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>the solar updraft tower also offers some potential for energy storage The pleasing part I'd hoped to read. I'm not intimate with the physics (in general) but
by ricardo81 3y ago
>the solar updraft tower also offers some potential for energy storage
The pleasing part I'd hoped to read.
I'm not intimate with the physics (in general) but am aware that overheating of traditional solar panels can be an issue affecting their efficiency. There are some hybrid variations of PVs (PVTs) that look to remove heat from the panels to increase their efficiency and then use the heat for hot water requirements. Maybe there's an interesting hybrid solution in that where the panels are doing their regular generation at the time of use, and the heat can be used at night time.
- sgerenser 3y agoMy understanding is “hybrid” solar panels, solar trackers, etc. have all basically become uneconomical with the massive drop in solar panel prices per watt. For any additional energy you could extract with these schemes, you can get more energy per dollar just by adding more panels. I suppose in cases where you are space limited something like this might still make sense.
- ricardo81 3y agoSounds about right otherwise PVTs would be far more mainstream. I think the point in that is that the energy requirement for hot water is a fraction of the demand for electricity. But perhaps with a system like this, the heat can be more useful when used as a battery and the sun isn't shining. As ever the LCOE wins, and whatever time of day the energy can be used at.
- detourdog 3y agoI think about this a lot and my conclusion is that is too narrow of view of what is happening. I think it makes sense to use Solar PV as a main source of energy. I also think it makes sense to use other forms of solar energy for a sense of redundency. I have an existing PV array that is nicely covering energy usage. I worry that I'm overly reliant on complex electronics and want to add Solar Thermal as a redundancy. The solar thermal is actually a whole separate system with the same dependency on sunlight but the human made bits can all be different.
- jeffbee 3y agoYou're worried that PV is complex so you want to add a thermal cycle? That doesn't begin to make sense. Thermal power plants are insanely complicated. PV is just semiconductors.
- nine_k 3y agoNot a solar thermal electric power generator, but solar thermal storage. It's just a hunk of matter, usually a water tank.
- pfdietz 3y agoIt'll be cheaper if you charge your thermal store using a PV driven heat pump, rather than try to collect the sunlight as heat directly.
- detourdog 3y agoMight be cheaper but I think you failed to understand the need for a redundant heating system. That is isn't wholly based on the complexity of PV. Secondly there is nothing preventing me from leveraging the cost savings of PV heat generation when available. I just want a parallel heating system that isn't reliant on PV solar generation. I thought I made that clear. I also would be able to use the system during the shoulder months where the efficiency of heat generation isn't an extreme need. Passive solar is simpler the Photo Voltaic solar and I believe there is a rich middle ground in balancing the 2.
- kamranjon 3y agoThat seems entirely dependent on available space.
- pfdietz 3y agoUtility scale PV does often use 1-axis trackers, particularly in the US southwest.
- usrusr 3y agoI wouldn't ever see limited space as a hypothetical, considering how human history is often just seen as a long sequence of territorial wars.
- hn_throwaway_99 3y agoTerritorial wars for productive land. The thing about solar is that it is often best located in land that is useless for other human purposes, and is often vast, like deserts.
- crote 3y agoWhen storage is the primary goal, something like the Crescent Dunes Solar Energy Project[0] might make more sense. Basically, bunch of mirrors shining onto a central tower where it heats up molten salt, which is then used to produce steam and run a generator. The key advantage here is that you can just store the hot molten salt in a tank and turn it into steam some time later. The thing is, PV has gotten so cheap that it might just turn out to be more economical to simply collect the sun with PV and heat the salt with essentially a huge resistor so the energy can be stored for later use. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crescent_Dunes_Solar_Energy_Project https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crescent_Dunes_Solar_Energy_Pr...
- pfdietz 3y agoThis technology is obsolete and uncompetitive now.
- usrusr 3y agoTrue, even with a resistor. And with a chain of heat pumps you'd get the same heat or more, and free cool on the other end of the cascade. Good sites for mirror-based solar tend to be places where coldness is quite valuable.