9 ms·

These work with phones though, not _satellite_ phones.

paxys 3y ago
The first satellite 5G call between regular phones was made a couple of years ago by AST. There are plenty of companies already in this space.
- 0xfae 3y ago
  If you've used old style satellite internet and then used starlink, you'll know that this is not the same technology. Starlink has latency and bandwidth that doesn't even compare to the companies and satellites you are mentioning. This is a tech and nerd forum. Let us be excited about new technology.
  - vel0city 3y ago
    > If you've used old style satellite internet AST's satellite wasn't "old style satellite internet". It was at an altitude of 513km. That's roughly the same altitude as SpaceX's satellites (~550km). AST's satellite was absolutely "new technology", last September. SpaceX was beat for the "first phone service satellites", even for low orbit 5G satellites with unmodified phones. https://ast-science.com/2023/09/19/ast-spacemobile-achieves-space-based-5g-cellular-broadband-connectivity-from-everyday-smartphones-another-historic-world-first/ https://ast-science.com/2023/09/19/ast-spacemobile-achieves-...
    - pkaye 3y ago
      How many satellites does it have up in space?
      - newsclues 3y ago
        No operational ones for customers. Those are scheduled to launch this year
      - ben_w 3y ago
        So far as I can tell, two prototypes, and they're waiting on licensing for a few hundred more to become operational.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - Dylan16807 3y ago
      I wish everything wouldn't be referred to as just "5G". Looks like they used 800MHz, so basically the longest range cell phone bands. Which is about as expected, none of that super-fragile millimeter wave stuff. SpaceX is using 1900MHz, which will make a difference but probably not a huge difference.
      - wmf 3y ago
        5G NR can run on any band; it's not specific to mmwave.
        Dylan16807 3y ago
        I know. But 90% of articles call specific arbitrary subsets "5G" and it gets annoying to have the details skipped. By 5G does an article mean the incremental improvements, the expansion in mid-range frequencies, or the mmwave stuff? It's a crapshoot. Let alone more subtle but important information like whether it's 5G in both directions.
    - belltaco 3y ago
      That doesn't sound like two years ago.
  - paxys 3y ago
    5G is "old style satellite internet" how?
  - JumpinJack_Cash 3y ago
    > > This is a tech and nerd forum. Let us be excited about new technology. It's the same old re-inventing the wheel with Musk cult of personality marketing slapped on top of it. New thing of the 2020s is the mRNA vaccine which solved a big problem, people took it and then endlessly bitched about it while mirin and salivating at the Tesla cybertruck or the 300k Tesla Roadster which will never enter into production. It doesn't pay to build stuff and innovate nowadays, it's more about conning people into thinking that some stuff will be built sometime in the future™ and it will be revolutionary, and then move the goalposts perpetually into the future™
    - mardifoufs 3y ago
      Are you saying SpaceX isn't innovating? This has nothing to do with musk by the way, one can say that SpaceX is impressive and innovative while also disliking musk.
      - xeromal 3y ago
        Everything requires a political stance now.
      - JumpinJack_Cash 3y ago
        > > Are you saying SpaceX isn't innovating? Innovation serves as a means to an end, like for example mRNA vaccines solved a big problem like COVID. SpaceX doesn't solve any problem, 90% of the global population lives in urban areas, they connect to the internet using cell towers propagating 3/4/5G and good old fiber or fiber+copper The remaining 10% is too poor so they cannot afford it, and they are also unskilled so if they want a shot a decent life they'd have to move to cities too where they can start as manual laborers and slowly climb the social ladder, they'd have to do it either independently or thanks to help from NGOs, UNICEF, UN, Doctors without borders etc. To put it bluntly fast internet is the last of their necessities. SpaceX is textbook SV self dealing and wealth isolation where a bunch of assholes (led by the Chief Asshole of SV) who want to play with rockets and get paid for it , so they try to retroactively find a pitch to sell to VCs and asset managers to finance their play time and they do so by pitching them stuff like: "Internet on your 10M sailboat" or "Internet on your 2M Luxury RV" And of course they get billions because VCs are also loaded and so they painted themselves so much in the corner with their wealth that the only thing that makes them enthusiastic is thin marginal improvement to trophy assets like a 10M sailboat or a 2M luxury RV, stuff that is totally uncorrelated with what regular consumers want or what the economy at large needs.
- konschubert 3y ago
  Cool, if this is a solved problem, then why can’t I make a satellite 5G call with my phone right now?
- modeless 3y ago
  ... as a tech demo, with a single satellite in orbit, and it was actually less than a year ago. They haven't yet launched any more satellites and neither has anyone else. A commercial service will require dozens up to thousands of satellites. SpaceX just multiplied the number of satellites capable of this in orbit by 7. Why is everyone trying so hard to shit on this? It's going to be awesome when we have truly global commercial cellular coverage that works with unmodified existing phones. SpaceX is almost certainly going to be the first to get there, but I hope many competitors get there soon after.
  - imbusy111 3y ago
    > Why is everyone trying so hard to shit on this? I think it's obvious, but I'll explain anyway, cause I have little better to do at the moment: 1) cause the headline is sensationalist and isn't true, 2) above is multiplied by dislike for Musk, cause SpaceX is positioned as Musk & pals.
    - mbrumlow 3y ago
      #1 only happens if you have #2.
    - modeless 3y ago
      Yeah, the question was rhetorical. We all know why, sadly.
hn_throwaway_99 3y ago
That's the thing that wasn't clear to me. Do these work with any old 5G phone, or does it need special hardware? E.g. the satellite functionality in the latest iPhones is essentially "emergency only", and it requires a bit of a song and dance to make sure you have visible sky and a direct line of sight to the satellite. The article seems to imply this would be different, and would (eventually) feel just like expanded cell coverage. So curious how this would work.
- cloudwalking 3y ago
  Allegedly it's LTE and higher bandwidth than the Apple solution, although still relatively low bandwidth. Enough to text and call but not browse. LTE, text only, with voice and browsing coming supposedly in 2025 https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2024/01/spacex-launches-first-starlink-satellites-that-will-work-with-t-mobile-phones/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2024/01/spacex-launches-...
  - summarity 3y ago
    Being able to call is still a major improvement for small handhelds. My current Iridium device (in reach 2) usually still takes minutes to send messages even under a clear sky (and does so out of order).

The first satellite 5G call between regular phones was made a couple of years ago by AST. There are plenty of companies already in this space.

0xfae 3y ago
If you've used old style satellite internet and then used starlink, you'll know that this is not the same technology. Starlink has latency and bandwidth that doesn't even compare to the companies and satellites you are mentioning. This is a tech and nerd forum. Let us be excited about new technology.
- vel0city 3y ago
  > If you've used old style satellite internet AST's satellite wasn't "old style satellite internet". It was at an altitude of 513km. That's roughly the same altitude as SpaceX's satellites (~550km). AST's satellite was absolutely "new technology", last September. SpaceX was beat for the "first phone service satellites", even for low orbit 5G satellites with unmodified phones. https://ast-science.com/2023/09/19/ast-spacemobile-achieves-space-based-5g-cellular-broadband-connectivity-from-everyday-smartphones-another-historic-world-first/ https://ast-science.com/2023/09/19/ast-spacemobile-achieves-...
  - pkaye 3y ago
    How many satellites does it have up in space?
    - newsclues 3y ago
      No operational ones for customers. Those are scheduled to launch this year
    - ben_w 3y ago
      So far as I can tell, two prototypes, and they're waiting on licensing for a few hundred more to become operational.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - Dylan16807 3y ago
    I wish everything wouldn't be referred to as just "5G". Looks like they used 800MHz, so basically the longest range cell phone bands. Which is about as expected, none of that super-fragile millimeter wave stuff. SpaceX is using 1900MHz, which will make a difference but probably not a huge difference.
    - wmf 3y ago
      5G NR can run on any band; it's not specific to mmwave.
      - Dylan16807 3y ago
        I know. But 90% of articles call specific arbitrary subsets "5G" and it gets annoying to have the details skipped. By 5G does an article mean the incremental improvements, the expansion in mid-range frequencies, or the mmwave stuff? It's a crapshoot. Let alone more subtle but important information like whether it's 5G in both directions.
  - belltaco 3y ago
    That doesn't sound like two years ago.
- paxys 3y ago
  5G is "old style satellite internet" how?
- JumpinJack_Cash 3y ago
  > > This is a tech and nerd forum. Let us be excited about new technology. It's the same old re-inventing the wheel with Musk cult of personality marketing slapped on top of it. New thing of the 2020s is the mRNA vaccine which solved a big problem, people took it and then endlessly bitched about it while mirin and salivating at the Tesla cybertruck or the 300k Tesla Roadster which will never enter into production. It doesn't pay to build stuff and innovate nowadays, it's more about conning people into thinking that some stuff will be built sometime in the future™ and it will be revolutionary, and then move the goalposts perpetually into the future™
  - mardifoufs 3y ago
    Are you saying SpaceX isn't innovating? This has nothing to do with musk by the way, one can say that SpaceX is impressive and innovative while also disliking musk.
    - xeromal 3y ago
      Everything requires a political stance now.
    - JumpinJack_Cash 3y ago
      > > Are you saying SpaceX isn't innovating? Innovation serves as a means to an end, like for example mRNA vaccines solved a big problem like COVID. SpaceX doesn't solve any problem, 90% of the global population lives in urban areas, they connect to the internet using cell towers propagating 3/4/5G and good old fiber or fiber+copper The remaining 10% is too poor so they cannot afford it, and they are also unskilled so if they want a shot a decent life they'd have to move to cities too where they can start as manual laborers and slowly climb the social ladder, they'd have to do it either independently or thanks to help from NGOs, UNICEF, UN, Doctors without borders etc. To put it bluntly fast internet is the last of their necessities. SpaceX is textbook SV self dealing and wealth isolation where a bunch of assholes (led by the Chief Asshole of SV) who want to play with rockets and get paid for it , so they try to retroactively find a pitch to sell to VCs and asset managers to finance their play time and they do so by pitching them stuff like: "Internet on your 10M sailboat" or "Internet on your 2M Luxury RV" And of course they get billions because VCs are also loaded and so they painted themselves so much in the corner with their wealth that the only thing that makes them enthusiastic is thin marginal improvement to trophy assets like a 10M sailboat or a 2M luxury RV, stuff that is totally uncorrelated with what regular consumers want or what the economy at large needs.
konschubert 3y ago
Cool, if this is a solved problem, then why can’t I make a satellite 5G call with my phone right now?
modeless 3y ago
... as a tech demo, with a single satellite in orbit, and it was actually less than a year ago. They haven't yet launched any more satellites and neither has anyone else. A commercial service will require dozens up to thousands of satellites. SpaceX just multiplied the number of satellites capable of this in orbit by 7. Why is everyone trying so hard to shit on this? It's going to be awesome when we have truly global commercial cellular coverage that works with unmodified existing phones. SpaceX is almost certainly going to be the first to get there, but I hope many competitors get there soon after.
- imbusy111 3y ago
  > Why is everyone trying so hard to shit on this? I think it's obvious, but I'll explain anyway, cause I have little better to do at the moment: 1) cause the headline is sensationalist and isn't true, 2) above is multiplied by dislike for Musk, cause SpaceX is positioned as Musk & pals.
  - mbrumlow 3y ago
    #1 only happens if you have #2.
  - modeless 3y ago
    Yeah, the question was rhetorical. We all know why, sadly.

hn_throwaway_99 3y ago

That's the thing that wasn't clear to me. Do these work with any old 5G phone, or does it need special hardware? E.g. the satellite functionality in the latest iPhones is essentially "emergency only", and it requires a bit of a song and dance to make sure you have visible sky and a direct line of sight to the satellite. The article seems to imply this would be different, and would (eventually) feel just like expanded cell coverage. So curious how this would work.

cloudwalking 3y ago
Allegedly it's LTE and higher bandwidth than the Apple solution, although still relatively low bandwidth. Enough to text and call but not browse. LTE, text only, with voice and browsing coming supposedly in 2025 https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2024/01/spacex-launches-first-starlink-satellites-that-will-work-with-t-mobile-phones/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2024/01/spacex-launches-...
- summarity 3y ago
  Being able to call is still a major improvement for small handhelds. My current Iridium device (in reach 2) usually still takes minutes to send messages even under a clear sky (and does so out of order).