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Checkmate 19" IPS Retro Monitor
- system2 3y ago$369 is not bad for a very niche monitor. I wish it came with different sizes though.
- sgarman 3y agoI like the practical approach of actually being able to ship something but for me in 2023 not CRT and not OLED is a tough sell.
- kowbell 3y ago> CRT displays of the kind we all grew up with are terrific displays, but they come with a price. They are not modern tech and as such they are expensive and difficult to maintain, like classic pinball machines or arcade games. We knew we had to come up with a better, more future proof solution going forwards Has anyone heard of any attempts to bring back CRT’s? I imagine the manufacturing chain for that would be bigger than any reasonable kickstarter/the demand from retro enthusiasts and the like. I know I’ve been hunting for old TVs for circuit bending/glitch art and it’s tough, thrift stores nearby stopped taking old TVs and everything on Facebook Marketplace only has coax (less ideal than composite.) Ebay works but good deals get snatched up.
- nebula8804 3y agoHave you considered RGB modding some of those coax only tvs? If they have RGB mods available you can get the best picture quality possible out of them. Also where you located? My marketplace in NY has loads of people trying to give their tvs away for free or super cheap. These things are heavy. I guess the smaller sets tend to command some cash (and some famous tiny models go for a lot). Possibly try expanding your search radius if you are willing to drive.
- busterarm 3y ago"best picture quality" is kinda subjective. Most consumer CRTs were kind of ass. There's a reason that what's sought after these days are old broadcast reference monitors that cost $20,000+ when new.
- nebula8804 3y agoI meant best picture quality that particular TV could produce. ie. the limitation isn't the video signal anymore once you do the mod.
- busterarm 3y agoThe limitation is the maintainability of the tube. Cheap tubes go out easily and their repairability is limited. Especially phosphor/beam issues. Cheap tubes also don't have features that assist you in maintaining them or correcting for picture issues that develop.
- nebula8804 3y agoWhat are you even talking about? We are talking about getting the best picture out of an existing TV set that works. RGB Mod > Coaxial
- busterarm 3y agoI'm saying most sets aren't worth the effort to keep around. You're talking about putting a pig in a dress.
- kowbell 3y agoI have been considering the mod! I’ve watched a video or two about that mod but I don’t want to rush into it with CRTs all having electrical bits on them that can kill me if I do something wrong. I’m entirely new to electrical tinkering but eager to learn for this circuit bending stuff. I’m east coast but not near NY… maybe I can justify it by renting a U-Haul van and filling it with TVs ;)
- naikrovek 3y agomaking a CRT factory today would be extremely challenging. Only the retro video game market wants these things, and the lead requirements for the glass are considerable. not worth the hassle. probably not even possible within a 1st world nation because of the environmental impact.
- wkat4242 3y agoLead is still allowed in applications where there's no suitable replacement. For example lead-acid batteries are still being sold for UPS and alarm systems. I don't think leaded glass in CRTs would be problem because it exists to protect the user from radiation.
- fragmede 3y agoIs that lead as in time to wait before you get it, or lead, as in the metal?
- naikrovek 3y agolead the metal. CRTs are made of leaded glass to reduce x-ray emissions.
- chongli 3y agoLead is only used for the funnel of the CRT, not the front. The front is barium-strontium glass. Lead glass has a tendency to turn yellow/brown with use, giving an ugly picture if used for the front. You actually don’t even need to make the funnel out of glass at all, since it doesn’t need to be transparent. Tektronix famously made a lot of CRTs out of ceramics [1], with barium-strontium glass used only for the front. This also let them produce a CRT with a completely flat and rectangular front. [1] https://vintagetek.org/ceramic-strips/ https://vintagetek.org/ceramic-strips/
- naikrovek 3y agoYes that's true, but good luck making large CRTs using that method. Those ceramic-walled tubes were fine when the screen is 5" diagonal, but for a 29" arcade monitor, that won't do. CRTs will never again be made in the quantities required to make it feasible economically.
- soupfordummies 3y agoAFAIK there aren't any CRTs being manufactured anywhere on Earth anymore. It's been kinda wild seeing them go from basically free to sought after in the past few years. Real time supply and demand in action, kids
- busterarm 3y agoSony sold its Trinitron manufacturing line to a plant in India but they were only using it to recycle CRT tubes for the local market a couple of years ago and I think they shut down too since COVID. Making CRT tubes is art and skill and a lot of the technology would have to be literally redeveloped as there aren't the skilled hands left on the planet to produce the tubes we were producing in the early '00s. I have a huge desire for this kind of equipment due to my arcade/gaming hobby but it's a long-term losing play to try and maintain this stuff.
- HankB99 3y agoSo the 21" NEC and Hitachi monitors still cluttering up my home lab might be worth something? I could never bear to dump them because of what they cost me new. They work well when I need a console on my ancient server hosts because they all do VGA.
- EvanAnderson 3y agoThey likely are worth something. I'm kicking myself for taking most of my VGA monitors to Goodwill back in the early 2010's (mainly for not having them now, not for the windfall I missed).
- kcb 3y agoCRTs went through a phase where you couldn't give them away for the cost of picking up to now where higher quality models are becoming pretty desirable
- infotainment 3y agoThis appears to be a standard LCD monitor (albeit a 4:3 aspect ratio one) in a retro styled case. Neat, but no substitute for a real period-accurate display. An actual CRT will make retro stuff look so much better, as it was intended for that type of display.
- creshal 3y agoEizo and other still make high-quality IPS displays in those sizes and form factors (and even more exotic ratios like 1:1), so I'm not sure what the supposed market is.
- naikrovek 3y agoyou not understanding the market means nothing. every display has a market, because non-standard displays are made to order.
- naikrovek 3y agook, we'll all just go to the CRT store, where CRTs are sold, because they're still made.
- creshal 3y agoThey're not, but all-digital 17" 4:3 displays with input lag and a need for external A/D converters to hook up retro systems are still being made. The authors of this ask for a pretty hefty premium to hide all the off-the-shelf components in a custom-made case. (And CRTs are still around aplenty on ebay and the likes.)
- seiferteric 3y agoI was thinking maybe 4:3 panels might be hard to come by today, but looking on amazon, they seem to be available, so ya. Might be neat if they had a built in CRT "filter", like running it through a raspberry pi with one of those CRT emulators or maybe FPGA to automatically give it more of a CRT feel.
- redder23 3y agoI never get this retro gaming stuff. If I really want to play an old game from my childhood I use an emulator that probably has some neat features that make the experience better then it was back in the day and I do not need to buy any overpriced hardware. All the "modular" shit sounds like just a artificial sales tactic. Why not just build it with all the 90% of the possible ports needed or something that makes sense and sell some adapter for the rest rare 10% like 3 different slots for shit seems just overkill and just an excuse to sell more expensive stuff for "enthusiasts" who want to get everything possible. And its not even CRT, that would actually make sense. Size also way to small. Again I rather fire up an emulator and I have something better for $0.
- glimshe 3y agoThe emulators can be pretty good, but for people looking for the nostalgia, it might not really cut it. It doesn't fully send you back to your childhood, so if you have money to spend on this, and are passionate about it, it actually makes sense to get the full experience. It's not too different from wanting to experience old music in vinyl rather than digital.
- MetaWhirledPeas 3y agoRight. These Checkmate folks seem to be doing it the right way, IMO. The housing matches the look of old CRTs while adding new capabilities, and the pricing is practical. I spent the better half of my youth trying to make CRTs look as crisp as what we take for granted with LCDs. I have no desire to go back to those days (and no desire to lug my 32" CRT up and down stair cases). So to all retro enthusiasts: let's celebrate those older systems but let's also appreciate what we have. Old systems have never looked better than they do on modern screens.
- cool_scatter 3y agoAs someone who does often play retro games on a CRT TV, this monitor wouldn't cut it either. Same reason I never understood those "retro consoles", even the official ones made by Nintendo/Sony. At the end of the day it's just a plastic shell made to look like the old thing around something new.
- ryancnelson 3y agoI would love it for some kickstarters to lean into what this product is actually selling: the retro design. Seriously: build this, but shaped like a Lear ADM-3A ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ADM-3A https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ADM-3A ) , and TAKE MY MONEY. ... or just introduce the set designers from "Loki" and "Starfield" to the supply people at Restoration Hardware. That's what I want in my nerdCave.
- bitwize 3y agoThere was a guy who helped his daughter build a computer in an ADM3A-styled case (except pink because preteen girl). https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PpshgGD0aac https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PpshgGD0aac I think the case is available on Thingiverse or similar. Go nuts and print your own!
- ryancnelson 3y agoawesome. nothing on thingiverse has ever search-matched for "ADM-3a" for me. cheers!
- kcb 3y agoDo they say what the resolution of the panel is? The main thing that would be interesting is if it was a super high res panel that could accommodate many lower resolutions cleanly with scaling. Like the Analog Pocket for example.
- manicennui 3y agoI think a lot of people might be missing this part: "Modular inputs - it’s also modular in the sense that we can add inputs (via cartridges we call 'pods') to add all old and new and future display inputs: RGB, composite, SCART, S-Video, RF, HDMI and everything else. Either we have a solution now or there’s one in the pipe for later."
- chongli 3y agoI appreciate that they’re trying to build something with the form (4:3) and input selection of a retro display. Unfortunately, most people interested in a CRT will not be interested in this. The whole reason to get a CRT is because you’re interested in the specific look of glowing phosphors as well as the extremely low latency of the raster scan which produces a responsiveness and fluidity for retro games (which were designed for these monitors) that is tough to match. There’s also the softness of CRTs which have an anti-aliasing effect that increases the perception of detail in retro games (by interpolating colours between adjacent pixels). This effect was really important for game designers because they were working with both very limited colour palettes and resolution (so both dithering and antialiasing were at a premium on the asset end).
- WithinReason 3y agoI don't know why people keep saying that CRTs have uniquely high responsiveness, a high refresh rate OLED display is going to leave a CRT in the dust. A 60 Hz CRT is going to take at least 1/60th of a second to draw a frame (16.66 ms), while a 240 Hz OLED will take 1/4 the time (pixel response times of OLEDs are less than a ms)
- chongli 3y agoThat's an oversimplification of the physics. CRT televisions have very low persistence phosphors. If you look at high-speed video of a CRT during a raster scan, the line is visible for far less time than the entire frame [1]. This technique relies on persistence of vision [2] to create the illusion of a complete frame. If you want to calculate the response time of a single dot on the phosphor, it is way down into the microseconds. I don't know enough about OLED displays to comment. I do know that LCDs don't even come close to the speed of CRTs at transitioning through high contrast images, the key to producing fast and responsive motion of sprites (which are high contrast against the background by design in most retro games). [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BJU2drrtCM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BJU2drrtCM [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persistence_of_vision https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persistence_of_vision
- dang 3y agoFundraisers and waiting lists aren't really on topic for HN. There's nothing wrong with them—they just don't fit the mandate of this site, which is intellectually curious conversation. For that, it's much better when the thing exists and is available, and then there's more interesting and specific information for discussion to get into. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sort=byDate&type=comment&query=curiosity%20optimiz%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...
- davisr 3y ago[flagged]
- RajT88 3y agoI hate that I want this.