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Asteroid Mining Venture Backed by Google Execs, James Cameron Unveiled
- bane 15y agoThis has so much potential. Could this be the proper bootstrapping of us up there? (Thanks NASA for all the early scouting!)
- joshontheweb 15y agoHow do I get a job as a space miner?
- eco 15y agoStep 1: Become a robot.
- sammyo 15y agoNot an uncommon Science Fiction theme. And at the moment seems much more likely than a FTL drive.
- ChuckMcM 15y agoI think the comment about becoming a robot is accurate in its way, the 'pick' of a space miner is likely a semi-autonomous front loader equivalent which can process for a particular mineral/substance. However, if you read the article (either the parent or the NYTimes one) you will see that there is some thought about bringing an asteroid to one of the Lagrange points or into a Lunar orbit (something that would make the chance of it getting away and hitting Earth unlikely). In that scenario one could imagine living in one of those inflatable habitats where you worked while you operated your remote mining pick. Getting to and from that point would probably involve a 'loan' from the mining company, which you could pay off by mining the asteroid. Of course while you lived up there you would need things like food and stuff but you could get that at the company store. And rather than actually charge you for it they will just put it on your tab. You know, you load 16 tons, and what do you get? Another day older and deeper in debt. :-) As part of one of the lunar exploration projects I was looking at various ideas for processing lunar regolith into something more useful than just dirt. Water is pretty straight forward, basically it sublimates off stuff in a vacuum and you collect it and store it. Platinum is a different story, some sort of chemical/catalyzing process is required that does not require re-charging the chemical packs either at all or very often.
- sown 15y ago> You know, you load 16 tons, and what do you get? Another day older and deeper in debt. :-) It's hard to be satirical about the future when all this stuff keeps coming true. ;)
- wtracy 15y agoIf you're bringing an object that close to home, I don't know why you'd need someone up there just to teleoperate the equipment. At that distance, the lightspeed delay gets low enough that the person with the joystick could work from earth.
- gmaslov 15y agoIt might be worth having someone up there to fix the equipment when something goes wrong... unless by that time we've developed teleoperated robots with the flexibility and dexterity and sensitivity needed to make arbitrary on-site repairs. You might remember from the Hubble repair missions [1] that these relatively simple tasks you might expect to take a few hours in an Earth-based lab took /days/ of EVA time. Imagine how much more difficult such things would be when you have to squint at the job through a camera (not as good as an eyeball), use clumsy manipulators instead of your fingers (you'll have force-feedback if you're lucky, but forget about feeling textures), and with some lightspeed delay on top of that. Don't underestimate the value of other human senses, either; often the first indication of a machine failing is that it sounds or smells wrong. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STS-125#Extra-vehicular_activity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STS-125#Extra-vehicular_activi...
- ChuckMcM 15y agoI suspect this would be the likely case, and there would be repairs / refueling / retooling. If asteroid mining was anything like planet mining the ability to adapt tools on the spot and evolve quickly was a huge boon. One of the places I like to camp is Plumas-Eureka State Park [1] which is the site of an old gold mine. The stamping mill is kind of still there. One of the things the blacksmith docent talked about was that there was a competitive advantage at a mine to having a creative blacksmith, since they could build tools well suited to the kinds of rock and conditions rather than relying on 'off the shelf' sort of designs. [1] http://www.parks.ca.gov/?page_id=507 http://www.parks.ca.gov/?page_id=507
- necubi 15y agoThis NY Times article has a lot more information: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/24/science/space/in-pursuit-of-riches-and-travelers-supplies-in-the-asteroid-belt.html http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/24/science/space/in-pursuit-o.... It's wonderful to see people spending huge amounts of money to expand the reach of humanity instead of our capacity for narcissism. Startups like these give me hope for the future.
- richcollins 15y agoWhat makes you think this isn't about narcissism?
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- njharman 15y agoBy most definitions narcissism is self-love, inwards pointing. Going to space for the betterment of humankind's future doesn't seem to fit.
- Tichy 15y agoDon't they go to space to enrich themselves by mining asteroids?
- vibrunazo 15y agoI'm pretty sure that if these people, with their background, were only looking to get even richer. They would use their time to invest on something here on earth.
- rbanffy 15y agoWell... Someone will get to say "Full impulse power" or play Steppenwolf's "Magic Carpet Ride" ;-) When it finally happens, I'll say it was about time.
- mryan 15y ago
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- peteforde 15y agoI can't help but feel that Asimov would be proud.
- jholman 15y agoAsimov would probably start kvetching about how long it took, but otherwise, probably. The one who'd really be chortling, though, would be Heinlein, who was (almost) always a terrific proponent of privatized (almost) everything, especially space exploration.
- geetee 15y agoGet Bruce Willis involved and put up the Kickstarter page. Take my money.
- ericd 15y agoI wouldn't say that there's much of a funding barrier in this, many of the people involved have more money than has been transmitted over kickstarter in its entire history :-). I think if you want to really help with this, you should offer to work on the project with them. I'm sure they're going to need a large amount of code written, research done, mechanical widgets made, and so on, depending on your specialty.
- ricardobeat 15y agoThis is so unreal my brain has trouble deciding it's not a prank.
- chubot 15y agoHow much is the Unobtainium gonna go for?
- jaysonelliot 15y agoMy inner ten-year old is leaping up and down with excitement right now. I've got visions of OMNI magazine illustrations from the 1980s in my head, with watercolors of mining ships and stylish orange-suited astronauts. It's been so long since the future felt like it would match up to the optimistic sci-fi of a few decades ago, that I'd nearly forgotten. I know this is just one announcement of an intention, but I don't care, I'm going to go ahead and start dreaming again about seeing space elevators and terraformed moons and planets in my lifetime. Great story to read before bed.
- infectoid 15y agoTotally with you man. Let the nay sayers nay. It's activities like these that inspire the Human race as a whole. I don't even care if it's successful. Just to attempt such a grand idea is a great achievement.
- pjscott 15y agoI definitely care if it succeeds. If they're successful, then not only will they make a lot of money and make some materials much cheaper, but it will be the thing that funds the commercial space industry and makes large-scale investment in space economically viable. That's huge.
- ericd 15y agoI'm surprised at how invigorated this news is making me feel, like a weight has been lifted. SpaceX is great, but until now they've mostly been talking about missions that would have to be paid for by the government and subject to the agonizing budget-cutting that seems to happen every time an exciting mission is planned. If these guys succeed, it will emancipate the future of space exploration from congressional budget meetings forever. I don't think I realized how depressed I was about that whole situation until now. This is almost absurdly audacious and I love them for it.
- redthrowaway 15y agoThe interesting thing is, we have those budget cuts to thank for this. In the 50 years since we landed on the moon, we've put a massively expensive and questionably valuable series of tubes a few hundred kilometres from the Earth's surface, and sent a couple robots to Mars. These are both notable accomplishments, but they're hardly enough to give humanity any permanent presence in space. Space exploration has languished under the management of the federal government, and it has only been since the cancellation of the Shuttle that we've seen private enterprise truly step in with any sort of sustainable mission. I have long argued that the cuts to NASA are short-sighted and a net loss for humanity; perhaps it's time to re-evaluate that notion. They may well have been short-sighted, but the hole left by the fading government monopoly is opening up some incredibly interesting opportunities.
- kamaal 15y agoAll it would take to get governments back into the game is some private firm proving the value of resources that can be mined there. If governments get a clue of how valuable space real estate, energy and resources can be. Expect a space race, like weapons race. In fact you can expect wars on the basis of who controls which asteroids and who gets to stay where on mars.
- redthrowaway 15y agoI can see perhaps the Chinese and maybe the Russians looking to own asteroids, but that would require they pull out of several international treaties (not that big of a deal). For the West, their model has always been government-backed private monopolies (Hudson's Bay Company, East India Company, United Fruit, modern oil companies, etc). The American government would be more than happy to let Planetary resources do their own exploitation, while throwing its military weight behind them "to protect American interests". I'd be surprised if Europe makes much of an effort.
- waiwai933 15y agoI hate to admit it, but my brain initially processed the headline as: "Google execs have backed an asteroid mining venture. In other news, James Cameron has been unveiled." Then, after that horrendous attempt at comprehension, it came up with this, which was only slightly better: "James Cameron has unveiled an asteroid mining venture that is backed by Google execs."
- hdevalence2 15y agoReplace "," with "and".
- lucianof 15y agoThis is actually one thing I've always been wondering about as a non-native speaker when reading English headlines. Is there any reason newspapers prefer this style? It sounds weird to me.
- damncabbage 15y agoIt's weird for us native speakers too, don't worry. My guess is that it puts the information in the title in order from the most eye-grabbing to the least. (The more readable "Google Execs and James Cameron unveil Asteroid Mining Venture" puts the holy shit part of the title at the end.)
- andyking 15y agoIt's very much an American newspaper thing--I've never seen it in the British press, but it seems to be house style at the New York Times and its ilk.
- freeman478 15y agoThere was this nice piece by the NYT about the history and traditions of comma placement recently. Interesting read. http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/09/fanfare-for-the-comma-man/ http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/09/fanfare-for-...
- prawn 15y agoIf mines are such ugly, destructive things, why is it that I find this development so beautiful?
- SamReidHughes 15y agoIs it because asteroids are already ugly?
- prawn 15y agoI'm not sure that's it. I don't hear of wrecking crews smashing up a derelict corporate wasteland (arguably far uglier than any natural shape) and feel some peaceful, "all is right" sensation. Maybe something to do with the serenity of the void. But probably more related to this being a step forward? A sense of progression? Could come from growing up reading and imagining anything to do with space exploration. How many people on HN want to grab their colleagues right now, shake them, and yell "Why aren't you currently amazed? We're going to be mining IN FRICKIN' SPACE within our lifetimes?"
- nosignal 15y agoI'm supposed to be teaching a class on introductory Python (students are doing their exercises now) and I want to scrap the rest of the day to talk about how phenomenally awesome this news is. I'll settle for a strange, quiet sense of elation.
- prawn 15y ago"strange, quiet sense of elation" - good way of describing it. Pretty similar to how I felt after reading the article.
- SkyMarshal 15y agoBecause, real wealth creation (not fake skimming or wealth transfer) = 1. extract raw materials 2. apply labor + capital + innovation + time 3. sell final product for more than cost of inputs 4. Profit!!! This announcement takes #1 literally out of this world. Still dirty perhaps, but beautiful.
- jacques_chester 15y agoIt really bugs me when billionaires do the same thing I would do with billions of dollars before I have billions of dollars to do them with. Seriously. Space mining and pressure from environmentalism is going to turn this whole field into rivers of gold ... in the sky.
- xlevus 15y agoI know right. If I had a few billion dollars I'd (like to think I'd) happily plonk my cash into space mining. Even if I was unlikely to see a return before I died.
- daeken 15y agoAgreed. I've been pondering ways to bootstrap space-based mining and manufacturing for a long, long time and while I believe that I have some solid ideas, I just don't have the capital to do anything about it in the least.
- vibrunazo 15y agoThey'll probably be looking to hire engineers in the next few years tho. If you've got some skills and knowledge that could be helpful. Then there's still time. :-)
- pjscott 15y agoIf you get billions of dollars, you'll be happy that the asteroid mining guys put the space infrastructure in place to allow you to do really cool things.
- lmarinho 15y agoI'm curious about how they plan to bring these materials here. I assume changing the trajectory of the asteroid towards Earth wouldn't be a very good idea, considering the potential risk of impact. Maybe small chunks of material brought by numerous cheap reentry capsules are the way to go.
- raldi 15y agoI'd crash them into the moon (no atmosphere, so they wouldn't burn up on entry) for about a decade, then send ore-processing robots to smelt them down, then figure out later how to bring the results back.
- Nick_C 15y agoGood idea at first look, but it would be tricky to get the trajectory right, though. The Moon's sphere of influence is tiny compared to the Earth's. You would need a guidance package and, perhaps more importantly in terms of cost, onboard rockets to change delta-v (and only one-use because they would be destroyed on impact).
- mukaiji 15y agoHere's to the crazy ones. As a scientist, I am so thrilled about this idea.
- Roboprog 15y agoI love the first picture of the drum about to "eat" the rock. Reminds me of the furnaces in the book "Higher Education" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Higher_Education_(novel) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Higher_Education_(novel)
- njharman 15y agohttp://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/File:Planet_killer,_remastered.jpg http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/File:Planet_killer,_remaster...
- tylee78 15y agoI almost upvoted all of your comments - its incredible - as if someone was reading our mind and finally said, let's just do what all of us ever wanted to do!
- htf 15y ago> Planetary Resources wants to identify and characterize these top targets before it does anything else. To that end, it has designed a high-performance, low-cost space telescope that Anderson said should launch to low-Earth orbit within the next 18 to 24 months. Wow, they are not wasting time. Last week, the idea of an asteroid mining company was still in the realm of science fiction. Today, an asteroid mining company announces that they are launching a survey telescope within two years. It feels like we are entering a new era of technological progress. It makes me wonder what other surprising announcements are coming over the next few years in other fields.
- sown 15y agoNeat. So I wonder where this puts us on the hockey stick curve of space exploration? Are we at the point of the spinning jenny or more towards the cotton gin in humanity's space timeline? Probably doesn't matter if you are sufficiently far enough into the future and have to squint backwards.
- InclinedPlane 15y agoStill way, way over on the left side. We don't even have off-Earth colonies yet. We're on the cusp of being able to support cities in orbit, colonies on Mars, the Moon, and asteroids, etc. It'll be a fun ride.
- tylee78 15y agoNow seriously, as a software developer, what would be the best skill set to help these guys... As soon as I can afford it I would knock at their door and work for them for free. What would be most usefull for them (or spaceX)... A lot of C, C++, knowing NASA's open source repos in and out, doing MIT online courses on robotics and astrophysics... ?
- wtn 15y agoRead up on Armadillo Aerospace…
- jholman 15y agoHear hear. I think the same thing every time I read about SpaceX, and yes, now this.
- eru 15y agoWhy don't you write to SpaceX and ask them what skills they are looking for? Once you work for one kind of space company, you can probably get into another one quite easily.
- WalterBright 15y agoI'm a little surprised that billionaires haven't already done things like launched a couple more Hubble telescopes. The design is already done and debugged, just clone it, and launch it. The same for several other successful interplanetary probes - build a (relatively) cheap fleet of clones of successful designs, and send them out to explore the solar system fully. Heck, you don't even have to come up with all the money yourself. Sell advertising on the mission. Having a logo on the rocket, and logos on the returned pix, etc., are all fantastic opportunities for advertising.
- WalterBright 15y agoIn fact, a lot of the exploration journeys of the 1800s were financed by advertisers and newspapers looking to sell newspapers.
- philwelch 15y agoIt's hard to imagine that newspapers were once that rich.
- lukifer 15y agoIs it? Being society's primary information nexus is pretty damn profitable; just ask Google.
- philwelch 15y agoWell yeah, it makes sense when you work it out; every fact makes sense once you work it out. And there's a certain pleasing symmetry in that control over information, and the business model of attaching advertising to that information, has made the Google execs rich enough to invest in mining asteroids. I was just reflecting on how big a change it was.
- brc 15y agoSo was the Tour de France, for that matter.
- deleted 15y ago[deleted]
- guynamedloren 15y agoCannot explain how much this excites me... but can somebody familiar with the matter please elaborate on the economics of this? How, exactly, do they intend to make money? I was under the impression (from previous articles) that the raw minerals from the asteroids were worth tens or hundreds of thousands $$, while the process of bringing them to Earth would be orders of magnitude higher (millions or billions). Wouldn't it be more economical to use the materials for space ventures/stations/etc? Or are the asteroids composed of some high value materials that can be hugely profitable? Edit: this is not to say that the venture isn't utterly amazing - but there does seem to be quite a bit of focus on profit, and that confuses me.
- nlh 15y agoFTA: "A single platinum-rich space rock 1,650 feet (500 meters) wide contains the equivalent of all the platinum-group metals ever mined throughout human history, company officials said." Quick Wikipedia/Google math: 1 cubic foot of Platinum = 1330 pounds [1] Total platinum mined ever = ~25 cubic feet [1] * 1330 lbs = 33250 lbs = 532,000 oz Current price of platinum = $1,560/oz [2] Total value of platinum in an asteroid = $829M And that's just the one metal, which is not the only thing they're mining. Throw the water in there for the space station(s) and it's not impossible to assume that one asteroid can gross well over $1bn -- we're not talking $trillions yet, but I bet they've modeled this out to make it a profitable venture... [1] - http://www.gold-eagle.com/analysis/platinum.html http://www.gold-eagle.com/analysis/platinum.html [2] - http://www.kitco.com/market/ http://www.kitco.com/market/ (of course this doesn't account for the fact that if you suddenly double the worldwide supply of platinum overnight, the price likely won't stay at $1560/oz....but still...)
- paulsutter 15y agoAnd that's for a tiny, tiny asteroid.
- njharman 15y agoWow! I can't believe we've only ever mined 25 cubic feet of plat. Reading your source I'm not sure it's right, "The annual supply of platinum is only about 130 tons" "one cubic foot weighs a little more than 1,330 pounds" 23*1330lb = 13,875kg ever 130tons = 117,934kg per year "basement of less than 25 cubic feet" Maybe them meant basement of 25 square feet or 250cuft which is still tiny basement.
- Keyframe 15y agoProbability of PR stunt rather than truth - 99%, but if it is true we can definitely say we are in a new era.
- peteforde 15y agoLarry Page doesn't really strike me as someone that needs to do a lot of PR stunts.
- Keyframe 15y agoTime will tell, my money is on PR stunt.
- mryan 15y agoThe calibre of the backers leaves me certain that this is not a PR stunt. Does the founder of one of the world's best known companies need any additional PR? How about the director of one of the all-time top grossing movies? Seriously, the chances of this being just a PR stunt are practically nil. If they did want to get some individual PR, there would be cheaper ways to do it - e.g. buying a popular TV network and broadcasting PageNews 24/7, while paying people to watch it.
- peteforde 15y agoSafe to say that we agree. Best not feed the conspiracy trolls. :)
- eru 15y agoDo you want to bet? Your 99% certainty seems to imply that you offer 1:99 offers? At those rates I am more than happy to bet 100 GBP on the other side.
- aresant 15y agoAnd two credible co-founders behind the giant names: - Peter H. Diamandis (Founder of the X PRIZE) - Eric Anderson (Founder of Space Adventures, Rounding out the entire list of backers: - Larry Page (goog) - Eric Schmidt (goog) - James Cameron (goog) - Charles Simonyi (Billionaire via MSFT, oversaw creation of office) - K. Ram Shriram (Billionaire via goog) - Ross Perot, Jr (Perot's son) via http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planetary_Resources http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planetary_Resources
- yohui 15y ago> - James Cameron (goog) I don't think Cameron is involved in Google, is he?
- dustyreagan 15y agoNo. This is James Cameron the director. Same guy that funded Deepsea Challenger. This guy is doing some pretty cool stuff with his money.
- flyt 15y agoFunded AND piloted the Deepsea Challenger to the deepest point on Earth. Cameron is legit.
- krschultz 15y agoNow I feel much better about paying $17 to see Avatar in 3D.
- mladenkovacevic 15y agoYes, the very same guy that stole my dream life.
- deleted 15y ago[deleted]
- wtn 15y agoI wouldn't drink water from a heavy-metal rich asteroid.
- freehunter 15y agoRight now, here on Earth, heavy metals are being extracted from water to make it drinkable. If you've ever drank water that wasn't straight from a well, you've had water that has had heavy metals filtered from it.
- gavanwoolery 15y agoALL HAIL OUR NEW OVERLORDS.
- javajosh 15y agoFinally, extraordinary concentration of capital has an upside.
- phodo 15y agoI thought I'd echo your comment here and note that this is the third extraordinary concentration of capital I'm familiar with... a) gates foundation b) the give-my-billions-away-pledge c) this There is an underlying theme here, that tech/valley-generated wealth is causing a level of change we are only barely beginning to comprehend as the $ are pooled and focused. Now that is exciting. And that will create a brave new world.
- CWuestefeld 15y agoBut if today's attitudes give us any indication of future behavior, then I think the outcome is sad. A century from now, those who had the vision, and the willingness to risk so much for something that would benefit all of mankind so much, will be even more fabulously wealthy (if it goes as planned). Yet the masses will be shouting that it's unfair that those few should have such unimaginable wealth, just because they made a lucky bet a few years back. I picture "Occupy Cape Canaveral" protesters pillorying those who took the risks and made the future possible -- all while those same protesters are wearing platinum jewelry and using electronics that the iridium, rubidium, etc., made possible.
- DennisP 15y agoApparently, billionaires who made their money by inventing things people want have a tendency to do other cool things that benefit people. Billionaires who got there by, say, making giant bets with the downside backed by the public purse, tend to be absent from these sorts of ventures.
- javajosh 15y agoIt's too soon to tell - so far it's all pie in the sky. And a pie in the sky upside is not enough to counterbalance the quite obvious, very real downsides to enormous concentration of wealth in the hands of private individuals. (My suspicion is that I'm happy with wealth concentrated into the hands of people who agree with me.)
- whalesalad 15y agoAds like this in the center of the article really detract from the read =( http://wsld.me/G4q5 http://wsld.me/G4q5
- yaix 15y agoAs much as I dislike Goog for it's terrible costumer service, but these kind of investments make Goog as a company -- as well as it's founders -- so different from other corporations. Autonomous cars, Google earth/sky/moon/mars, Google glass, asteroid mining. Having some crazy idea and just doing it, even though it could fail, but at least trying it.
- kfk 15y agoAre they considering also sources of energy (gases for example) to mine? I mean, metals are good, but we will need more energy too. Also, what metals can they mine? Can they mine lithium (maybe we can ship 'batteries' to charge on the moon or asteroids?)? Cool stuff anyway.
- dstorrs 15y agoSolar is a better bet for energy in near earth space as opposed to batteries. That changes as you go out to the Belt and Mars, but even then a radio thermal generator (RTG) is probably better. If you want to ship energy to Earth surface you want solar again. Generate electricity from panels, convert to microwave, beam to receivers on Earth, convert back to electricity, problem solved. And no, the beam density would not high enough to cook anyone. Google "space based solar power" for more.
- dkastner 15y agoYou're going to burn a lot more energy getting to and from the asteroid than what you'd be able to bring back.
- eru 15y agoIf you need energy on earth, fission thorium.
- evoxed 15y agoI heard Mr. Cameron is already suiting up for the mission. I wonder where is secret door is this time...
- kamaal 15y agoI think this sort of stuff is natural progression in the time scale of evolution of a species. Its called exploration. People in the middle ages got equally excited when somebody invented a ship that could sail the seas and a compass that could point where they wanted to go. And then when they actually went there, they found some surprises. They figured that they are not the only ones to exist. Space exploration will be similar. We have gone from a boat to sail in a small lake, to making ships that can sail and mine resources for surviving a prolonged exploration campaign. The only thing that can throw spanner in the wheels now is this things going down and projects like these getting dropped. We are on the right track and give the direct and a little more speed. Privatization in this domain is the way forward.I think permanent space colonies very much look to be practical realities in some decades to come.
- loceng 15y agoI agree, I just hope we don't let quality of life and health here on Earth diminish more and more. Imagine if everyone was healthy, happy, and being as productive as they can be, doing what they enjoy most - imagine how much more energy could go into projects like these from productivity that won't be lost due to crime, too much turmoil from transition periods, etc.. Everyone would be able to on a daily basis have as much excitement as OP has. Exciting.
- Eliezer 15y agoThe next space race will be between Google and Paypal.
- kamaal 15y agoHardly surprising. The seas and oceans were explored by merchants. Entities like British East India trading company. The space might be explored by business men too! Ironic, but true.
- shrikant 15y ago"Larry's fighting Elon!" is the new "Morpheus is fighting Neo!".
- TazeTSchnitzel 15y agoPerhaps we'll see "Google Moon", the first settlement requiring a Google Account to live in...
- chii 15y agoI would totally apply for a beta. I also expect it to be free, inline with all the other google services, in return for giving away all my data about my personal life, so they can put ads on my walls.
- ajuc 15y agoI don't know, companies seems to act more ratinal, than people or countries. Isn't it more rational to collaborate, when there is almost infinite potential profit and huge risk?
- eliben 15y agoIncredible, and kudos to everyone involved. I wish I'll live long enough to see the fruits of such efforts harvested.
- gouranga 15y agoGenius idea. It'll be like playing Homeworld again :)
- chj 15y agoWow, wow, wow, wow, what can I do to support this adventure? Buying more android phones?
- alinajaf 15y agoWow. Second the comments about feeling about ten years old again. I hope beyond all hope that this is actually happening in my lifetime. Questions for those in the know: 1. Is there any legal precedent on whether or not they're even allowed to mine the asteroids? From what I understand the Moon can't be exploited by any one country or corporation. Does any similar law apply to asteroids? 2. How are they going to get the platinum back to Earth? Re-entry strikes me as needing a really effing big parachutes for the hauls they're going to be bringing back.
- gaius 15y agoWho's going to stop you, the Space Police?
- maxerickson 15y agoIf you're trying to make some dollars, you sort of have to take into account the firm grip that governments have on earth-side markets.
- InclinedPlane 15y agoUltimately the goal here is to increment values in US based bank accounts. Even if "the space police" couldn't stop them the US government could deny them the fruits of their labor, unless they really wanted to go rogue, but that's unlikely.
- andyjohnson0 15y ago1. Law seems to be undecided. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/47151745/ns/technology_and_science-science/t/does-asteroid-mining-violate-space-law/ http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/47151745/ns/technology_and_scien.... Presumably once someone starts to do some actual mining there will be some pressure to move on this. 2. Drop it in small bundles (a few tons?) over the ocean with a flotation device and a large reusable parachute. Preferable avoiding areas with significant pirate populations.
- vibrunazo 15y agoThey could just throw the mined metals to the moon. Refine it, and manufacture stuff there. Where energy is cheaper. Then just ship the moonphones back to earth, with a lower cost of reentry shipment per value sent. Now that would be cool.
- kator 15y agoI love the optimism I naturally want to jump on the band wagon and I doubt my comment will get a single up vote but here it goes: What about: 1) Biological issues (space viruses etc.) 2) Accidents (opps the orbit changed it's heading for Chicago) 3) More AI for robots, Skynet finally has a good resource base 4) "Today in the news global markets failed as PRI announced capturing a 1 billion metric ton astroid with 80% gold and platinum content" I am actually super excited just thought it was interesting to think about the counter issues.
- Symmetry 15y ago1) Any theoretical space viruses can already get to Earth just fine. We're pretty sure they don't exist though. 2) Yup, a real concern. I'm glad they're starting with a reasonably sized asteroid. 3) An AI rebellion probably won't look like what Hollywood says it will. 4) Awesome! There are so many cool things that you can do with gold and platinum that we don't because they're so damn expensive.
- johngalt 15y ago#1 'Andromeda strain' I'm sure that scientists will the first to study anything returned from the first mined asteroid. #2 The asteroid they are returning will weigh less than the ISS and be parked further away. Tackling the control/direction of asteroids is something we want to learn anyway. #3 We are a long way from strong AI. If strong AI is created, asteroid mining would be the smallest footnote in its capabilities. #4 There are abundant industrial uses for PGMs so there is a high floor price and continuing demand. Markets have established systems for dealing with periodic resource delivery (futures).
- ajlburke 15y agoThis sounds awesome, but I couldn't help but think that once they've built a fleet of robots capable of moving entire asteroids around, there's another viable backup business model to which they could easily 'pivot': 1. Assemble several dozen (hundred?) of the non-platinum-bearing asteroids with your robots and aim them on a slingshot-accelerated path towards Earth. 2. Threaten the entire world (or at least rich countries) with massive kinetic orbital bombardment. 3. ... profit! Brought to you by the guy who coined "Nuke them from orbit - it's the only way to be sure."
- mrgoldenbrown 15y agoWouldn't it be cheaper/easier to just buy/steal some nukes?
- melling 15y agoWe've had discussions on HN before about NASA and man vs robotic space exploration. It's really hard to convince people that NASA should not be going to Mars and not be going back to the moon with people at this time. The best way for NASA to spend its money is to build LOTS of robotic explorers/surveyors and learn as much about the solar system as possible. When we find something of value then it'll be time to send humans, which should take more than 15-25 years once we survey the solar system. At that point we'll have a VC bubble with people trying to extract whatever resources we find.
- GlennS 15y agoIf sci-fi has taught us anything, it's that this can only lead to a dystopian future where mankind is ruled by warring mega-corporations. Also, space pirates.
- masenghi 15y agoWho do asteroids belong to? Can they just claim them and sell the material they extract? Don't get me wrong, I would love to have my own asteroid mining company. Just need a couple billion dollars first. But what happens once there are two or more competing corporations? Who has the power to say which part of space belongs to whom? Will there be space battles?
- Symmetry 15y agoNobody owns or can own any celestial body according to the Outer Space Treaty[1]. Basically you can do whatever peaceful activity you want but you don't get to own anything in space except what you brought there. There is some legal question as to whether you own what you bring back, but you can certainly do whatever you want with it, including selling it. Corporations operating in space are still subject to the laws of whatever national flag they're flying under, so I presume that the court system can come to some decision if more than one company wants to grab the same hunk of rock and metal. It'll probably be based on who launches their mission first, or something like that.
- Tichy 15y agoWhat will be the shovels of the future gold rush? Maybe it would be a good time to develop mining robots? Rockets are completely out of my reach...
- swalsh 15y agoReading through this thread makes me realize there is no shortage of people who want to contribute either financially or through engineering talents. Prior to now, I didn't even realize it was conceivably feasible to do asteroid mining... but if it is, why doesn't someone start a massive open source track? A classic space race, though it would between a private company, and a non government public effort. I'll contribute money and time :D
- Symmetry 15y agoI wouldn't normally post song lyrics to HN, but this just seemed too appropriate: *And I want it so much. Close my eyes, I can taste the Mars dust in the air. In the darkness the space stations shimmer in orbits that I will not share. But I'll teach the student Who'll manage the fact'ry That tempers the steel that makes colonies strong. And I'll write the program that runs the computer That charts out the stars where our rockets belong. It will never get easy to wake from my dream When the future I dream of is so far away. But I am willing to sacrifice something I don't have For something I won't have but somebody will someday.*
- mrgoldenbrown 15y agoYou should probably mention that this is the song Somebody Will by Sassafrass. You can find more info and purcahse it here: http://www.sassafrassmusic.com/?page_id=15 http://www.sassafrassmusic.com/?page_id=15
- sabj 15y agoI am tremendously excited to hear about this project; it's exactly what I want(ed) to do, these billionaires have just gotten the jump on me by a few (dozen) zeroes of net worth. If any of them are reading, or anyone here knows them, I would do anything to get involved in this effort; the development and exploration of space is the most important mission in human history, and I'd love to put to work my business expertise, youthful energy, and eagerness to contribute... I'm well credentialed but more importantly extremely passionate!
- eru 15y ago> [...] I would do anything to get involved in this effort; [...] Have you applied for a job at SpaceX, yet? That's one way to get involved with modern space faring.
- sabj 15y agoIt's an interesting proposition, but my intention has always been to find where I can be of greatest leverage. SpaceX is at a place in time / life / hiring that I think I wouldn't really be able to contribute to its mission (and mine) as much as I might by doing something else first. That plus I doubt I'd be of terrible appeal. The following are also true: a) SpaceX appears more specifically to be looking for rocket engineers, etc, a background I do not have. (Good business / analytics / etc, but, a rocket engineer I am not). This problem likely applies to Planetary Resources as well. However... b) Planetary Resources is more directly aligned with the mission I find most important - SpaceX is doing great things, and Elon Musk is super cool for insisting on his goal of making humans a multi-planetary species, but that's still a ways out. I don't know that I'd have as much ability to contribute. It's for this reason I've been trying to gain skills that would be of greater value down the line (business ones, in particular) in order to do what's necessary to help run and grow a commercial space venture. c) I actually asked Elon Musk something on the subject - 'What advice do you have for people interested in getting involved early in these kinds of capital-intensive but world-changing businesses' and his answer was that, of course, it's helpful to have a few $100MMs from something like an internet company first :)
- 15y ago
- MatthewPhillips 15y agoWhat are the property implications? Does a company "own" an asteroid simply by being the first to land on it, or do companies need to bid on asteroids to mine from (and who is in charge of that)?
- PerryCox 15y agoI would assume space is just like the Wild West. Whatever you claim is yours, so long as you can defend it.
- alinajaf 15y agoHas anyone considered that this may be PR for the upcoming Prometheus? They have a TED talk on youtube, so it wouldn't surprise me.
- a_m_kelly 15y agoThis seems unlikely as Prometheus is being directly by Ridley Scott, not James Cameron.
- andyjohnson0 15y agoIf we suddenly have large amounts of previously expensive (rare or difficult to extract) metals available, what will this do to commodity markets? Would prices be driven down? If the price of $mineral goes down below a certain level, demand has to go up for continued asteroid mining to be viable. What future activities (apart from the obvious, like catalytic converters) might provide this demand?
- JshWright 15y agoI'm by no means an expert on the topic, and I don't have any specific examples to cite, but it seems like an almost weekly occurrence to read about some cool new technology that will 'never' be economically viable, due to the cost of the 'unobtanium' required to mass produce it (holy long sentence batman...). It seems likely that the end result of a massive influx of rare materials would simply make 'never' happen a whole lot sooner. While the price would obviously fall (likely by quite a significant amount, that's kinda the point), I doubt it would fall to the point of being 'worthless.'
- andyjohnson0 15y agoSo then this is basically a bet on being able to "make 'never' happen a whole lot sooner". Or maybe they have someone in the background saying "sure, we can build the antigravity device / FTL drive but we'll need an mega-ton of platinum to make it work". The other alternative is that they believe all the "future of mankind" stuff...
- Retric 15y agoIt's just a question of efficiency, if the cheapest way to get platinum is asteroid mining then once it starts it can out compete traditional platinum mining.(1) Generally speaking as the price for a commodity drops the market for that commodity increases more than the price drop. AKA, if gold costs X, and you can produce gold for 1/2 the price then expect to sell more than 2x as much gold. With Oil being a classic example, it's used to make roads because it's so cheap vs. being a better road surface. 1) Not that anyone directly mines for just platinum it tends to be a byproduct of the refining process for things like nickel, copper or gold. Even 'platinum' mines end up producing platinum, palladium, rhodium, ruthenium, iridium and osmium rather than just platinum. Still, it significantly influence the profitability of such mining operations to the point where if the price drops many mines will slow down production.
- godbolev 15y ago> "at 1:30 p.m. EDT (1730 GMT) Tuesday (April 24) during a news conference at Seattle's Museum of Flight." I'm not in America. Does anyone know where I can see this live online?
- es20641 15y agohttp://www.spacevidcast.com/live/ http://www.spacevidcast.com/live/ 10:30 AM PDT.
- deleted 15y ago[deleted]
- es20641 15y agoLink to their live public announcement :: Tuesday April 24 at 10:30 AM PDT :: http://www.spacevidcast.com/live/ http://www.spacevidcast.com/live/
- samstave 15y agoWhat is the math behind mining resources on asteroids? Assume it takes 50 billion to get to the point where you can mine your first asteroid, how much of what resource is in that asteroid that they can resell to terrestrial earth dwellers who need it for profit? Or does this not matter at this point? Further, what will the harvested resources be used to build? Military hardware? If so then I am very unimpressed with what this would mean to our civilization. While I think it is "cool" - there are so freaking many problems with humans on earth that I feel we largely ignore our core issues and focus on shiny objects. Every government on the planet is broken, we a a slave species to debt and we kill, exploit and oppress ourselves. Now, what would be interesting if the took these resources to build a huge floating city-state in the middle of the ocean (or orbit) however, this would just be future-feudalism as it would be living in the corporation. EDIT: I love how people on HN downvote without any comment. My point is completely valid, it is also my opinion - you don't need to agree, but it would be nice if you attempted to address my question regarding the economics of this effort.
- mrgoldenbrown 15y agoOK I'll feed the troll. You got downvoted because your comment makes it seem like you didn't read the article, or any of the supplemental articles linked to in this thread. A few quick examples of why I think this - Why did you assume 50 billion - that is not supported at all by the article. Why are you asking what resources are in the asteroid when the article answers that? Why are you assuming they want to resell those to "earth dwellers" when the article mentions applications involving resupplying other space missions? TL;DR - if we criticized every poorly researched post in detail instead of just downvoting, we'd have no time left in our day to do anything else.
- bitwize 15y agoBuild yourself a rocket ship, Blast off on an ego trip. Can this really be the end? Back to work you go again. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6IQ_FOCE6I http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6IQ_FOCE6I
- darthpanda 15y agoAlthough this is very exciting I remain highly skeptical.If anything this smells like a pump and dump scheme more than a legit effort. I hope I'm wrong. I really want to see this succeed.
- tocomment 15y agoSo what happened at the press conference at 1pm? Were more details released?
- dhughes 15y agoIf this becomes commonplace in the future I wonder how much it will affect the Earth, wouldn't more mass cause changes in the Earth's rotation or orbit? I know tonnes of crap from space falls to Earth each day or year, whatever the number is, but mining may bring more material back possibly denser metals rather than just rock dust and in a shorter period of time. Interesting to ponder.
- Nick_C 15y agoThe mass of the entire asteroid belt is only about 0.05% of the Earth's, and the metallic (M-type) ones only 10% of that, so not much effect. Interestingly, Ceres alone is 1/3 of the total mass, and the big four make up half. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asteroid_belt#Characteristics http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asteroid_belt#Characteristics