6 ms·

How do you do annotation? And how do you know you can read the document decades into the future? Also, for longer texts, isn't it harder to read without the hig

How do you do annotation? And how do you know you can read the document decades into the future? Also, for longer texts, isn't it harder to read without the high-quality readability enhancements, such as typefaces, layouts, etc.?

soco 3y ago
Not everybody does annotations. Me or my family don't and I just asked my team mates, they don't either. Actually we are totally fine with viewing PDFs in the browser and that for sure speaks in favor of a HTML-based alternative. I'm pretty sure I could still open old saved HTML pages, but I don't have any to test right now. And we do have headings in HTML, right.
- wolverine876 3y ago
  What do you conclude? You and your circle don't use annotations, and therefore the world doesn't need them? I hope you guys like Szechuan food, because otherwise there are going to be a lot of unhappy people. Also, you're missing out.
Evidlo 3y ago
The PDF spec supports annotations. Handwritten, text, images, etc.
- wolverine876 3y ago
  Yes, I meant, how is that done in HTML.
crabmusket 3y ago
I assume you're asking these questions about HTML, right? As compared to the assumed good answers PDF has to these questions? > How do you do annotation? Same as PDF - if you want that, get an app that has that feature. > And how do you know you can read the document decades into the future? Same as PDF, except that HTML is a simpler format. > Also, for longer texts, isn't it harder to read without the high-quality readability enhancements, such as typefaces, layouts, etc.? HTML has all these things? (With CSS, I mean.)
- wolverine876 3y ago
  >> How do you do annotation? > Same as PDF - if you want that, get an app that has that feature. In PDFs, annotation is a well-established part of the specification. I know my annotations on whatever app I use today will be fully functional in any app, on any colleagues or my computers, decades into the future. I could send you an annotated PDF document now and you could read it, annotate it yourself, and send it back. >> And how do you know you can read the document decades into the future? > Same as PDF, except that HTML is a simpler format. PDF's spec prioritizes long-term preservation (or whatever term they use), especially in PDF/A format. HTML does not. >> Also, for longer texts, isn't it harder to read without the high-quality readability enhancements, such as typefaces, layouts, etc.? > HTML has all these things? (With CSS, I mean.) PDFs look much better to me than HTML. I don't think HTML capabilities are on the same level, but I don't know the technical underpinnings of layout well enough to specify why. I know precise layout in HTML can be a challenge.
  - crabmusket 3y ago
    These are great points. When I invent my PDF successor based on HTML I'll have to make sure I have good answers! (I'm being sincere, even if I think the chances of my making such a thing, and it being any kind of successful, are slim). Thanks for helping me understand your perspective!
  - cxr 3y ago
    > PDF's spec prioritizes long-term preservation (or whatever term they use), especially in PDF/A format. HTML does not. Uh, okay. HTML is a dead simple plain text format that has been around for 30+ years. PDF hasn't been a well-supported open standard for half that. And it's no less complex now than it was in 2008, so good luck implementing a PDF reader on your own. In contrast, a mediocre programmer can hack something together that would make the contents of a given file in archive-quality HTML accessible within an afternoon. (Hell, you don't even need a programming system for it—any monkey with some patience could do it by hand, using a text editor while working on a copy of the raw contents of the file.)
    - 3y ago

soco 3y ago

Not everybody does annotations. Me or my family don't and I just asked my team mates, they don't either. Actually we are totally fine with viewing PDFs in the browser and that for sure speaks in favor of a HTML-based alternative. I'm pretty sure I could still open old saved HTML pages, but I don't have any to test right now. And we do have headings in HTML, right.

wolverine876 3y ago
What do you conclude? You and your circle don't use annotations, and therefore the world doesn't need them? I hope you guys like Szechuan food, because otherwise there are going to be a lot of unhappy people. Also, you're missing out.

Evidlo 3y ago

The PDF spec supports annotations. Handwritten, text, images, etc.

wolverine876 3y ago
Yes, I meant, how is that done in HTML.

crabmusket 3y ago

I assume you're asking these questions about HTML, right? As compared to the assumed good answers PDF has to these questions? > How do you do annotation? Same as PDF - if you want that, get an app that has that feature. > And how do you know you can read the document decades into the future? Same as PDF, except that HTML is a simpler format. > Also, for longer texts, isn't it harder to read without the high-quality readability enhancements, such as typefaces, layouts, etc.? HTML has all these things? (With CSS, I mean.)

wolverine876 3y ago
>> How do you do annotation? > Same as PDF - if you want that, get an app that has that feature. In PDFs, annotation is a well-established part of the specification. I know my annotations on whatever app I use today will be fully functional in any app, on any colleagues or my computers, decades into the future. I could send you an annotated PDF document now and you could read it, annotate it yourself, and send it back. >> And how do you know you can read the document decades into the future? > Same as PDF, except that HTML is a simpler format. PDF's spec prioritizes long-term preservation (or whatever term they use), especially in PDF/A format. HTML does not. >> Also, for longer texts, isn't it harder to read without the high-quality readability enhancements, such as typefaces, layouts, etc.? > HTML has all these things? (With CSS, I mean.) PDFs look much better to me than HTML. I don't think HTML capabilities are on the same level, but I don't know the technical underpinnings of layout well enough to specify why. I know precise layout in HTML can be a challenge.
- crabmusket 3y ago
  These are great points. When I invent my PDF successor based on HTML I'll have to make sure I have good answers! (I'm being sincere, even if I think the chances of my making such a thing, and it being any kind of successful, are slim). Thanks for helping me understand your perspective!
- cxr 3y ago
  > PDF's spec prioritizes long-term preservation (or whatever term they use), especially in PDF/A format. HTML does not. Uh, okay. HTML is a dead simple plain text format that has been around for 30+ years. PDF hasn't been a well-supported open standard for half that. And it's no less complex now than it was in 2008, so good luck implementing a PDF reader on your own. In contrast, a mediocre programmer can hack something together that would make the contents of a given file in archive-quality HTML accessible within an afternoon. (Hell, you don't even need a programming system for it—any monkey with some patience could do it by hand, using a text editor while working on a copy of the raw contents of the file.)
  - 3y ago