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DoorDash driver rages at customer who won't tip over $5 on pizza order
- itsnotafight 3y agoHow much responsibility does Square/Toast/whatever POS with integrated client facing tipping have for the recent change in culture? How much did they drive it vs. respond to demand? Does it matter? (Personally I don’t think they have any culpability per se, just interesting to think about the mechanisms at work).
- manuelabeledo 3y agoI wonder if they set the defaults themselves. But also, I've been to some places where the default choices start at 25% now, which I believe would be too bold for these PoS companies.
- bluedino 3y agoI only tip on traditionally tipped service. Barber, tattoo artist, barista, bartender, waitstaff, pizza delivery... I'm sure there are more but that's my usual. I'm not tipping the people at fast food or the other places that have started 'asking' for tips
- manuelabeledo 3y ago> Barber, tattoo artist... I don't understand tipping for these services. I would think that they make way more than minimum wage, especially tattoo artists. What's next? Tipping at the car shop?
- sokoloff 3y agoIt’s a personalized service in a way that car repair isn’t.
- manuelabeledo 3y agoI still don't understand where we are supposed to draw the line here. Is it OK to tip a therapist or a doctor?
- nickthegreek 3y agoGeneral rule to help you out: If you need a 4yr degree to do a job, you don’t get tips.
- manuelabeledo 3y agoPlus it has to be a "personalized" service, apparently? I was genuinely curious so I googled where I'm supposed to tip and how much. It seems like there are an awful lot of rules about tipping, and they don't follow a clear, consistent pattern, not even for when to do it, e.g. before or after receiving a service. So much work to keep an outdated tradition alive.
- Ekaros 3y agoWhat about police officer at traffic stop? Or judge or prosecutor prosecuting you? Aren't those also pretty personalized services? Why are they different?
- Beldin 3y agoTipping them could be misconstrued as bribery.
- Ekaros 3y agoWhat I really don't understand about these two is that they get to set the rate very often. They are independent and thus should be able to set rate where they do not need tips. It is like being consultant setting hourly rate and then expect still getting some extra...
- addicted 3y agoI love how DoorDash created an adversarial system where it’s figured out how to earn billions of dollars for itself while ripping off both the consumer and the worker, and when they find that they’re screwed they fight each other instead of DoorDash which is quite literally siphoning off billions from both of them. This isn’t limited to DoorDash of course. This is the crux of the gig economy. The ability to steal money by making yourself a middleman.
- paulgb 3y agoAnd yet DoorDash itself is losing hundreds of millions per year[1]! It's quite remarkable how the gig economy has taken two-sided markets where both sides were reasonably happy and turned them into three-sided markets where nobody is happy. [1] https://www.sec.gov/ix?doc=/Archives/edgar/data/1792789/000162828023035973/dash-20230930.htm#i696a47a8308e4ede884459265f14c93d_25 https://www.sec.gov/ix?doc=/Archives/edgar/data/1792789/0001...
- oefrha 3y agoI’m sure the executives and employees collecting fat paychecks and stock grants are happy enough. The company losing hundreds of millions per year doesn’t really affect them.
- Laaas 3y agoWhen was it two-sided?
- paulgb 3y agoWhen it was just the customer phoning the restaurant and making an order.
- Solvency 3y agoWhat I don't get is... why do businesses use it? My local podunk pizza joint uses this insanely basic, yet fully sufficient service called "weborder.net". Feels like it's straight out of the movie The Net. There are NO added fees. It accepts every card type. It emails you confirmations and notifications. Everything i'd want from a "modern" delivery experience. It seems like there are no shortage of alternatives to DD.
- redm 3y agoIn my experience, tipping culture first started to change with Starbucks, but it really seemed to accelerate with integrated tips in terminals like square and point of sale devices. In short, when the checkout terminal asks you to round up your change for a donation to help kids, and the cashier is looking at you, nobody wants to feel like the jerk that says no.
- deepGem 3y agoI have no issues saying no to all of these, at the expense of being called a jerk. I am not tipping someone to do a job that they were supposed to do in the first place, especially in a high tax regimes. You may ask what has taxation got to do with tipping ? Well in a welfare state, the employees are supposed to be paid a moderate wage in accordance with living wages and inflation. I suppose some portion of the 50%+ tax the government rips off from me goes to this. Am not shelling out a tip on top of this. In low tax regimes, there is an argument to be made for 15-25% tipping but even that doesn't stand true in current climate. The government has intervened and increased minimum wages everywhere. So unless there is some balance, tipping beyond a certain limit is economically illogical and overrated.
- itsoktocry 3y ago>I have no issues saying no to all of these, at the expense of being called a jerk. It's less about being called a jerk, and more about the fact that these are repeated games you're playing with the people who now expect these tips. Someone calling you a jerk is minor; someone acting on the fact they think you're a jerk is another. Best case you get poor service, worst case, who knows...
- fodkodrasz 3y agoIts okay to boycott services where tipping is expected instead of giving a fair pay to the employees. Upfront tipping is especially a red flag for me.
- dgeiser13 3y agoIt's not a game if the answer is always No. Just always say No.
- Almondsetat 3y agoTo me tipping gives the vibes of that Ebay trick of selling something worth $100 by splitting it into a $20 price + $80 shipment to reduce fees or something. In this case they are offloading all the responsibility of a fair wage directly onto the customer and not indirectly through the food delivery company.
- 303uru 3y agoAbsolutely that’s what’s happening and is happening in person at restaurants too. Tips in the US do not signify that you enjoyed the service or food, you’re simply shoring up their pathetic tipped rate minimum wage. That’s frustrating enough, but then DoorDash keeps “tipping” optional but bakes all their bullshit fees right into the price. They ballon the price to a point where a single person is suddenly paying $30 for a chipotle burrito and they get to the tip screen and balk at adding more to that total.
- oh_sigh 3y agoI think the more important factor is that with doordash you tip before the services received, instead of after. At least at a restaurant if you receive absolutely horrible service you can cut the tip you were going to leave.
- minimalist 3y agoAFAIK, ebay charges fees on the subtotal including shipping. So if that practice still exists, it must be 1. out of habit or, 2. to make the prices appear cheaper (shipping costs aren't displayed as prominently, but at least sorting by price includes shipping). I think the real reason why tipping is now pushed everywhere, including POS terminals and even online payment portals is because the payment vendor receives a cut of the entire transaction (inclusive of tip). So adding anything onto the transaction total is more money in the pocket of the payment processor. I'm not sure what a non-legislative way to push back against this practice, since the incentives are clearly stacked to favor what we see today.
- junaru 3y agoTipping should be illegal.
- micromacrofoot 3y agothen you’d be paying the full tip every time to ensure fair wages
- manuelabeledo 3y agoThat would arguably be better.
- ajdude 3y agoIsn't this how it works outside the United States? Strangely enough, food seems cheaper in Europe than in the US.
- micromacrofoot 3y agoYes, but I'd argue that some food prices in the US (especially fast food and some lower end restaurants that lower classes frequent) have been artificially low in the US for decades and it has created unrealistic expectations. Honestly there are some categories of restaurant in the US that probably shouldn't exist as widely as they do... but this is not what people want to hear.
- r0ckarong 3y agoThat's not how this works at all. How do you get someone to do the full job if you always take their slack?
- micromacrofoot 3y agoI'm not sure where you're located, but in my corner of the US it's impossible to get someone to do the full job at server wages at lower end restaurants because the tips are never good enough anyway. You think paying people more is going to reduce their output at Waffle House?
- micromacrofoot 3y agoDoorDash is a scourge just like Uber before it. This isn’t the driver or customer’s fault, it’s theirs. Stop using the gig economy if you can.
- itsoktocry 3y agoHow about a little accountability? It's 100% the driver's fault: >The video itself shows the delivery person handing her the pizza, which text across the screen clarifies was a $20 pie. “I just want to say, it’s a nice house for a $5 tip,” the man replies as he walks away. “Thank you,” Purciful replied as the delivery person chimed in again saying, “F.. you.” Imagine having that level of entitlement.
- micromacrofoot 3y agoYeah imagine wanting to make a living wage
- sokoloff 3y agoUber is less of a scourge than the medallioned taxi shitshow was before Uber arrived on the scene.
- manuelabeledo 3y agoI would argue that Uber increased wealth concentration, which is even less ideal.
- micromacrofoot 3y agoNeither are good. Uber didn't fix medallions, they just ate the (formerly regional) market themselves while continuing to abuse the not-actually-employees in different ways. In fact, Uber introduced this phenomenon into markets where it didn't even exist previously.
- bluedino 3y agoI guess I just never "got" why ordinary people want to use meal delivery. Aside from things that have typically been delivered, like pizza and Chinese, it just seems odd. Who wants to eat fast food that's been sitting for a half an hour? Even sit down food. Most of it doesn't travel well (soggy fries or bread), which is one area where pizza or Americanized Chinese takeout doesn't suffer. And then the cost. A McDonalds meal is $10 as it is so you're going to add a couple more bucks for the convenience of not having to get it, plus a tip to the delivery person? Sure, I can understand the spending $20 to not have to take a lunch or to stay later at work and eating dinner there. But for the most part it's ridiculous. I mean there's even a delivery order station at the 7-11. Who's getting a Slurpee delivered? The local neighborhood Facebook group is full of drivers bitching about not enough jobs to go around, poor tipping, not making enough on their routes... and then you have the people ordering food and complaining about slow service, stolen, incorrect, or missing orders, and whatever else can go wrong.
- cassepipe 3y agoI think this is because a lot of people don't have basic food preparation skills. Basic stuff takes them hours, they are poorly equipped and would generally go out for food even though they'd rather stay at home. Meal delivery solves that equation for them : Now they can eat their overpriced low grade food from the comfort of their home and for some people, it seems that it is something worth paying for. This is how my roommate says he does not have money for the shared internet bill but often wastes from 10 to 15 euros for poor quality food :D There are also maybe structural reasons ? I am thinking it may be aggravated if you live in a American city and you need to take your car out to the business/fast food zone in order to get prepared food. I guess from that point of view, you're thinking that at least you are saving on gas/parking ?
- nunez 3y agoI was that person. I hated cooking because every meal I could find that looked interesting (I.e. more than basic staples) took forever to make (>2 hours) and left a ton of leftovers that I wasn't guaranteed to eat (because shopping for a single person or, now, two people sans kids, is time-consuming). Every Plate, followed by Blue Apron, changed that entirely for me. I'm so glad that my wife suggested this idea. (She also suggested we get an Echo when they were beta. It was an incredibly left field suggestion from her since she's not into tech, really. Now we have one in almost every room of the house!) Every meal they send takes less than an hour, doesn't require any advanced culinary skills (or ingredients, even; they send almost everything you need), and always come out insanely good. I've had meals at highly-rated restaurants on guides like Eater that rivaled Blue Apron meals we cooked. I still love going out to eat and, by default, will do that. But I don't mind cooking anymore. Sometimes I even enjoy it. That's a huge 360 from where I was five years ago. Sorry if this reads like an ad; I promise it isn't.
- sokoloff 3y agoIf you, as the driver, think a customer should tip 50% on a $20 pizza order, I’d recommend you not take up work in a role where pricing decisions are part of your responsibility. People aren’t going to start tipping $10 for a $20 pizza, no matter how hard you wish for it.
- the_snooze 3y agoI just want honest up-front pricing, where the advertised price is exactly what you end up paying. If only we had the technology for that.
- ajdude 3y agoRecently I ended up subscribing to Walmart+, because I was planning on taking advantage of having groceries shipped to my house. When I went to actually order the groceries though, Walmart informed me that I should be tipping my driver who is actually delivering the groceries. I gave a 20% tip except they delivered it to the wrong address and I ended up on the phone with Walmart for about 40 minutes to get everything refunded anyway.
- nickthegreek 3y agoKroger has tip free delivery for $60 a year and I love it.