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> They have a relatively small team when compared to Waymo, at least at the research/state-of-the-art level. Sure, but in every independent test, Tesla's smart

> They have a relatively small team when compared to Waymo, at least at the research/state-of-the-art level. Sure, but in every independent test, Tesla's smart driving capabilities get completely trounced by Subaru EyeSight. Does Subaru also have vastly more PhD researchers than Tesla?

londons_explore 3y ago
It looks like of the features both systems have, Subaru EyeSight performs better... But Tesla FSD has vastly more abilities (some of which it performs well at, some middling, and some poor).
alsodumb 3y ago
I'm not following the news on this, but what metrics do these independent tests use and what aspects do they cover? Are they driver assistance features?
nradov 3y ago
Subaru EyeSight works very well in my experience, but it's much less ambitious. It basically just does lane keep assist, automatic braking, and dynamic cruise control. It can't be used at all in heavy precipitation and will automatically deactivate. The cruise control also has an annoying tendency to unnecessarily slow down on the freeway when you're in the slow lane and the vehicle in front takes an exit ramp.
porphyra 3y ago
I'm sorry but there's no way that Subaru EyeSight can "trounce" FSD. Maybe it is slightly better in some scenarios than legacy Autopilot which came out many years ago and hasn't been updated since. Tesla FSD is vastly more capable and can handle city driving with traffic controls whereas EyeSight merely just follows a lane.
- Alex3917 3y ago
  > I'm sorry but there's no way that Subaru EyeSight can "trounce" FSD. I mean that's what literally all of the data shows, e.g.: https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a24511826/safety-features-automatic-braking-system-tested-explained/ https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a24511826/safety-featu...
  - porphyra 3y ago
    AEB has nothing to do with self driving or Autopilot.
    - Alex3917 3y ago
      It's literally the most foundational part of self driving.
      - porphyra 3y ago
        Not really. 1. the AEB may run on a different codepath than FSD 2. AEB needs to decide when it is appropriate to override the driver, e.g. if the driver is behaving as though they are paying attention, e.g. by repeatedly stepping on the accelerator, it is undesirable to override the driver's deliberate actions even if it appears that the driver is about to run into something. On the other hand, when the car is driving autonomously, it has full control to avoid running into anything at all. Also, instead of trusting unscientific tabloid news with inconsistent methodologies, why not use the standard assisted driving scores from official government tests, such as the Euro NCAP? Teslas score by far the highest. https://www.euroncap.com/en/ratings-rewards/assisted-driving-gradings/ https://www.euroncap.com/en/ratings-rewards/assisted-driving...
        Veserv 3y ago
        You have made a solid argument for why we should believe the Euro NCAP scores so I will accept their assessment that Tesla is by far the worst. Your link shows Tesla scores 36/100 in assistance competence, the lowest score by far. The second lowest is 52/100 and the average over all models (excluding Tesla) being ~67/100.

londons_explore 3y ago

It looks like of the features both systems have, Subaru EyeSight performs better... But Tesla FSD has vastly more abilities (some of which it performs well at, some middling, and some poor).

alsodumb 3y ago

I'm not following the news on this, but what metrics do these independent tests use and what aspects do they cover? Are they driver assistance features?

nradov 3y ago

Subaru EyeSight works very well in my experience, but it's much less ambitious. It basically just does lane keep assist, automatic braking, and dynamic cruise control. It can't be used at all in heavy precipitation and will automatically deactivate. The cruise control also has an annoying tendency to unnecessarily slow down on the freeway when you're in the slow lane and the vehicle in front takes an exit ramp.

porphyra 3y ago

I'm sorry but there's no way that Subaru EyeSight can "trounce" FSD. Maybe it is slightly better in some scenarios than legacy Autopilot which came out many years ago and hasn't been updated since. Tesla FSD is vastly more capable and can handle city driving with traffic controls whereas EyeSight merely just follows a lane.

Alex3917 3y ago
> I'm sorry but there's no way that Subaru EyeSight can "trounce" FSD. I mean that's what literally all of the data shows, e.g.: https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a24511826/safety-features-automatic-braking-system-tested-explained/ https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a24511826/safety-featu...
- porphyra 3y ago
  AEB has nothing to do with self driving or Autopilot.
  - Alex3917 3y ago
    It's literally the most foundational part of self driving.
    - porphyra 3y ago
      Not really. 1. the AEB may run on a different codepath than FSD 2. AEB needs to decide when it is appropriate to override the driver, e.g. if the driver is behaving as though they are paying attention, e.g. by repeatedly stepping on the accelerator, it is undesirable to override the driver's deliberate actions even if it appears that the driver is about to run into something. On the other hand, when the car is driving autonomously, it has full control to avoid running into anything at all. Also, instead of trusting unscientific tabloid news with inconsistent methodologies, why not use the standard assisted driving scores from official government tests, such as the Euro NCAP? Teslas score by far the highest. https://www.euroncap.com/en/ratings-rewards/assisted-driving-gradings/ https://www.euroncap.com/en/ratings-rewards/assisted-driving...
      - Veserv 3y ago
        You have made a solid argument for why we should believe the Euro NCAP scores so I will accept their assessment that Tesla is by far the worst. Your link shows Tesla scores 36/100 in assistance competence, the lowest score by far. The second lowest is 52/100 and the average over all models (excluding Tesla) being ~67/100.