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> And because it is easy to switch, everyone will be using the best But it's not easy to switch. E-mail was easy to switch "back then", when you didn't have a

> And because it is easy to switch, everyone will be using the best But it's not easy to switch. E-mail was easy to switch "back then", when you didn't have a bunch of accounts tied to them. IRC was easy to switch, because most of the servers were interconnected into a few large networks, and all the clients used the same protocol. And now? Your grandma only knows how to use whatsapp? Well, you're not switching away from that, and facebook is getting all your data.

danbruc 3y ago
You are not switching away from WhatsApp because that is what everyone is using, not because it would be harder to use Signal.
- ajsnigrutin 3y ago
  But it's not 'everyone', it's just grandma. Auntie is using Viber. Grandpa from the other side is using google hangouts (chat? something). And your cousin is using telegram. https://www.similarweb.com/blog/research/market-research/worldwide-messaging-apps/ https://www.similarweb.com/blog/research/market-research/wor... Just look at the map of most popular messengers worldwide, it's not just one.
  - danbruc 3y ago
    For most people it does not matter what people are using at the other end of the world, they will use the locally dominant platform.
  - Tomte 3y ago
    Most people don't have friends on other continents. At least for Germany I can confidently say that there is nothing (except rounding error) besides WhatsApp. No matter the demographic. I have never experienced a debate which messenger to use, and I have joined about twelve study-related group chats over the last two years. Same for personal messages. Some people have Signal or Telegram installed. After two or three messages for the novelty factor, everybody is back on WhatsApp. Because that app is open all the time.
    - RamblingCTO 3y ago
      When I was at uni for CompSci we had those discussions. Including the odd ball with sms-only phones. We also had threema and signal, none of which prevailed.
    - ajsnigrutin 3y ago
      I live in slovenia, and have instagram, whatsapp, viber and telegram for "normal people" who only have one of those (and can't be reached elsewhere), I can't reach some people (besides sms/call),because I don't have facebook (messenger). Also i have a few relatives using skype only, those are a pain, because the client sucks.
    - yesco 3y ago
      My friends used to use a mix of iMessage and Facebook Messenger, while my extended family relied mostly on Facebook Messenger + SMS. I didn't like this, I didn't have/or want an iPhone, meaning I was excluded from certain iMessage groups and I hated using Facebook so I was implicitly excluded from discussions via Facebook Messenger. Most of my communications were over SMS as a result, so not ideal for my social life. Seeing this as a problem I researched alternative message apps that had feature parity with iMessage, I figured any attempt to get people to switch would fail if I couldn't get this much. I also decided to bank on the latent frustration people had with Facebook, the company, meaning I had to scratch WhatsApp off the list. I ended up with Signal vs Telegram. Telegram had the sleekest interface and good feature parity with iMessage. While Signal fell short feature wise, it supported SMS (at the time) and some of my friends were interested in it from a privacy angle. Ultimately I decided to be realistic, so I scratched off Signal and chose Telegram. The goal was to get everyone to switch not just a few who were "interested", so feature parity had to stay the priority, privacy be damned. My pick was very important because I figured the likelihood of a successful migration would decrease with each attempt I made. Finally having made my choice, I consulted 1 on 1 with my individual friends and family members who usually organize events, and convinced them to install telegram + join my premade group chats. I then nagged them to notify everyone that all event planning would now be via Telegram and that everyone needed to install it now. I think the Telegram invite link really helped grease the wheels here. Finally after setting the stage with that, I individually convinced each friend and family member 1 on 1, via a call or in-person, to install Telegram and join the new group chats. I made arguments such as: It would unify our communication under the same platform and make everyone's lives easier, we can use Telegram surveys to more easily schedule stuff, it has all the same features as iMessage + more, I already got X and Y to join so I really don't want you to be left out, I can help you install it, etc. I found it was important to take full initiative during all this. Finally, in only a few days I got two distinct groups migrated onto Telegram. We have continued to use it for 2-3 years now so it's safe to say the migration stuck. The only one who I couldn't get to join was my cranky uncle who wanted signal instead (first I had heard of this from him), but his wife joined so it didn't really matter anyway, he is simply excluded from discussions now. So ultimately, you can get people to switch if you put the work in :)
mratsim 3y ago
Email is worse than that, running your own mail server means pleasing Google and Outlook to accept your email. And you may also have to pay to get out of blocklists turned extorsionists. Actually it examplifies what goes wrong when an infrastructure monopoly is created. Also IE6.
- denton-scratch 3y ago
  > pay to get out of blocklists Only a sucker would do that. Google, Yahoo and Hotmail, the providers of nearly all email addresses, don't rely on public blocklists. Those are very much a noughties thing.
nradov 3y ago
Right so to get users to switch you need to invent a new mode of communication. We have had postal mail, telegraph, telephone, fax, email, and instant messaging. What's next? Find an opportunity for disruptive innovation in communications that isn't already dominated by established competitors.
- mycall 3y ago
  AI agents doing tasks for you will be huge and a new form of communications.

danbruc 3y ago

You are not switching away from WhatsApp because that is what everyone is using, not because it would be harder to use Signal.

ajsnigrutin 3y ago
But it's not 'everyone', it's just grandma. Auntie is using Viber. Grandpa from the other side is using google hangouts (chat? something). And your cousin is using telegram. https://www.similarweb.com/blog/research/market-research/worldwide-messaging-apps/ https://www.similarweb.com/blog/research/market-research/wor... Just look at the map of most popular messengers worldwide, it's not just one.
- danbruc 3y ago
  For most people it does not matter what people are using at the other end of the world, they will use the locally dominant platform.
- Tomte 3y ago
  Most people don't have friends on other continents. At least for Germany I can confidently say that there is nothing (except rounding error) besides WhatsApp. No matter the demographic. I have never experienced a debate which messenger to use, and I have joined about twelve study-related group chats over the last two years. Same for personal messages. Some people have Signal or Telegram installed. After two or three messages for the novelty factor, everybody is back on WhatsApp. Because that app is open all the time.
  - RamblingCTO 3y ago
    When I was at uni for CompSci we had those discussions. Including the odd ball with sms-only phones. We also had threema and signal, none of which prevailed.
  - ajsnigrutin 3y ago
    I live in slovenia, and have instagram, whatsapp, viber and telegram for "normal people" who only have one of those (and can't be reached elsewhere), I can't reach some people (besides sms/call),because I don't have facebook (messenger). Also i have a few relatives using skype only, those are a pain, because the client sucks.
  - yesco 3y ago
    My friends used to use a mix of iMessage and Facebook Messenger, while my extended family relied mostly on Facebook Messenger + SMS. I didn't like this, I didn't have/or want an iPhone, meaning I was excluded from certain iMessage groups and I hated using Facebook so I was implicitly excluded from discussions via Facebook Messenger. Most of my communications were over SMS as a result, so not ideal for my social life. Seeing this as a problem I researched alternative message apps that had feature parity with iMessage, I figured any attempt to get people to switch would fail if I couldn't get this much. I also decided to bank on the latent frustration people had with Facebook, the company, meaning I had to scratch WhatsApp off the list. I ended up with Signal vs Telegram. Telegram had the sleekest interface and good feature parity with iMessage. While Signal fell short feature wise, it supported SMS (at the time) and some of my friends were interested in it from a privacy angle. Ultimately I decided to be realistic, so I scratched off Signal and chose Telegram. The goal was to get everyone to switch not just a few who were "interested", so feature parity had to stay the priority, privacy be damned. My pick was very important because I figured the likelihood of a successful migration would decrease with each attempt I made. Finally having made my choice, I consulted 1 on 1 with my individual friends and family members who usually organize events, and convinced them to install telegram + join my premade group chats. I then nagged them to notify everyone that all event planning would now be via Telegram and that everyone needed to install it now. I think the Telegram invite link really helped grease the wheels here. Finally after setting the stage with that, I individually convinced each friend and family member 1 on 1, via a call or in-person, to install Telegram and join the new group chats. I made arguments such as: It would unify our communication under the same platform and make everyone's lives easier, we can use Telegram surveys to more easily schedule stuff, it has all the same features as iMessage + more, I already got X and Y to join so I really don't want you to be left out, I can help you install it, etc. I found it was important to take full initiative during all this. Finally, in only a few days I got two distinct groups migrated onto Telegram. We have continued to use it for 2-3 years now so it's safe to say the migration stuck. The only one who I couldn't get to join was my cranky uncle who wanted signal instead (first I had heard of this from him), but his wife joined so it didn't really matter anyway, he is simply excluded from discussions now. So ultimately, you can get people to switch if you put the work in :)

mratsim 3y ago

Email is worse than that, running your own mail server means pleasing Google and Outlook to accept your email. And you may also have to pay to get out of blocklists turned extorsionists. Actually it examplifies what goes wrong when an infrastructure monopoly is created. Also IE6.

denton-scratch 3y ago
> pay to get out of blocklists Only a sucker would do that. Google, Yahoo and Hotmail, the providers of nearly all email addresses, don't rely on public blocklists. Those are very much a noughties thing.

nradov 3y ago

Right so to get users to switch you need to invent a new mode of communication. We have had postal mail, telegraph, telephone, fax, email, and instant messaging. What's next? Find an opportunity for disruptive innovation in communications that isn't already dominated by established competitors.

mycall 3y ago
AI agents doing tasks for you will be huge and a new form of communications.