4 ms·

Yeah but people’s budgets are not made fully of restaurants and groceries. The bulk is made of housing, cars, phones, goods, clothes, which cost the same as wes

Yeah but people’s budgets are not made fully of restaurants and groceries. The bulk is made of housing, cars, phones, goods, clothes, which cost the same as western europe for the most part. In some cases I find food in the UK cheaper. Petrol is also comparable. While far from London the real estate market in a large city is comparable to say Manchester or similar. I doubt people writing apps live in areas where a house costs as much as a house in Detroit’s rundown areas. So op’s expenses are likely higher than that stat.

xenospn 3y ago
Rent in Romania is similar to Western Europe? I thought the income levels were very very different.
- gumballindie 3y ago
  Renting isnt as much a thing Romania. It’s a bit rare, like ownership in the UK. Rent and prices for decent quality are similar. I know because I made investments there. Folks here are quoting some rather below par prices, that local usually stay away from _if they seek decent housing_. There are rundown areas, such as that where Tate lives - next to a cemetery - but a few streets further away and prices double. You dont see the upper extremes as in vest europe but for “regular” folks the col is similar. Also there’s a lot of “under the table” money involved in buying property, so actual prices are way, way, higher than official figures. Typically if you wish to make some _very_ high margins you invest in bucharest or cluj. British expats living there extatic, not just because they could afford to buy (working locally albeit for western companies), but also because they made decent profits if they bought 5-6 years ago.
Nextgrid 3y ago
Housing prices are controlled by local supply & demand; there's no way housing is going to be remotely comparable between let's say the UK and Romania; the majority of properties would stay empty forever if they were priced like in the UK. Same thing for most consumer goods - they have a (very low) base price and the rest is pure profit margin which is adjusted according to the local purchasing power. Consumer goods in Romania would be much cheaper than in a Western European country; whether by existing manufacturers lowering their profit margins to match local purchasing power, or other manufacturers managing to fill this gap in the market by selling at more affordable prices.
- mathverse 3y ago
  The goods are cheaper but not that much. Most goods like food and furniture are made by large Western European companies( mostly german and austrian) who utilize economy of scale to make those and can ship and deliver them in large quantities to shops that they THEMSELVES control. It's impossible for a country like Romania to develop its own champions in a traditional industry like this.
IshKebab 3y ago
That seems implausible. I looked it up and the first result was: > A one-room apartment in Bucharest, Cluj-Napoca, Brasov, Sibiu or other big cities will cost from €350 to €500 per month Good luck finding that in Manchester!
- hereonout2 3y ago
  I just found a newly built 7 bedroom villa with pool in Bucharest for under €500k, not ideal as it's near the airport but if anyone could point to an equivalent in the Manchester metropolitan area I'd be very interested. Also found an entire building on Bucharest's second busiest street Magheru Blvd for €1.4M. Out of my price range unfortunately but it does include 12 separate 3 bedroom apartments, a floor of offices, and a restaurant, cafe and art gallery at street level.
  - sebastianz 3y ago
    > Also found an entire building on Bucharest's second busiest street Magheru Blvd for €1.4M. Out of my price range unfortunately but it does include 12 separate 3 bedroom apartments, a floor of offices, and a restaurant, cafe and art gallery at street level. This sounds extremely dubious and I would not take that into account in any relevant real estate price for central Bucharest :)
    - gumballindie 3y ago
      Yeah there’s the occasional news piece in the uk showing some random person buying “homes” in Romania or Bulgaria for 5k£. People fail to distinguish fact from fantasy, and imagine outliers are the norm. No mentioning of the properties being better of demolished and rebuilt or in the middle of nowhere. There’s a lot of anti east european propaganda in western europe, likely a remnant of the cold war era. Keeps the consumer types happy and grateful for being born in a “rich” country.
      - felini 3y ago
        I would agree to propaganda, but I also agree that the quoted price for a studio is correct. It can also be less on the outskirts and not in a central area. A very central 2 bedrooms, living room, two baths can be rented at 600 EUR in Bucharest. If you still don’t believe it I can show you the rental contract.

xenospn 3y ago

Rent in Romania is similar to Western Europe? I thought the income levels were very very different.

gumballindie 3y ago
Renting isnt as much a thing Romania. It’s a bit rare, like ownership in the UK. Rent and prices for decent quality are similar. I know because I made investments there. Folks here are quoting some rather below par prices, that local usually stay away from _if they seek decent housing_. There are rundown areas, such as that where Tate lives - next to a cemetery - but a few streets further away and prices double. You dont see the upper extremes as in vest europe but for “regular” folks the col is similar. Also there’s a lot of “under the table” money involved in buying property, so actual prices are way, way, higher than official figures. Typically if you wish to make some _very_ high margins you invest in bucharest or cluj. British expats living there extatic, not just because they could afford to buy (working locally albeit for western companies), but also because they made decent profits if they bought 5-6 years ago.

Nextgrid 3y ago

Housing prices are controlled by local supply & demand; there's no way housing is going to be remotely comparable between let's say the UK and Romania; the majority of properties would stay empty forever if they were priced like in the UK. Same thing for most consumer goods - they have a (very low) base price and the rest is pure profit margin which is adjusted according to the local purchasing power. Consumer goods in Romania would be much cheaper than in a Western European country; whether by existing manufacturers lowering their profit margins to match local purchasing power, or other manufacturers managing to fill this gap in the market by selling at more affordable prices.

mathverse 3y ago
The goods are cheaper but not that much. Most goods like food and furniture are made by large Western European companies( mostly german and austrian) who utilize economy of scale to make those and can ship and deliver them in large quantities to shops that they THEMSELVES control. It's impossible for a country like Romania to develop its own champions in a traditional industry like this.

IshKebab 3y ago

That seems implausible. I looked it up and the first result was: > A one-room apartment in Bucharest, Cluj-Napoca, Brasov, Sibiu or other big cities will cost from €350 to €500 per month Good luck finding that in Manchester!

hereonout2 3y ago
I just found a newly built 7 bedroom villa with pool in Bucharest for under €500k, not ideal as it's near the airport but if anyone could point to an equivalent in the Manchester metropolitan area I'd be very interested. Also found an entire building on Bucharest's second busiest street Magheru Blvd for €1.4M. Out of my price range unfortunately but it does include 12 separate 3 bedroom apartments, a floor of offices, and a restaurant, cafe and art gallery at street level.
- sebastianz 3y ago
  > Also found an entire building on Bucharest's second busiest street Magheru Blvd for €1.4M. Out of my price range unfortunately but it does include 12 separate 3 bedroom apartments, a floor of offices, and a restaurant, cafe and art gallery at street level. This sounds extremely dubious and I would not take that into account in any relevant real estate price for central Bucharest :)
  - gumballindie 3y ago
    Yeah there’s the occasional news piece in the uk showing some random person buying “homes” in Romania or Bulgaria for 5k£. People fail to distinguish fact from fantasy, and imagine outliers are the norm. No mentioning of the properties being better of demolished and rebuilt or in the middle of nowhere. There’s a lot of anti east european propaganda in western europe, likely a remnant of the cold war era. Keeps the consumer types happy and grateful for being born in a “rich” country.
    - felini 3y ago
      I would agree to propaganda, but I also agree that the quoted price for a studio is correct. It can also be less on the outskirts and not in a central area. A very central 2 bedrooms, living room, two baths can be rented at 600 EUR in Bucharest. If you still don’t believe it I can show you the rental contract.