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Many such cases. When you take a serious postmodern look at classic Marxist and Anarchist theories you begin to see the hidden assumptions they sneak in, and it

Many such cases. When you take a serious postmodern look at classic Marxist and Anarchist theories you begin to see the hidden assumptions they sneak in, and it becomes philosophically untenable. That's why sincere lefties/anarchists mature into left-liberals, and you don't see people like Foucault, Chomsky, or Zizek calling for revolution.

Daishiman 3y ago
Can you elaborate this? It sounds interesting.
swed420 3y ago
You speak as if capitalism isn't overflowing with its own increasingly untenable contradictions.
- zeroCalories 3y ago
  No I don't. The realization that Marxist and Anarchist philosophies are stupid leaves people wondering how they can actually help others instead of wanking over their ideology. Many people from the Occupy era have come to realize that their movement was a huge waste of time because it focused all of its energy in vague directions with meaningless slogans. I don't know Graeber's work well, but I get the impression that he feels the same.
  - TotalCrackpot 3y ago
    You have no idea what you are talking about, because you do indeed create anarchism through creation of mutual aid networks like for example Food Not Bombs.
    - panick21_ 3y ago
      > you do indeed create anarchism through creation of mutual aid networks #Theoretically
  - swed420 3y ago
    > The realization that Marxist and Anarchist philosophies are stupid leaves people wondering how they can actually help others instead of wanking over their ideology Speak for yourself. That's a terminally online response, and lumping those two things with such a wide sweeping conclusion is meaningless. Marxism contains many parts and includes timeless methods like dialectical materialism which can be used as a framework for direct action. > Many people from the Occupy era have come to realize that their movement was a huge waste of time because it focused all of its energy in vague directions with meaningless slogans Nobody worth taking seriously would expect fully automated luxury space communism to unfold the second some disenfranchised people gather in a park, or by backing somebody like Bernie for president. Capital would never let itself lose its dominating power that easily. But the very acts of these gatherings and the energy it carries forward is not insignificant, and something is collectively learned at each turn for those tuned in. And as things continue to fall apart, more people tune in.
TotalCrackpot 3y ago
Chomsky is advocating for libertarian socialism, so he is calling for revolution. You probably don't even understand that you don't create libertarian socialism revolution through a coup, even though that's elementary knowledge. You prefigure libertarian socialism, which means you create here and know a network of parallel horizontal institutions that work according to libertarian socialism ideas, and this network is supposed to put up a fight against a current system, the bigger it is the more intense is the fights. That means that the libsoc revolution is actually happening at this moment all over the world, because almost everywhere you can find some libertarian socialist counter-institutions.
- zeroCalories 3y ago
  Liberalism socialism as you describe has been a dead project for decades.

Daishiman 3y ago

Can you elaborate this? It sounds interesting.

swed420 3y ago

You speak as if capitalism isn't overflowing with its own increasingly untenable contradictions.

zeroCalories 3y ago
No I don't. The realization that Marxist and Anarchist philosophies are stupid leaves people wondering how they can actually help others instead of wanking over their ideology. Many people from the Occupy era have come to realize that their movement was a huge waste of time because it focused all of its energy in vague directions with meaningless slogans. I don't know Graeber's work well, but I get the impression that he feels the same.
- TotalCrackpot 3y ago
  You have no idea what you are talking about, because you do indeed create anarchism through creation of mutual aid networks like for example Food Not Bombs.
  - panick21_ 3y ago
    > you do indeed create anarchism through creation of mutual aid networks #Theoretically
- swed420 3y ago
  > The realization that Marxist and Anarchist philosophies are stupid leaves people wondering how they can actually help others instead of wanking over their ideology Speak for yourself. That's a terminally online response, and lumping those two things with such a wide sweeping conclusion is meaningless. Marxism contains many parts and includes timeless methods like dialectical materialism which can be used as a framework for direct action. > Many people from the Occupy era have come to realize that their movement was a huge waste of time because it focused all of its energy in vague directions with meaningless slogans Nobody worth taking seriously would expect fully automated luxury space communism to unfold the second some disenfranchised people gather in a park, or by backing somebody like Bernie for president. Capital would never let itself lose its dominating power that easily. But the very acts of these gatherings and the energy it carries forward is not insignificant, and something is collectively learned at each turn for those tuned in. And as things continue to fall apart, more people tune in.

TotalCrackpot 3y ago

Chomsky is advocating for libertarian socialism, so he is calling for revolution. You probably don't even understand that you don't create libertarian socialism revolution through a coup, even though that's elementary knowledge. You prefigure libertarian socialism, which means you create here and know a network of parallel horizontal institutions that work according to libertarian socialism ideas, and this network is supposed to put up a fight against a current system, the bigger it is the more intense is the fights. That means that the libsoc revolution is actually happening at this moment all over the world, because almost everywhere you can find some libertarian socialist counter-institutions.

zeroCalories 3y ago
Liberalism socialism as you describe has been a dead project for decades.