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> Vim sucks. Why?

IshKebab 3y ago
Two main reasons: 1. It has a ridiculous learning curve to get to the same editing proficiency as just having multiple cursors. All Vim users imagine themselves to be editing text at the speed of light while users of "lesser" editors struggle with scalar editing. I have seen zero evidence of that. Anyone of my colleagues that use Vim struggle to do basic tasks because remembering the gazillions of mnemonics is too onerous. Meanwhile I can do anything I want very quickly in VSCode, and with immediate feedback! 2. It infests Unix by being the default editor in many situations (Git commit editing is probably the worst offender). Fine if you want to use your weird editor, but it should 100% not be the default editor EVER. There's a reason exiting Vim is a meme.
- jzb 3y ago
  Vim isn’t for you, and that’s fine. Statements like “all Vim users…” aren’t really a great contribution to the discussion. I’ve used Vim for 20+ years. I like it, you don’t have to. I don’t try to shove it down anyone’s throat - nor do I try to tell you why your favorite tool sucks. Because it probably doesn’t suck - for you. Tell me what you like or what doesn’t work for you and leave the middle school attitude where it belongs.
  - IshKebab 3y ago
    > Vim isn’t for you, and that’s fine. See point 2. Vim isn't for 99% of people but it's somehow the default editor? Most people do not like Vim. That's why this project advertises not having to use Vim, because to 99% of people Vim is something that they don't want or like and can't even quit.
    - hnlmorg 3y ago
      It's not the default everywhere. Some platforms default with nano. The reason vi(m) and nano are defaults is because they're included in base installs (which a default would need to be). And the reason they're part of base installs is because they have a low footprint. Having, for example, VSCode as the default wouldn't make much sense because base installs might not even have Xorg / Wayland installed. Changing the default is easy though, it's literally just an environmental variable named $EDITOR
    - jzb 3y ago
      99%? Really? I’ve noticed that nano has replaced vi/Vim in a lot of cases. I’m not a nano fan, but I also don’t feel the need to rant about it. It’s a default, it’s easy to change. Big Vim isn’t plotting to keep a monopoly.
    - wiseowise 3y ago
      Most people who use vim absolutely love it, otherwise they wouldn’t use it on day to day basis. Those who don’t usually don’t care.
- wiseowise 3y ago
  > It has a ridiculous learning curve to get to the same editing proficiency as just having multiple cursors. It takes completing vimtutor to be faster than your average editing experience. What does it even have to do with multiple cursors? > All Vim users imagine themselves to be editing text at the speed of light while users of "lesser" editors struggle with scalar editing. I have seen zero evidence of that. I see it every day at work. Those who use vim are much faster on average. > Meanwhile I can do anything I want very quickly in VSCode, and with immediate feedback! Read and edit 100k lines file with syntax highlighting. I’d like to see that. > It infests Unix by being the default editor in many situations (Git commit editing is probably the worst offender). Fine if you want to use your weird editor, but it should 100% not be the default editor EVER. There's a reason exiting Vim is a meme. Right, because internet memes are a serious indicator of anything.

> Vim sucks. Why?

Two main reasons: 1. It has a ridiculous learning curve to get to the same editing proficiency as just having multiple cursors. All Vim users imagine themselves to be editing text at the speed of light while users of "lesser" editors struggle with scalar editing. I have seen zero evidence of that. Anyone of my colleagues that use Vim struggle to do basic tasks because remembering the gazillions of mnemonics is too onerous. Meanwhile I can do anything I want very quickly in VSCode, and with immediate feedback! 2. It infests Unix by being the default editor in many situations (Git commit editing is probably the worst offender). Fine if you want to use your weird editor, but it should 100% not be the default editor EVER. There's a reason exiting Vim is a meme.

jzb 3y ago
Vim isn’t for you, and that’s fine. Statements like “all Vim users…” aren’t really a great contribution to the discussion. I’ve used Vim for 20+ years. I like it, you don’t have to. I don’t try to shove it down anyone’s throat - nor do I try to tell you why your favorite tool sucks. Because it probably doesn’t suck - for you. Tell me what you like or what doesn’t work for you and leave the middle school attitude where it belongs.
- IshKebab 3y ago
  > Vim isn’t for you, and that’s fine. See point 2. Vim isn't for 99% of people but it's somehow the default editor? Most people do not like Vim. That's why this project advertises not having to use Vim, because to 99% of people Vim is something that they don't want or like and can't even quit.
  - hnlmorg 3y ago
    It's not the default everywhere. Some platforms default with nano. The reason vi(m) and nano are defaults is because they're included in base installs (which a default would need to be). And the reason they're part of base installs is because they have a low footprint. Having, for example, VSCode as the default wouldn't make much sense because base installs might not even have Xorg / Wayland installed. Changing the default is easy though, it's literally just an environmental variable named $EDITOR
  - jzb 3y ago
    99%? Really? I’ve noticed that nano has replaced vi/Vim in a lot of cases. I’m not a nano fan, but I also don’t feel the need to rant about it. It’s a default, it’s easy to change. Big Vim isn’t plotting to keep a monopoly.
  - wiseowise 3y ago
    Most people who use vim absolutely love it, otherwise they wouldn’t use it on day to day basis. Those who don’t usually don’t care.
wiseowise 3y ago
> It has a ridiculous learning curve to get to the same editing proficiency as just having multiple cursors. It takes completing vimtutor to be faster than your average editing experience. What does it even have to do with multiple cursors? > All Vim users imagine themselves to be editing text at the speed of light while users of "lesser" editors struggle with scalar editing. I have seen zero evidence of that. I see it every day at work. Those who use vim are much faster on average. > Meanwhile I can do anything I want very quickly in VSCode, and with immediate feedback! Read and edit 100k lines file with syntax highlighting. I’d like to see that. > It infests Unix by being the default editor in many situations (Git commit editing is probably the worst offender). Fine if you want to use your weird editor, but it should 100% not be the default editor EVER. There's a reason exiting Vim is a meme. Right, because internet memes are a serious indicator of anything.