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Pretty wild. I have fairly strong opinions on this subject. Neither of the parties (the girl selling and the guy buying) could ever justify it for me. I don’t t

Pretty wild. I have fairly strong opinions on this subject. Neither of the parties (the girl selling and the guy buying) could ever justify it for me. I don’t think it’s possible to go anywhere lower than this, both mentally and spiritually. You have one party sacrificing their morals while the other sacrifices their dignity. And there is no in between. Wow. I feel like this should be a far more talked about issue than it is. This article is a decent report and touches on the stupidity of it, but I will never ever cave to the “better life” and “i can buy a playstation” argument. Oh hell no. These people, especially guys, need serious mental help and guidance because this is not normal.

efields 3y ago
Those are strong opinions! We all await your definition of “normal” to reinforce your principled stance.
- skilled 3y ago
  They are in fact strong opinions. Normal people don’t take their clothe off to sell images of their vagina to people who are mentally unstable. Not sure how much more principled you want to go about it.
  - jrockway 3y ago
    Isn't this the same as what we all do, just more anonymous? Like, you can't pay for housing unless you show up to a place owned by someone with 3 yachts for 40 hours every week. While you're there, you can't listen to music or visit certain websites. If someone coughs on you and you get sick, too bad. You also can't use your brain for things work-related outside of work hours; all of your ideas are owned by the crazy yacht guy! If you want to work for some other yacht owner, then you have to take a day off of work and write code on a whiteboard in just the right way. All of this seems significantly more degrading than selling a naked picture of yourself. The OnlyFans models are selling their body, but you are selling your mind. That's what really makes you you! I don't really feel this bad about work, but at the end of the day, I don't consider myself engaged in a pursuit any more noble than selling my time to the highest bidder. I can see how parasocial relationships seem weird, and personally I have zero interest in them, but it's quite a stretch to brand anyone involved with one as "mentally unstable". What if they're stable and they want to spend their money on that instead of a $1500 phone, or a $60,000 truck, or a $200 dinner with their friends? I'm not sure any of us are all that mentally stable. Rather, we get by.
  - darig 3y ago
    [dead]
  - efields 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - molomo 3y ago
      [dead]
  - mcphage 3y ago
    > Normal people don’t take their clothe off to sell images of their vagina to people who are mentally unstable. “Normal” in what sense? In the sense of common, that’s true. But lots of careers are uncommon. In the sense of well-adjusted, I have trouble believing that’s true. Do you have some evidence or data or… I guess anything, really?
  - yieldcrv 3y ago
    This is an article about ghost writers? Is this copypasta you have prepared for any article about Onlyfans? because your responses dont seem to be about the profession or friction in the article at all
kredd 3y ago
Eh, if you acknowledge that person A and person B can have different morals, your argument doesn’t hold up.
debacle 3y ago
The problem is that politics very rapidly drives its way into the conversation, and discussions about mental health, what is healthy for society, etc get pushed aside. This model fundamentally changes the structure of human society, and the trend will likely accelerate, not decelerate, over the coming years. And yet the conversation usually immediately gets divided into the feminist camps and the conservative Christian/Muslim camps. I also think the trendiness of the phenomenon makes it seem more widespread than it is, however I've noticed a scary trend in the younger generation of general unsuitability to healthy relationships, and I just recently learned that a friend has an OnlyFans, so the phenomenon is becoming more widespread.
- sidlls 3y ago
  I'm dating a younger male right now, and "general unsuitability to healthy relationships" really rings true to an extent. His friends are more or less constantly bragging about how they "link up" with their friend's partners (without the friend knowing/consenting), lead people on, and so on. It's obviously not all younger people. I think that the rise of social media has affected this area of human interaction more than other areas, perhaps. The concepts of boundaries and respect are shifting. I think what is considered a "healthy relationship" is likely undergoing a significant shift. Maybe in a generation or two the "healthy relationships" will all be polyamorous ones, and monogamy will be considered the strange/unhealthy kind.
  - efields 3y ago
    I think it’s highly possible, even likely. But as a society it will be a struggle to adapt to these sorts of fundamental shift of assumptions of how things are “supposed to be.”
- meheleventyone 3y ago
  Isn’t the substance of politics exactly those discussions though? The reason there are camps is that there is a set of shared views on some issues. Whether along religious lines or otherwise.
- PaulHoule 3y ago
foobarian 3y ago
> because this is not normal. Have you thought that this actually could be normal, and that we the "wholesome" people are the outlier? That's what worries me :-)
- sidlls 3y ago
  It's predatory, really. The people paying for this are desperate for a relationship of some sort. The people selling are basically taking advantage of someone by what amounts to fraud.
Retric 3y ago
This is seriously tame and hardly an affront to anyone’s dignity. (Edit: For clarity these people are typing in a chat app pretending to be someone else not sharing pictures of themselves online.) I really don’t see the difference between this and being an Actor, social media intern, character at Disneyland, Mall Santa etc. An actual 3 year old may be fooled, but sometimes adults want to play pretend as well. You don’t think you were actually watching Frodo carry the burden of the one ring did you?
- skilled 3y ago
  I mean maybe you should experience firsthand what it would be like if someone in your family was involved in this? I do think that if you can’t think at least a few steps ahead of my point of view maybe you shouldn’t try and justify it on their behalf? I am not being hostile by the way, just saying it how it is. This is not some “I accidentally scraped your car” issue. Real people are making extremely unhealthy choices that lead to a lot of trauma and mental disorders. In the name of money (women) and false pleasure (men). None of these girls give a flying fuck of who these guys are. And according to this article, how could they?
  - Onlyfansss 3y ago
    [flagged]
  - Retric 3y ago
    Uhh, this is a guy or girl pretending to be a hot girl online. That’s some on thing millions of people do everyday for the lulz without being paid for it. I really don’t see why there would be any mental health issues involved?
    - lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 3y ago
      I believe they're making an allusion to the commonality of loneliness among many of today's young men. Such loneliness is likely only to be exacerbated by habits that are enabled by this work.
throwaway22032 3y ago
I honestly don't think your opinions are strong. The vast majority of people intuitively feel this way, they wouldn't willingly date a former prostitute or porn star, they'd be upset if their spouse or child were involved, etc. It's more of an interesting disaster to watch from a distance, like a car crash.
- kube-system 3y ago
  However, the criteria for mental illness isn't "it's unpopular".
  - throwaway22032 3y ago
    That primarily depends on whether you consider things like attachment disorders to be mental illnesses. So, more of a nomenclature thing than anything else. Like most Internet debates.
grpt 3y ago
I agree. Imagine if dating apps paid you to keep your profile active even if you have no interest in meeting anyone. They pay you $5/month per match with a minimum of 5 messages before ghosting. It keeps lonely men on the platform. For some people, OnlyFans chat is no different. There should be clear disclosures that there is potential the other account is outsourced to a different person, or a LLM. I'm having trouble finding it now, but I recall there being a rumor that the Bumble CEO was fired for permitting fake accounts to exist, so that usage appeared high. I think it had to do with allowing virtual phone numbers EDIT: Wow.... there are a lot people in this thread pushing back on the parent comment suggesting outsourced model chats are immoral, or not an ethical way to make a living.
- loveparade 3y ago
  > Imagine if dating apps paid you to keep your profile active even if you have no interest in meeting anyone. They pay you $5/month per match with a minimum of 5 messages before ghosting. It keeps lonely men on the platform. For some people, OnlyFans chat is no different. What many dating apps do is very close to this. They encourage fake female accounts to keep men on the platform, and what you are being shown is fake/inactive to a large extent. LLMs are the next step of this, I wouldn't be surprised if there are already tons of them. The dating app business is one of the most scammy businesses that exist. There are some exceptions to this (mostly specific local apps), but they are far and few between.
swader999 3y ago
Lower is the AI girlfriend, which I'm wondering why this hasn't already taken off for these types of chat scenarios.
Onlyfansss 3y ago
Interesting that you have such a strong opinion about something you apparently don't care for. I'm happy to tell you that i'm absolutly normal and have a high morals and ethics. There are people in our society who do not think that Sex, Erotic and the body are disgusting or weird or sick but something great. Apprechiating this through OnlyFans allows the person who provides the service to do so with their rules and the person who consumes it to feel enjoyment. I, for example like certain things. The girls/woman there provide it freely and get money for it. I think you are the problem, not OnlyFans, not me and not the girl taking the money. And as a site note: We as a society decided to allow every person to take part in our society even weird people, arrogant people, assholes etc. by paying for services. Like the person who MAKES you a Coffee for money. I actually think (i'm not trolling) that this is sick. Us using others to do things we can do ourselves just because we have the money to do so. If we wouldn't think its normal, the pressure for society to make people actually free through automisation would be much stronger. But no People need to work, what would happen otherwise if richer person couldn't get a service for convinience...
- grpt 3y ago
  very odd comment, and from a brand new account. Makes me wonder what your motivations are. You didn't address anything in the parent comment. You seem to be responding to onlyfans in general, not the fraudulent usage of the chat feature the parent comment is addressing.
  - Onlyfansss 3y ago
    Whats odd about it? Do you think its normal in our society to state publicly that you think onlyfans is okay/good? Of course not. We are not a open society. And he clearly doesn't reference the article with the hook 'problem', he keeps it generic: "(the girl selling and the guy buying)" Onlyfans is obvously satisfying a fantasy. This has very little to do with real life. And when you actually buy a private video, its not some dude pretending to chat in the name of the woman, its the woman making that video.
    - grpt 3y ago
ck425 3y ago
You're overlooking the long history of sex work in most human civilizations. Fair enough if you morally disagree with it and wish it didn't exist but it's existent and the existence of people who provide and consume it is about as normal as it gets. If you accept that sex work will always exist in some capacity then there are reasonable arguments that the existence of OnlyFans is a good thing, as the OnlyFans model of sex work is in many ways much better than traditional models for both the sex workers and the consumers. There are of course arguments against that too, but saying sex work is fundamentally immoral and thus OnlyFans should be stopped is naive and more importantly unhelpful when it comes to reducing the potential harm sex work can cause.
- letmevoteplease 3y ago
  I wouldn't say that sex work is fundamentally immoral, but using deception to manipulate people into giving you money is hard to defend. Of course this occurs in many other industries, too.

efields 3y ago

Those are strong opinions! We all await your definition of “normal” to reinforce your principled stance.

skilled 3y ago
They are in fact strong opinions. Normal people don’t take their clothe off to sell images of their vagina to people who are mentally unstable. Not sure how much more principled you want to go about it.
- jrockway 3y ago
  Isn't this the same as what we all do, just more anonymous? Like, you can't pay for housing unless you show up to a place owned by someone with 3 yachts for 40 hours every week. While you're there, you can't listen to music or visit certain websites. If someone coughs on you and you get sick, too bad. You also can't use your brain for things work-related outside of work hours; all of your ideas are owned by the crazy yacht guy! If you want to work for some other yacht owner, then you have to take a day off of work and write code on a whiteboard in just the right way. All of this seems significantly more degrading than selling a naked picture of yourself. The OnlyFans models are selling their body, but you are selling your mind. That's what really makes you you! I don't really feel this bad about work, but at the end of the day, I don't consider myself engaged in a pursuit any more noble than selling my time to the highest bidder. I can see how parasocial relationships seem weird, and personally I have zero interest in them, but it's quite a stretch to brand anyone involved with one as "mentally unstable". What if they're stable and they want to spend their money on that instead of a $1500 phone, or a $60,000 truck, or a $200 dinner with their friends? I'm not sure any of us are all that mentally stable. Rather, we get by.
- darig 3y ago
  [dead]
- efields 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - molomo 3y ago
    [dead]
- mcphage 3y ago
  > Normal people don’t take their clothe off to sell images of their vagina to people who are mentally unstable. “Normal” in what sense? In the sense of common, that’s true. But lots of careers are uncommon. In the sense of well-adjusted, I have trouble believing that’s true. Do you have some evidence or data or… I guess anything, really?
- yieldcrv 3y ago
  This is an article about ghost writers? Is this copypasta you have prepared for any article about Onlyfans? because your responses dont seem to be about the profession or friction in the article at all

kredd 3y ago

Eh, if you acknowledge that person A and person B can have different morals, your argument doesn’t hold up.

debacle 3y ago

The problem is that politics very rapidly drives its way into the conversation, and discussions about mental health, what is healthy for society, etc get pushed aside. This model fundamentally changes the structure of human society, and the trend will likely accelerate, not decelerate, over the coming years. And yet the conversation usually immediately gets divided into the feminist camps and the conservative Christian/Muslim camps. I also think the trendiness of the phenomenon makes it seem more widespread than it is, however I've noticed a scary trend in the younger generation of general unsuitability to healthy relationships, and I just recently learned that a friend has an OnlyFans, so the phenomenon is becoming more widespread.

sidlls 3y ago
I'm dating a younger male right now, and "general unsuitability to healthy relationships" really rings true to an extent. His friends are more or less constantly bragging about how they "link up" with their friend's partners (without the friend knowing/consenting), lead people on, and so on. It's obviously not all younger people. I think that the rise of social media has affected this area of human interaction more than other areas, perhaps. The concepts of boundaries and respect are shifting. I think what is considered a "healthy relationship" is likely undergoing a significant shift. Maybe in a generation or two the "healthy relationships" will all be polyamorous ones, and monogamy will be considered the strange/unhealthy kind.
- efields 3y ago
  I think it’s highly possible, even likely. But as a society it will be a struggle to adapt to these sorts of fundamental shift of assumptions of how things are “supposed to be.”
meheleventyone 3y ago
Isn’t the substance of politics exactly those discussions though? The reason there are camps is that there is a set of shared views on some issues. Whether along religious lines or otherwise.
PaulHoule 3y ago

foobarian 3y ago

> because this is not normal. Have you thought that this actually could be normal, and that we the "wholesome" people are the outlier? That's what worries me :-)

sidlls 3y ago
It's predatory, really. The people paying for this are desperate for a relationship of some sort. The people selling are basically taking advantage of someone by what amounts to fraud.

Retric 3y ago

This is seriously tame and hardly an affront to anyone’s dignity. (Edit: For clarity these people are typing in a chat app pretending to be someone else not sharing pictures of themselves online.) I really don’t see the difference between this and being an Actor, social media intern, character at Disneyland, Mall Santa etc. An actual 3 year old may be fooled, but sometimes adults want to play pretend as well. You don’t think you were actually watching Frodo carry the burden of the one ring did you?

skilled 3y ago
I mean maybe you should experience firsthand what it would be like if someone in your family was involved in this? I do think that if you can’t think at least a few steps ahead of my point of view maybe you shouldn’t try and justify it on their behalf? I am not being hostile by the way, just saying it how it is. This is not some “I accidentally scraped your car” issue. Real people are making extremely unhealthy choices that lead to a lot of trauma and mental disorders. In the name of money (women) and false pleasure (men). None of these girls give a flying fuck of who these guys are. And according to this article, how could they?
- Onlyfansss 3y ago
  [flagged]
- Retric 3y ago
  Uhh, this is a guy or girl pretending to be a hot girl online. That’s some on thing millions of people do everyday for the lulz without being paid for it. I really don’t see why there would be any mental health issues involved?
  - lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 3y ago
    I believe they're making an allusion to the commonality of loneliness among many of today's young men. Such loneliness is likely only to be exacerbated by habits that are enabled by this work.

throwaway22032 3y ago

I honestly don't think your opinions are strong. The vast majority of people intuitively feel this way, they wouldn't willingly date a former prostitute or porn star, they'd be upset if their spouse or child were involved, etc. It's more of an interesting disaster to watch from a distance, like a car crash.

kube-system 3y ago
However, the criteria for mental illness isn't "it's unpopular".
- throwaway22032 3y ago
  That primarily depends on whether you consider things like attachment disorders to be mental illnesses. So, more of a nomenclature thing than anything else. Like most Internet debates.

grpt 3y ago

I agree. Imagine if dating apps paid you to keep your profile active even if you have no interest in meeting anyone. They pay you $5/month per match with a minimum of 5 messages before ghosting. It keeps lonely men on the platform. For some people, OnlyFans chat is no different. There should be clear disclosures that there is potential the other account is outsourced to a different person, or a LLM. I'm having trouble finding it now, but I recall there being a rumor that the Bumble CEO was fired for permitting fake accounts to exist, so that usage appeared high. I think it had to do with allowing virtual phone numbers EDIT: Wow.... there are a lot people in this thread pushing back on the parent comment suggesting outsourced model chats are immoral, or not an ethical way to make a living.

loveparade 3y ago
> Imagine if dating apps paid you to keep your profile active even if you have no interest in meeting anyone. They pay you $5/month per match with a minimum of 5 messages before ghosting. It keeps lonely men on the platform. For some people, OnlyFans chat is no different. What many dating apps do is very close to this. They encourage fake female accounts to keep men on the platform, and what you are being shown is fake/inactive to a large extent. LLMs are the next step of this, I wouldn't be surprised if there are already tons of them. The dating app business is one of the most scammy businesses that exist. There are some exceptions to this (mostly specific local apps), but they are far and few between.

swader999 3y ago

Lower is the AI girlfriend, which I'm wondering why this hasn't already taken off for these types of chat scenarios.

Onlyfansss 3y ago

Interesting that you have such a strong opinion about something you apparently don't care for. I'm happy to tell you that i'm absolutly normal and have a high morals and ethics. There are people in our society who do not think that Sex, Erotic and the body are disgusting or weird or sick but something great. Apprechiating this through OnlyFans allows the person who provides the service to do so with their rules and the person who consumes it to feel enjoyment. I, for example like certain things. The girls/woman there provide it freely and get money for it. I think you are the problem, not OnlyFans, not me and not the girl taking the money. And as a site note: We as a society decided to allow every person to take part in our society even weird people, arrogant people, assholes etc. by paying for services. Like the person who MAKES you a Coffee for money. I actually think (i'm not trolling) that this is sick. Us using others to do things we can do ourselves just because we have the money to do so. If we wouldn't think its normal, the pressure for society to make people actually free through automisation would be much stronger. But no People need to work, what would happen otherwise if richer person couldn't get a service for convinience...

grpt 3y ago
very odd comment, and from a brand new account. Makes me wonder what your motivations are. You didn't address anything in the parent comment. You seem to be responding to onlyfans in general, not the fraudulent usage of the chat feature the parent comment is addressing.
- Onlyfansss 3y ago
  Whats odd about it? Do you think its normal in our society to state publicly that you think onlyfans is okay/good? Of course not. We are not a open society. And he clearly doesn't reference the article with the hook 'problem', he keeps it generic: "(the girl selling and the guy buying)" Onlyfans is obvously satisfying a fantasy. This has very little to do with real life. And when you actually buy a private video, its not some dude pretending to chat in the name of the woman, its the woman making that video.
  - grpt 3y ago

ck425 3y ago

You're overlooking the long history of sex work in most human civilizations. Fair enough if you morally disagree with it and wish it didn't exist but it's existent and the existence of people who provide and consume it is about as normal as it gets. If you accept that sex work will always exist in some capacity then there are reasonable arguments that the existence of OnlyFans is a good thing, as the OnlyFans model of sex work is in many ways much better than traditional models for both the sex workers and the consumers. There are of course arguments against that too, but saying sex work is fundamentally immoral and thus OnlyFans should be stopped is naive and more importantly unhelpful when it comes to reducing the potential harm sex work can cause.

letmevoteplease 3y ago
I wouldn't say that sex work is fundamentally immoral, but using deception to manipulate people into giving you money is hard to defend. Of course this occurs in many other industries, too.