4 ms·

Don’t worry! Visa and MasterCard have lobbied the hapless fools who inherited this wonderfully efficient and effective system, and the trains of Japan will soon

by numair 3y ago

Don’t worry! Visa and MasterCard have lobbied the hapless fools who inherited this wonderfully efficient and effective system, and the trains of Japan will soon switch over to join the global payment oligarchy. Japan is about half a generation away from mass-scale mediocrity.

andrekandre 3y ago
i think i may have seen those at some stations, they are attached like clunky add-ons to the gates, but ive never seen anyone actually use them.... i wonder why they are being installed... easier for tourism maybe?
- seanmcdirmid 3y ago
  Getting a suica card on your phone is super easy as a tourist, easy to charge up using a credit card attached to ApplePay or whatever the google equiv is. The only issue is if you are traveling with a kid who needs children fares, then you actually need a physical card.
  - the-rc 3y ago
    As far as I know, you still can't tap to pay with e.g. a Pixel unless you bought it in Japan or it was flashed with a JP image. https://atadistance.net/2023/10/05/the-state-of-pixel-global-nfc-support-2023/ https://atadistance.net/2023/10/05/the-state-of-pixel-global...
    - samlinnfer 3y ago
      Works fine everywhere (e.g. FamilyMart) with Apple devices not purchased in Japan. Source: I was there
  - Larrikin 3y ago
    Maybe it's different on iOS but it is impossible on Android to use unless you have a Japanese credit card with a Japanese address. There seems to be no way to even use a foreign credit card to add money to an IC card. Had to relent on getting the cash back on my Sapphire and just top up with cash my last trip. I'm just glad most of the machines allow for 10 yen increments now, so I can just dump in coins I get from the rare place that doesn't accept credit cards nowadays.
    - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
      I heard that was also a restriction for Apple a few months before I went on my trip, but by August 2023 it wasn’t anymore. Maybe the same is true for Android? If not, that’s a super weird limitation of Android. It definitely doesn’t exist now on a iPhone. My wife and I were able to use and load phone-based suica cards without issue.
      - Larrikin 3y ago
        I tried and it was completely impossible in January of this year. I didn't bother trying in November. Maybe they got rid of the restriction recently due to the Pasmo shortage.
      - aikinai 3y ago
        Apple has supported FeliCa globally since 2017. Android still doesn’t. It’s not a restriction someone can remove; the non-Japanese phones just don’t have either the hardware or license necessary.
    - the-rc 3y ago
      That was a problem with foreign Visa cards only, no? AMEX and MasterCard worked. It was the same on Apple devices, but it might be fixed in the latest iOS update.
      - uguuchan 3y ago
        Can confirmed fixed in latest iOS update. However, very high chance Visa will label as fraud, so need to call them.
  - Nextgrid 3y ago
    It's super easy but it's still an extra thing to do. For an occasional user such as a tourist it would be much better if you could use your existing payment instrument rather than having to buy a local, purpose-specific one.
    - rajup 3y ago
      Beg to disagree. I visited Japan as a tourist and even if you stay for two days the number of times you will use the subway in, say Tokyo makes the 2 minute setup totally superior to your credit card.
  - ensignavenger 3y ago
    I was in Japan this summer and could not get Suica on my phone , has that changed in the last few weeks?
langsoul-com 3y ago
Go to Singapore, public transport can use Visa and mastercard without any problem. Tap in and out in less than half a second.
- numair 3y ago
  The problem isn’t technical, it’s social. I don’t want my bank, and some “global payment network” that can easily lobby its way out of real data oversight, to know my transit patterns and habits.
  - manuelabeledo 3y ago
    I don't think that data about how frequently you pay for mass transit, is that valuable. "This guy takes the train once early in the morning, then again in the evening", exactly like 10 million people in the city, maybe?
    - zx8080 3y ago
      If that's true why would Visa/mastercard push so hard to get into so low tx ( <$1 each) processing? What are they paying/losing money for? It's data. For some reason they're willing to pay to get a transit data for as much as possible people in several countries.
- makeitdouble 3y ago
  Btw Suica is 200ms or less. To the parent, the credit card system will be parrallel to Suica/passmo, not a replacement. People would freak out with a system that isn't prepaid (think school kids), doesn't fully work offline and is twice as slow as the current one.
- zx8080 3y ago
  Not true. Visa frequently fails.

by numair 3y ago

andrekandre 3y ago

i think i may have seen those at some stations, they are attached like clunky add-ons to the gates, but ive never seen anyone actually use them.... i wonder why they are being installed... easier for tourism maybe?

seanmcdirmid 3y ago
Getting a suica card on your phone is super easy as a tourist, easy to charge up using a credit card attached to ApplePay or whatever the google equiv is. The only issue is if you are traveling with a kid who needs children fares, then you actually need a physical card.
- the-rc 3y ago
  As far as I know, you still can't tap to pay with e.g. a Pixel unless you bought it in Japan or it was flashed with a JP image. https://atadistance.net/2023/10/05/the-state-of-pixel-global-nfc-support-2023/ https://atadistance.net/2023/10/05/the-state-of-pixel-global...
  - samlinnfer 3y ago
    Works fine everywhere (e.g. FamilyMart) with Apple devices not purchased in Japan. Source: I was there
- Larrikin 3y ago
  Maybe it's different on iOS but it is impossible on Android to use unless you have a Japanese credit card with a Japanese address. There seems to be no way to even use a foreign credit card to add money to an IC card. Had to relent on getting the cash back on my Sapphire and just top up with cash my last trip. I'm just glad most of the machines allow for 10 yen increments now, so I can just dump in coins I get from the rare place that doesn't accept credit cards nowadays.
  - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
    I heard that was also a restriction for Apple a few months before I went on my trip, but by August 2023 it wasn’t anymore. Maybe the same is true for Android? If not, that’s a super weird limitation of Android. It definitely doesn’t exist now on a iPhone. My wife and I were able to use and load phone-based suica cards without issue.
    - Larrikin 3y ago
      I tried and it was completely impossible in January of this year. I didn't bother trying in November. Maybe they got rid of the restriction recently due to the Pasmo shortage.
    - aikinai 3y ago
      Apple has supported FeliCa globally since 2017. Android still doesn’t. It’s not a restriction someone can remove; the non-Japanese phones just don’t have either the hardware or license necessary.
  - the-rc 3y ago
    That was a problem with foreign Visa cards only, no? AMEX and MasterCard worked. It was the same on Apple devices, but it might be fixed in the latest iOS update.
    - uguuchan 3y ago
      Can confirmed fixed in latest iOS update. However, very high chance Visa will label as fraud, so need to call them.
- Nextgrid 3y ago
  It's super easy but it's still an extra thing to do. For an occasional user such as a tourist it would be much better if you could use your existing payment instrument rather than having to buy a local, purpose-specific one.
  - rajup 3y ago
    Beg to disagree. I visited Japan as a tourist and even if you stay for two days the number of times you will use the subway in, say Tokyo makes the 2 minute setup totally superior to your credit card.
- ensignavenger 3y ago
  I was in Japan this summer and could not get Suica on my phone , has that changed in the last few weeks?

langsoul-com 3y ago

Go to Singapore, public transport can use Visa and mastercard without any problem. Tap in and out in less than half a second.

numair 3y ago
The problem isn’t technical, it’s social. I don’t want my bank, and some “global payment network” that can easily lobby its way out of real data oversight, to know my transit patterns and habits.
- manuelabeledo 3y ago
  I don't think that data about how frequently you pay for mass transit, is that valuable. "This guy takes the train once early in the morning, then again in the evening", exactly like 10 million people in the city, maybe?
  - zx8080 3y ago
    If that's true why would Visa/mastercard push so hard to get into so low tx ( <$1 each) processing? What are they paying/losing money for? It's data. For some reason they're willing to pay to get a transit data for as much as possible people in several countries.
makeitdouble 3y ago
Btw Suica is 200ms or less. To the parent, the credit card system will be parrallel to Suica/passmo, not a replacement. People would freak out with a system that isn't prepaid (think school kids), doesn't fully work offline and is twice as slow as the current one.
zx8080 3y ago
Not true. Visa frequently fails.