5 ms·

Why terrifying?

by CoastalCoder 3y ago

Why terrifying?

n8henrie 3y ago
I assume referring to being an individual getting this diagnosis prior to the onset of symptoms.
- CoastalCoder 3y ago
  That would make sense. I assumed GP was referring to the potential for abuse.
- MBCook 3y ago
  It would have to be extremely stressful, knowing that in some short number of years (since it normally shows up in late teens/early 20s I think) your mind would start to constantly lie to you and you may lose the ability to discern reality from hallucinations.
autoexec 3y ago
Imagine if children could get diagnosed, or anyone who had no idea and now has to question their own sanity knowing that if it isn't already affecting them that it's only a matter of time. Also because our blood can end up in a lot of places. People who may not even be aware it was collected/screened for schizophrenia could end up being targeted by marketers, scammers, or anyone else with an agenda who'll try to feed into their paranoia the same away advertisers target people with biopolar disorder because they know that people in a manic phase tend to buy things/travel more or how scammers use data brokers to buy up lists of people with dementia and those with low IQ/little education
- TriangleEdge 3y ago
  I would vote for making data brokers illegal.
  - mrcode007 3y ago
    Same. Not sure why you got downvoted.
    - toasted-subs 3y ago
      Because some of the people here are corporate dogs, who just try to better themselves. Just had an interview where there was no correct answer. Remembered the equivalent leetcode problem, and my solution worked. Could not pass their test cases though.
  - toomuchtodo 3y ago
    https://www.consumerfinance.gov/about-us/newsroom/remarks-of-cfpb-director-rohit-chopra-at-white-house-roundtable-on-protecting-americans-from-harmful-data-broker-practices/ https://www.consumerfinance.gov/about-us/newsroom/remarks-of... https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/2121/text?s=1&r=14&q=%7B%22search%22%3A%22Energy%5C%5C+and%5C%5C+and%5C%5C%22%7D https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/212... (S.2121 - DELETE Act) CFPB is trying to rein them in. Call your congressional reps, ask them to support the DELETE Act.
- farco12 3y ago
  That could be terrifying, but it sounds better than being misdiagnosed. >advertisers target people with biopolar disorder because they know that people in a manic phase tend to buy things I've assumed this is probably true, but do you have any evidence that this is actively practiced?
  - 0xEF 3y ago
    Who needs evidence when there is no real enforceable penalty for doing so? Credit card companies sell our data. Ancestry services probably sell our data. They might put signs in the windows saying "your data is safe with us" but that's pretty much where any amount of trust we place in these companies ends and becomes blind faith.
  - autoexec 3y ago
    It may be too late for you to ever see this, but: https://gizmodo.com/depression-anxiety-brokers-sell-mental-health-data-1850107119 https://gizmodo.com/depression-anxiety-brokers-sell-mental-h... The study: https://techpolicy.sanford.duke.edu/data-brokers-and-the-sale-of-americans-mental-health-data/ https://techpolicy.sanford.duke.edu/data-brokers-and-the-sal... https://www.healthyads.com/targeting/medical-conditions-targeting/bipolar-disorder-targeting/ https://www.healthyads.com/targeting/medical-conditions-targ... https://mobilemarketingmagazine.com/psychological-targeting-the-case-for/ https://mobilemarketingmagazine.com/psychological-targeting-... It's also worth pointing out that a company doesn't have to hold a meeting where they vote to deliberately target and exploit vulnerable members of the public, instead they just use an algorithm that constantly optimizes for making them money and which eventually figures out exploiting people is easy and effective. Those companies generally know it's happening, and often do set out to make it happen just like they've always targeted ads at young children and teenagers whose brains aren't developed yet, but the algorithm gives them plausible deniability.
    - farco12 3y ago
      Not too late! This is what I was looking for, thank you for sharing.
- reissbaker 3y ago
  I think it would be largely good to know, since being predisposed to schizophrenia doesn't necessarily mean you end up losing your sanity. Schizophrenia is largely genetic and physical markers of schizophrenia (e.g. abnormal thalamus shape) appear in the non-schizophrenic siblings of people suffering from schizophrenia... And if you're predisposed to schizophrenia, there are certain things you should avoid like cannabis consumption that can trigger schizophrenia in people who have the predisposition (and once schizophrenia is triggered, it isn't curable; only manageable with lifelong medication). If a blood test could tell you that you have the equivalent of a deathly peanut allergy, but to weed (and instead of dying you get a permanent mental health issue that requires medication for the rest of your life), I think it would be better to know that than to not. Even if it's unfortunate and scary to know.
  - M1ch431 3y ago
    I invite you to read my other postings in this thread and respond to me in your leisure. It's clear we have a fundamental difference of opinion, and I think a productive discussion could be had between us despite that. I have a very open mind and I'd welcome any knowledge or understanding you wish to convey to me. You can consider me a strong-minded, stubborn but otherwise good faith skeptic. I apologize in advance if I come off as hostile or otherwise distasteful in this interaction, that is not my intention. This is a subject that I have great passion for, and I truly believe that greed has warped our understanding of care as a society. I especially invite you to look up Soteria Houses (a minimal/no medication way of successfully treating schizophrenia) and the various results of the implementations worldwide before responding. And to respond directly to your posting: Can you explain why this thalamus abnormality is associated with schizophrenia? What is the reasoning? Who is to say that such an abnormality has nothing to do with the schizophrenia, but is instead an inherited, but benign condition? Where is the damage/disease? Is the thalamus thought to be central in the cause of schizophrenia? For example, I have such a rare condition, but with my optic nerve/cup-to-disc ratio. My father has the same condition - we present like we have glaucoma, but it is completely and absolutely benign.
    - reissbaker 3y ago

Why terrifying?

n8henrie 3y ago

I assume referring to being an individual getting this diagnosis prior to the onset of symptoms.

CoastalCoder 3y ago
That would make sense. I assumed GP was referring to the potential for abuse.
MBCook 3y ago
It would have to be extremely stressful, knowing that in some short number of years (since it normally shows up in late teens/early 20s I think) your mind would start to constantly lie to you and you may lose the ability to discern reality from hallucinations.

autoexec 3y ago

Imagine if children could get diagnosed, or anyone who had no idea and now has to question their own sanity knowing that if it isn't already affecting them that it's only a matter of time. Also because our blood can end up in a lot of places. People who may not even be aware it was collected/screened for schizophrenia could end up being targeted by marketers, scammers, or anyone else with an agenda who'll try to feed into their paranoia the same away advertisers target people with biopolar disorder because they know that people in a manic phase tend to buy things/travel more or how scammers use data brokers to buy up lists of people with dementia and those with low IQ/little education

TriangleEdge 3y ago
I would vote for making data brokers illegal.
- mrcode007 3y ago
  Same. Not sure why you got downvoted.
  - toasted-subs 3y ago
    Because some of the people here are corporate dogs, who just try to better themselves. Just had an interview where there was no correct answer. Remembered the equivalent leetcode problem, and my solution worked. Could not pass their test cases though.
- toomuchtodo 3y ago
  https://www.consumerfinance.gov/about-us/newsroom/remarks-of-cfpb-director-rohit-chopra-at-white-house-roundtable-on-protecting-americans-from-harmful-data-broker-practices/ https://www.consumerfinance.gov/about-us/newsroom/remarks-of... https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/2121/text?s=1&r=14&q=%7B%22search%22%3A%22Energy%5C%5C+and%5C%5C+and%5C%5C%22%7D https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/212... (S.2121 - DELETE Act) CFPB is trying to rein them in. Call your congressional reps, ask them to support the DELETE Act.
farco12 3y ago
That could be terrifying, but it sounds better than being misdiagnosed. >advertisers target people with biopolar disorder because they know that people in a manic phase tend to buy things I've assumed this is probably true, but do you have any evidence that this is actively practiced?
- 0xEF 3y ago
  Who needs evidence when there is no real enforceable penalty for doing so? Credit card companies sell our data. Ancestry services probably sell our data. They might put signs in the windows saying "your data is safe with us" but that's pretty much where any amount of trust we place in these companies ends and becomes blind faith.
- autoexec 3y ago
  It may be too late for you to ever see this, but: https://gizmodo.com/depression-anxiety-brokers-sell-mental-health-data-1850107119 https://gizmodo.com/depression-anxiety-brokers-sell-mental-h... The study: https://techpolicy.sanford.duke.edu/data-brokers-and-the-sale-of-americans-mental-health-data/ https://techpolicy.sanford.duke.edu/data-brokers-and-the-sal... https://www.healthyads.com/targeting/medical-conditions-targeting/bipolar-disorder-targeting/ https://www.healthyads.com/targeting/medical-conditions-targ... https://mobilemarketingmagazine.com/psychological-targeting-the-case-for/ https://mobilemarketingmagazine.com/psychological-targeting-... It's also worth pointing out that a company doesn't have to hold a meeting where they vote to deliberately target and exploit vulnerable members of the public, instead they just use an algorithm that constantly optimizes for making them money and which eventually figures out exploiting people is easy and effective. Those companies generally know it's happening, and often do set out to make it happen just like they've always targeted ads at young children and teenagers whose brains aren't developed yet, but the algorithm gives them plausible deniability.
  - farco12 3y ago
    Not too late! This is what I was looking for, thank you for sharing.
reissbaker 3y ago
I think it would be largely good to know, since being predisposed to schizophrenia doesn't necessarily mean you end up losing your sanity. Schizophrenia is largely genetic and physical markers of schizophrenia (e.g. abnormal thalamus shape) appear in the non-schizophrenic siblings of people suffering from schizophrenia... And if you're predisposed to schizophrenia, there are certain things you should avoid like cannabis consumption that can trigger schizophrenia in people who have the predisposition (and once schizophrenia is triggered, it isn't curable; only manageable with lifelong medication). If a blood test could tell you that you have the equivalent of a deathly peanut allergy, but to weed (and instead of dying you get a permanent mental health issue that requires medication for the rest of your life), I think it would be better to know that than to not. Even if it's unfortunate and scary to know.
- M1ch431 3y ago
  I invite you to read my other postings in this thread and respond to me in your leisure. It's clear we have a fundamental difference of opinion, and I think a productive discussion could be had between us despite that. I have a very open mind and I'd welcome any knowledge or understanding you wish to convey to me. You can consider me a strong-minded, stubborn but otherwise good faith skeptic. I apologize in advance if I come off as hostile or otherwise distasteful in this interaction, that is not my intention. This is a subject that I have great passion for, and I truly believe that greed has warped our understanding of care as a society. I especially invite you to look up Soteria Houses (a minimal/no medication way of successfully treating schizophrenia) and the various results of the implementations worldwide before responding. And to respond directly to your posting: Can you explain why this thalamus abnormality is associated with schizophrenia? What is the reasoning? Who is to say that such an abnormality has nothing to do with the schizophrenia, but is instead an inherited, but benign condition? Where is the damage/disease? Is the thalamus thought to be central in the cause of schizophrenia? For example, I have such a rare condition, but with my optic nerve/cup-to-disc ratio. My father has the same condition - we present like we have glaucoma, but it is completely and absolutely benign.
  - reissbaker 3y ago