3 ms·

"That might be more a result of capitalist motivations" People wanting to get more stuff faster is a universal motivation not limited (in theory or in practice

"That might be more a result of capitalist motivations" People wanting to get more stuff faster is a universal motivation not limited (in theory or in practice) to capitalism. To the extent that anyone is exploited, that's just selfishness, again a universal motivation.

bwestergard 3y ago
Can you provide a few examples of people expressing a general desire for "more stuff faster" before 1500 and outside Western Europe?
- bee_rider 3y ago
  I mean the copper ingot guy was sort of complaining that he hadn’t gotten enough (good) copper ingots and that his couriers had had to make multiple trips and had come back empty handed each time. This isn’t exactly “more stuff faster,” but it is pretty close.
- cariaso 3y ago
  sure here’s one. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isis_(ship) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isis_(ship) As part of the https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cura_Annonae https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cura_Annonae
  - pbhjpbhj 3y ago
    The free-gratis supply of bread; as a daily life-preserving staple; to a portion of the population doesn't appear to match the spirit of "more stuff faster". Surely basic food supply is "the bare minimum of stuff" and the rate is fixed to 'each day' (and the delivery to grain stores is 'each harvest in the supplying region'? Yes, it's more as populations grow and centralise, but that appears to be occurring the context of the question, no?
    - cariaso 3y ago
      my point was not about the existence of a bread ration it was about the drive for ever bigger boats to haul ever more capacity.
- TapWaterBandit 3y ago
  This is a bizarre framing to support the argument people don't like faster delivery of goods. But in the spirit of good faith I will give some: - Movement of fish/meat to markets before it spoils - Delivery of military messages around the battlefield. Also supply trains for military expeditions - Projects like the Grand Canal in China (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Canal_(China) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Canal_(China)). Pretty much anywhere in history where people opted for using water transport of goods over land transport was done for speed/cost reasons.

bwestergard 3y ago

Can you provide a few examples of people expressing a general desire for "more stuff faster" before 1500 and outside Western Europe?

bee_rider 3y ago
I mean the copper ingot guy was sort of complaining that he hadn’t gotten enough (good) copper ingots and that his couriers had had to make multiple trips and had come back empty handed each time. This isn’t exactly “more stuff faster,” but it is pretty close.
cariaso 3y ago
sure here’s one. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isis_(ship) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isis_(ship) As part of the https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cura_Annonae https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cura_Annonae
- pbhjpbhj 3y ago
  The free-gratis supply of bread; as a daily life-preserving staple; to a portion of the population doesn't appear to match the spirit of "more stuff faster". Surely basic food supply is "the bare minimum of stuff" and the rate is fixed to 'each day' (and the delivery to grain stores is 'each harvest in the supplying region'? Yes, it's more as populations grow and centralise, but that appears to be occurring the context of the question, no?
  - cariaso 3y ago
    my point was not about the existence of a bread ration it was about the drive for ever bigger boats to haul ever more capacity.
TapWaterBandit 3y ago
This is a bizarre framing to support the argument people don't like faster delivery of goods. But in the spirit of good faith I will give some: - Movement of fish/meat to markets before it spoils - Delivery of military messages around the battlefield. Also supply trains for military expeditions - Projects like the Grand Canal in China (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Canal_(China) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Canal_(China)). Pretty much anywhere in history where people opted for using water transport of goods over land transport was done for speed/cost reasons.