4 ms·

Ex-Trump fixer Michael Cohen says AI created fake cases in court filing

19 points by webmaven 3y ago

teo_zero 3y ago
I'm not a native English speaker. Is the wording in the title correct? Doesn't the hyphen suggest that Cohen is the fixer of someone who was previously a / known as Trump?
- jjgreen 3y ago
  You're quite right, it should "Ex Trump-fixer" or just "Ex Trump fixer" since the meaning is unambiguous (since an Ex-Trump fixer is silly).
- add-sub-mul-div 3y ago
  It's more or less correct the way the headline has it, but technially an "en dash" is supposed to be used in this situation rather than a hyphen. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dash#Attributive_compounds https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dash#Attributive_compounds
meepmorp 3y ago
The best people
RcouF1uZ4gsC 3y ago
> Courts nationally are grappling with the rapid rise of generative artificial intelligence programs like OpenAI's ChatGPT and how to regulate their use in court proceedings. I don’t think you really need to try to regulate ChatGPT. You just keep the status quo where the lawyer submitting is responsible for everything, and they get sanctioned and maybe lose their license if they submit bs to the court. Treat it as a tool that the person using is responsible for. EDIT: Lawyers are a regulated group, so the numbers involved are tractable. The punishment also has teeth since you need a law license to practice law. We don’t explicitly regulate hammer use, but make the user of the hammer responsible for how they used it and what they did with it.
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago
  > don’t think you really need to try to regulate ChatGPT Courts seek to regulate ChatGPT’s use, not ChatGPT per se. This could be as simple as clarifying that attorneys are responsible for LLMs’ mistakes. It’s probably also helpful to flag the sections generated by an LLM.
searealist 3y ago
A "Fixer", otherwise known as a "Lawyer". I guess everything is an op-ed now.
- smt88 3y ago
  He helped Trump commit crimes and committed crimes for Trump. He wasn't just a lawyer.
- speedylight 3y ago
  Isn’t a fixer just someone who bribes on someone else’s behalf?
  - cafard 3y ago
    Not necessarily--a fixer makes problems go away, and it is understood in many cases that this may involve illegalities. But the fixer may simply be expert at negotiating without involving the legal system at all.
  - Tostino 3y ago
    Also intimidates people into signing NDAs for things like sexual assault.
- bediger4000 3y ago
  I don't think he did much in the way of lawyer work for Trump, you know, preparing documents, filing motions, etc etc. As I understand it, "fixer" is an accurate characterization, and I applaud thee headliner writer for using it.
  - searealist 3y ago
    He absolutely did all those things.
    - pests 3y ago
      Which are lawyer things. We're talking about fixer things. He did all the lawyer things, AND fixer things.
krapp 3y ago
If I had a nickel for every story I read about a lawyer using AI to generate a filing only to have it fabricate cases and cites wholesale, I'd have two nickels. Which isn't a lot but it's weird that it happened twice. And by "weird" I mean terrifying, because you know if it happened twice, it happens all the time, and if it happens with lawyers, it happens with doctors, engineers, and any other profession where people want to cut costs on getting technical documents. We are well and truly fucked as a species.
- jyxent 3y ago
  If it is happening all the time, providers of generative AI should be emphasizing a whole lot more that they can just make up information. ChatGPT currently has this message in small text below the message prompt, but I'm not sure how long it has been there: "ChatGPT can make mistakes. Consider checking important information." But I think that message is kind of underplaying it. The fact that it can make mistakes doesn't necessarily mean that the average person will think it is completely making something up.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- gjsman-1000 3y ago
  > Which isn't a lot but it's weird that it happened twice I see you too are a man of culture. :)

19 points by webmaven 3y ago

I'm not a native English speaker. Is the wording in the title correct? Doesn't the hyphen suggest that Cohen is the fixer of someone who was previously a / known as Trump?

jjgreen 3y ago
You're quite right, it should "Ex Trump-fixer" or just "Ex Trump fixer" since the meaning is unambiguous (since an Ex-Trump fixer is silly).
add-sub-mul-div 3y ago
It's more or less correct the way the headline has it, but technially an "en dash" is supposed to be used in this situation rather than a hyphen. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dash#Attributive_compounds https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dash#Attributive_compounds

meepmorp 3y ago

The best people

RcouF1uZ4gsC 3y ago

> Courts nationally are grappling with the rapid rise of generative artificial intelligence programs like OpenAI's ChatGPT and how to regulate their use in court proceedings. I don’t think you really need to try to regulate ChatGPT. You just keep the status quo where the lawyer submitting is responsible for everything, and they get sanctioned and maybe lose their license if they submit bs to the court. Treat it as a tool that the person using is responsible for. EDIT: Lawyers are a regulated group, so the numbers involved are tractable. The punishment also has teeth since you need a law license to practice law. We don’t explicitly regulate hammer use, but make the user of the hammer responsible for how they used it and what they did with it.

JumpCrisscross 3y ago
> don’t think you really need to try to regulate ChatGPT Courts seek to regulate ChatGPT’s use, not ChatGPT per se. This could be as simple as clarifying that attorneys are responsible for LLMs’ mistakes. It’s probably also helpful to flag the sections generated by an LLM.

searealist 3y ago

A "Fixer", otherwise known as a "Lawyer". I guess everything is an op-ed now.

smt88 3y ago
He helped Trump commit crimes and committed crimes for Trump. He wasn't just a lawyer.
speedylight 3y ago
Isn’t a fixer just someone who bribes on someone else’s behalf?
- cafard 3y ago
  Not necessarily--a fixer makes problems go away, and it is understood in many cases that this may involve illegalities. But the fixer may simply be expert at negotiating without involving the legal system at all.
- Tostino 3y ago
  Also intimidates people into signing NDAs for things like sexual assault.
bediger4000 3y ago
I don't think he did much in the way of lawyer work for Trump, you know, preparing documents, filing motions, etc etc. As I understand it, "fixer" is an accurate characterization, and I applaud thee headliner writer for using it.
- searealist 3y ago
  He absolutely did all those things.
  - pests 3y ago
    Which are lawyer things. We're talking about fixer things. He did all the lawyer things, AND fixer things.

krapp 3y ago

If I had a nickel for every story I read about a lawyer using AI to generate a filing only to have it fabricate cases and cites wholesale, I'd have two nickels. Which isn't a lot but it's weird that it happened twice. And by "weird" I mean terrifying, because you know if it happened twice, it happens all the time, and if it happens with lawyers, it happens with doctors, engineers, and any other profession where people want to cut costs on getting technical documents. We are well and truly fucked as a species.

jyxent 3y ago
If it is happening all the time, providers of generative AI should be emphasizing a whole lot more that they can just make up information. ChatGPT currently has this message in small text below the message prompt, but I'm not sure how long it has been there: "ChatGPT can make mistakes. Consider checking important information." But I think that message is kind of underplaying it. The fact that it can make mistakes doesn't necessarily mean that the average person will think it is completely making something up.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
gjsman-1000 3y ago
> Which isn't a lot but it's weird that it happened twice I see you too are a man of culture. :)