they were willing to give up. In ways to let them keep the revenue growth but just slow it down a little. Instead they’ve got lawsuits. And governments forcing their hand.l to do things they hate and (in some cases) may be bad. And they’re being petulant about it all and going to get in even more trouble for defying courts/legislatures. All while hurting the brand. Good job Apple.
- foogazi 3y ago
  > On the other hand, doing this is absolutely alienating every developer. How did so many devs show up if the platform fees are alienating them ?
  - lxgr 3y ago
    In the same way that people are purchasing internet from horrible ISPs, shopping at overpriced supermarkets etc.: A lack of competition.
  - MBCook 3y ago
    The iPhone is too big to ignore. That’s where TONS of users are. But many ignore the iPad. Apple TV apps (outside of streaming video) ain’t doing great. How’s the Watch App Store these days? The Mac App Store is a runaway success right?

It’s like they want regulators to get involved. The arrogance is insane.

spacebacon 3y ago

It’s fun and games when you have that much cash.

danielvaughn 3y ago
Fun and games until a competitor arrives on the market with a solid developer experience. As soon as that happens, I’m dropping Apple like a bad habit. The only thing keeping me on their tech is my hatred for Android’s UX. Heck, if the Windows phone was still around, I’d probably be on that.
- spacebacon 3y ago
  I’ll be an early adopter right there with you.
- bmoxb 3y ago
  I'm not advocating in either direction, but I'm curious what elements of iOS's UX you prefer over Android's?
  - jwells89 3y ago
    For me a big part of it is how gestures track, the curves used by animations, inertia, bounciness, etc. Under iOS it all feels refined and naturalistic, whereas Android’s counterparts land somewhere in the uncanny valley and come off as more mechanical (fitting given its name, I suppose). Aside from that, in general you can feel more “seams” between components and rough edges all throughout Android’s UX. It reminds me of how the Linux desktop experience used to be several years ago actually, except Android seems to have gotten stuck for unknown reasons where Linux DEs have continually improved.
    - __MatrixMan__ 3y ago
      > you can feel more “seams” between components That's it. I've been struggling to figure out what I can't stand about iOS and it just clicked. It's the lack of seams. When something breaks I can never figure out what specifically broke, so I can't reason about my mistake (or know who to contact if it's not my mistake). I like seams so much that I'm running google play services in a sandbox (Graphene OS) so google has to grovel for my permission like everybody else whenever they want to do something. It's a little annoying, but it's teaching me where the seams are.
      - jwells89 3y ago
        It all depends on what one’s looking for I guess. As an aesthetically inclined technical person, seams can be annoying to the point of distraction if they’re not thoughtfully worked into the design (90% of the time, they’re not).
        __MatrixMan__ 3y ago
        Different strokes for different folks I guess. I don't care about aesthetics at all, I'm just wanting to know where I'd put the crowbar if I wanted to turn it into something else. The ideal technology for me is quietly doing is job somewhere I can't currently see and rarely have to look. Perhaps that counts as aesthetics?
  - danielvaughn 3y ago
    Probably the navigation I guess, though it's not something I've given much detailed thought into. I just know that whenever I pick up a friend's Android, I hate the experience.
    - spacebacon 3y ago
      I hate the experience of a non ergonomic rectangular device in general. It’s uncomfortable to use in most situations. For example I use my pinkie finger to support the weight of my device when I type. The weight of the iPhone 14 combined with a case is enough to leave a permanent impression in my pinkie from heavy use. A contoured case that considers how people actually hold their device would be nice. If we were to rethink all of it from the ground up I’m sure there is a better way. Maybe even a silicone soft phone would be a good start.
      - danielvaughn 3y ago
        Oh I definitely agree. I'm waiting for the next SE to come out, I'll be buying it. The large form factor causes real strain in my wrists.

Yoofie 3y ago

The regulators are asleep at the wheel. Thats why Apple feels like they can get away with all of this.

lxgr 3y ago
I agree that this has dragged on for at least a few years too long, but I do have some sympathy for wanting to do this right. If a regulator comes up with an overreaching plan to open up the app markets and that law or ruling gets struck down by a court, it could cement the status quo even further.

MBCook 3y ago

They’re sort of trapped between a rock and a hard place. I don’t think what they’re doing is right, don’t take this as defense. On the one hand “services revenue” (their cut from casino/exploitive games) is basically the only thing growing. people who want iPhones have them. People who want iPads have them. The Vision Pro is never going to sell 1 billion units. Wall Street demand growth so they “have to“ keep finding ways to juice services revenue a bunch. Or the stock will get hammered. On the other hand, doing this is absolutely alienating every developer. And that will hurt the brand and their growth and their revenue too. You think there are as many developers who want to develop for the Vision Pro as there would have been if Apple was still as popular with devs as they were 10 years ago? But of course even if developers weren’t getting really mad they’ve gone so far as to get governments to start taking a deep look at them. And you know that’s not gonna go well. Juicing revenue makes developers and the governments more bad. Actions by the government or to be better for developers will make Wall Street mad. They mismanaged it and now they’re screwed. They could’ve been slowly cutting down and opening up this whole time. In small controlled ways they were willing to give up. In ways to let them keep the revenue growth but just slow it down a little. Instead they’ve got lawsuits. And governments forcing their hand.l to do things they hate and (in some cases) may be bad. And they’re being petulant about it all and going to get in even more trouble for defying courts/legislatures. All while hurting the brand. Good job Apple.

foogazi 3y ago
> On the other hand, doing this is absolutely alienating every developer. How did so many devs show up if the platform fees are alienating them ?
- lxgr 3y ago
  In the same way that people are purchasing internet from horrible ISPs, shopping at overpriced supermarkets etc.: A lack of competition.
- MBCook 3y ago
  The iPhone is too big to ignore. That’s where TONS of users are. But many ignore the iPad. Apple TV apps (outside of streaming video) ain’t doing great. How’s the Watch App Store these days? The Mac App Store is a runaway success right?