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> Plus, Apple is the only safety- and privacy- enforcing ecosystem in existence. You mean the company that wanted to ship CSAM detection for iCloud uploads wit

by MaKey 3y ago

> Plus, Apple is the only safety- and privacy- enforcing ecosystem in existence. You mean the company that wanted to ship CSAM detection for iCloud uploads with iOS, which was only abandoned because of the huge backlash? Or the company that's implementing privacy features which neatly don't affect its own apps, effectively boosting their ad platform? [1] [1]: https://adguard.com/en/blog/apple-tracking-ads-business.html https://adguard.com/en/blog/apple-tracking-ads-business.html

movedx 3y ago
CSAM was pushed on big tech by most governments.
- MaKey 3y ago
  It's important to know and keep in mind that governments didn't (re)discover this topic on their own, it is being pushed massively by lobbyists: https://fortune.com/europe/2023/09/26/thorn-ashton-kutcher-ylva-johansson-csam-csa-regulation-european-commission-encryption-privacy-surveillance/ https://fortune.com/europe/2023/09/26/thorn-ashton-kutcher-y... Apple wasn't required to implement any CSAM detection, so why did they do it? Saying it was pushed onto big tech by governments when there is no law demanding it feels apologetic to me.
  - MBCook 3y ago
    > Apple wasn't required to implement any CSAM detection, so why did they do it? As things were, Apple was able to serve up peoples images when presented with a warrant. If they went to end to end encryption for photo libraries they wouldn’t be able to do that. And I can basically guarantee something would happen and there would be claims about how “Apple protects child molesters”. It’s just too juicy, and we saw the ones about Apple protecting terrorists by not unlocking phones. So I think they tried to come up with a solution. Something that would let them do end to end encryption but be able to show they’re not protecting child pornographers.
    - philistine 3y ago
      They’ve already locked pictures behind end-to-end encryption. It’s simply not turned on by default.
jdlshore 3y ago
Yes, for photos stored in the cloud, the company that implemented a privacy-preserving CSAM detection algorithm on-device rather than just running it on unencrypted photos in the cloud like everyone else.
snakeyjake 3y ago
>You mean the company that wanted to ship CSAM detection for iCloud uploads with iOS If someone wants to store stuff on YOUR servers YOU get to inspect it for whatever you want for whatever reason you want, arbitrarily and/or capriciously within the terms of whatever agreement you enact with your users. And the law, of course. If you don't want to inspect it, that's fine and that's your business. If you do want to inspect it, that's fine and that's your business. If users want to keep stuff on their device you don't get to inspect it. This isn't complicated.

by MaKey 3y ago

movedx 3y ago

CSAM was pushed on big tech by most governments.

MaKey 3y ago
It's important to know and keep in mind that governments didn't (re)discover this topic on their own, it is being pushed massively by lobbyists: https://fortune.com/europe/2023/09/26/thorn-ashton-kutcher-ylva-johansson-csam-csa-regulation-european-commission-encryption-privacy-surveillance/ https://fortune.com/europe/2023/09/26/thorn-ashton-kutcher-y... Apple wasn't required to implement any CSAM detection, so why did they do it? Saying it was pushed onto big tech by governments when there is no law demanding it feels apologetic to me.
- MBCook 3y ago
  > Apple wasn't required to implement any CSAM detection, so why did they do it? As things were, Apple was able to serve up peoples images when presented with a warrant. If they went to end to end encryption for photo libraries they wouldn’t be able to do that. And I can basically guarantee something would happen and there would be claims about how “Apple protects child molesters”. It’s just too juicy, and we saw the ones about Apple protecting terrorists by not unlocking phones. So I think they tried to come up with a solution. Something that would let them do end to end encryption but be able to show they’re not protecting child pornographers.
  - philistine 3y ago
    They’ve already locked pictures behind end-to-end encryption. It’s simply not turned on by default.

jdlshore 3y ago

Yes, for photos stored in the cloud, the company that implemented a privacy-preserving CSAM detection algorithm on-device rather than just running it on unencrypted photos in the cloud like everyone else.

snakeyjake 3y ago

>You mean the company that wanted to ship CSAM detection for iCloud uploads with iOS If someone wants to store stuff on YOUR servers YOU get to inspect it for whatever you want for whatever reason you want, arbitrarily and/or capriciously within the terms of whatever agreement you enact with your users. And the law, of course. If you don't want to inspect it, that's fine and that's your business. If you do want to inspect it, that's fine and that's your business. If users want to keep stuff on their device you don't get to inspect it. This isn't complicated.